To be constantly surprised that people 'don't drive'?

[MissEloiseBridgerton]

Every day on here, and on my own social media, I am shocked that soooo many people don't drive. My local FB group is constantly people asking for favours because they don't drive, they want a dump run, or someone to deliver second hand stuff to them. On here, the barriers to work, to childcare, to anything is so often that they don't drive!

For me growing up, learning to drive was just what you did. I don't have any friends who didn't learn to drive at 17. Most had cheap runarounds or borrowed parents car.

I totally understand it's expensive and costly to run a car but I don't think I realised how many people never learned!

I understand where you’re coming from, it’s frustrating when people take things for granted - not all of us had those experiences and were forced to grow up beyond our years.

I hope your life is full of fun, and that you have more freedom, now.

Even if you did have the money/parental support for learning to drive, there's plenty of 17 year olds it just wasn't/isn't going to be a priority for. At 17 I was laser focused on going to University, getting the hell out of dodge, and every single penny of my job money went towards that.

And I always side eye the people who grew up rurally who claim that "absolutely everyone" learnt to drive at 17. Unless you grew up in Jilly Cooper's Rutminster, I guarantee you there were kids not learning to drive. (I grew up in This Country, so I know of what I speak).

Even the "what we did growing up" bit annoys me.

I wish I was still considered to be "growing up" at 17. I should have been. But I was forced into adulthood long before the ripe age of 17. It took me a long time to realise that 17 year olds are actually still children because I certainly wasn't treated like one. At 17, I don't think anyone had even made me a meal for years, never mind paid for my driving lessons. Ha! It wasn't even on my radar, nor anyone else's

I will stop going on about it now but it really gets under my skin when people don't recognise their privilege.

Lots of comments about being privileged on here

The real privilege is living in an area where there is effective, cost effect, plentiful and reliable public transport that acutally goes where you need and that you are close to the doctors, hospital, shops, entertainment, friends and family, work etc.

Is it really a privilege though? Or have we been conditioned to accept crap public transport outside of major cities, through this “chicken or egg?” scenario where people with cars shrug and say it doesn’t matter about public transport because you can just get a car, while others then have to get a car because of ineffective public transport?

I suppose you could say it’s a privilege to be born in an area with good public transport, in the sense that you had no control over it, but if you’re an adult choosing where you live, I’m not sure “privilege” comes into it. It’s just sensible planning. No one forces people who live in areas poorly served by public transport. The people saying “I have no choice other than to drive, as where I live there is one bus a month” actually DO have a choice - they could relocate. Presumably they don’t because they’ve decided they would prefer to drive. That’s fine; entirely their choice. But it wasn’t some happy accident that I live somewhere where I don’t need to drive.

Can you really not comprehend that other people may have lacked the opportunities you had, or that there are other factors..

• parents did not facilitate driving - my mum had no licence, no car, as a result of drink driving and a 2 year ban. Following the return of her licence she could not afford to add me to insurance and pay for lessons, nor could I.
• cost of running a car
• cost of purchasing a car
• health conditions - by the time I was in a position to pay for my own lessons and buy a car and run a car, my health meant I was not allowed to drive!

My sister does drive, because my Dad taught her, paid for lessons, bought her a motorbike, paid for the CBT, bought her a bigger bike. Paid for car lessons. Bought her a car, continues to partially fund her cars now she's in her 40s.

I did not live with him, therefore did not have these opportunities (and as I say, haven't legally been allowed to drive for the last 15 years anyway).

My husband was once told he lacks ambition and independence because he doesn’t drive.

The person who told him that had lived their entire life in the same small town, live on the road next to her parents as anything else was too far away, never even moved away for uni, never been abroad with friends etc. While he has emigrated twice, has a good professional career, travels (when time off work allows) and doesn’t live close enough to his parents to use a cup and string phone. But yeah, lacks ambition and independence.

The issue is surely people asking for lifts, favours etc because they don't drive, not simply that they don't or can't drive.

I can drive but don't. My daughter nearby has a car which I could drive as I'm insured, but I just don't. I've forgotten about life with a car.

But I never ask for lifts or trips to the tip or shops.

@Simonjt I'd bet the farm that the person who told him that was a MNetter!

I drive just fine now op but for the first 8 years after passing my test I was crippled with driving anxiety and suffered terribly from panic attacks and got into really bad states over driving. It was horrible and I hated it. I am proud to say I overcame it last year and now am completely ok with driving but I guess in those 8 years you would've thought less of me. Perhaps you should have a bit more understanding and empathy, not everyone can just crack it at 17 and get on with it, for some people it is harder through no fault of their own.

If I were in charge of the world I'd make sure that everyone had access to public transport and make "having" to drive the exception. Actually I'd get rid of private cars altogether but that would mean transforming our sacred way of life wouldn't it.

@Scaredandalonepls I do not appreciate your rudeness, your insults and patronising tone.

You do not insult people personally - you respond to the post and the points in it.

My point was clearly made and relevant to the discussion.

Yours was not.

I hope you don't work anywhere that requires numeracy if you think that you were really poor when you could afford to own, tax, insure, MOT, repair and fuel a car as well as cover all of your bills and physical needs.

Income 1100 (my takehome in 2012)
Rent 624 (accessible properties attract higher rent)
Council Tax 79 (as above)
Gas 38
Electricity 45
Water 30
Travel (bus) 60 (75 on a five week month)

Phone 14 (needed to apply for other jobs)
Insurance 12 (high crime area, would have been stupid not to)
Prescriptions 10 (approximate, didn't fill them most of the time)

£88 left for food, washing powder, clothes for work, home repairs, everything else for up to five weeks at a time.

So where exactly would I or anybody else be finding the money for driving lessons (£40/h, two hour lessons the only ones available), theory test, actual test, a car, tax, insurance in a high crime and accident risk urban area & a parking permit (£129+£40 registration fee)? These days, the costs are far higher and there's a LEZ to deal with for people having to pay £1500 for a room.

(And surprisingly, it's rather difficult to move if you can't pass affordability checks to get somewhere else because you're actually poor and not just comfortable enough to manage bills, food and have spare to spend on a vehicle and costs of ownership).

Being constantly surprised people live differently, some by choice and some because they don't have the option, is unreasonable.

Some people feel safer driving or it's very essential where they are & how they live. Others don't or can't.

I have merrily walked hours home at night for my own preferences, even when I lived in parts of the US that are very much not pedestrian friendly, because I feel 100x safer walking than I do driving or on my own in a taxi. This means that as much as I can, I plan my life accordingly. Yes that has restrictions, but I see that as part of my choice. I'm restricted by the time to walk or take the bus, just like the people who drive to my work place are restricted by the carpark rules where even working there 10 years gets you maybe 2-3 days a week, otherwise they're spending at least a fiver a day to park at least 20 minutes away.

I grew up where learning to drive is just what you did, starting at 15 in that part of the US. It never felt like freedom or adult to me, possibly because it does happen so young. I did the lessons, could do it fine, but absolutely hated it so stopped and never tested. I eventually figured out why I didn't feels safe in cars, especially as a driver, now I just don't care to use them. Having built a life that doesn't need driving, I'm not really in an area that's car friendly.

17% of population live in rural areas and 83% live in towns, cities & suburbs

yet on men it always seems 90% live in rural areas, that’s not a reflection of the general population

Fascinating. I can't drive because of a heart issue.

When I moved to Cornwall from London to be with my (still) DH and wanted to maintain my professional life, driving became essential. There was no other way to get to Exeter to catch the train to be in London for an early meeting. At the time, I had a big client in Hayes that liked to meet at 0800, and the only way to get there was to get up at 0300, shower, dress and drive the 220 miles. I then drove back and had turned around the work required by 1700. It would not have been possible without a car.

Non drivers always say they don’t ask for lifts

But they are always getting ferried around

Well even if that were true, as long as you are not doing the ferrying around why would that bother you?

I am 🙈🙈

Cos they guilt you into it

Well stop doing it! Don't blame the rest of us non-drivers for your inability to say no.

Lucky those poor, put-upon drivers have you to stick up for them, then.

Thank you #freethedrivers

People will only take what you allow them to. Implement some boundaries and don't allow yourself to be guilted.

But then they’re all sad and cold and far away from where they need to be

That would be a real problem for women.

Would a woman rather walk home on a dark night or get in her own car in a well lit car park? Or, come to that, get a bus with a bunch of rowdy (male) teens? And don't suggest Uber. Uber is problematic for so many reasons.

Being able to drive is a safety thing for women as well. There is so much I wouldn't do if I couldn't drive. And so much my son would have missed out on if neither DH nor me could drive.