To think the call back into the office is an example of the patriarchy very much alive and well?

[Yestttlo]

And anyone who thinks otherwise is either brainwashed by the patriarchy or isn’t a mother with a huge proportion of child related responsibility on her shoulders? (Or someone who is in a job where they can’t work from home so don’t want to support other women having the right to).

I have worked from home since covid. Been in the office eight times where it was necessary, for instance a company away day or face to face client meeting. I have a young dc and the call back to the office will damage my career progression due to time spent travelling which means I can’t be online longer and because I will be stretched to get household stuff done .. no I don’t mean I clean the toilets during work hours but that I can put a wash on first thing and know I can unload it at lunch, or get cooking done for the evening during my lunch break which means my evening is not chaotic and I can actually rest a little before starting in full force again the next day.

I will be fighting it to the very end. I will make my views clear. I strongly believe that forcing people into offices hugely disproportionately affects women. My work can be done anywhere. Forcing back into offices is a neon sign that the patriarchy is alive and well. Thoughts?

The patriarchy will screw you over either way though. You're not as visible WFH and eventually that's going to mean you don't get xyz opportunity or someone mentioning a promotion you could go for.

I think the big risk of hybrid working is it creates an invisible workforce that everyone in the office forget exists. WFH works as long as everyone is doing it so everyone's making the effort to maintain relationships remotely etc.

I think going back to the office is really important in many cases. Until recently it was the norm. Most people didn't have a major problem with it because there was no other option. I think people are becoming antisocial and seem to think only positive interactions with the outside world is tolerable. I think living in such an isolated way is highly detrimental to mental health. Some people have convinced themselves that wfh is great for mental health but I think it is certainly not cut and dried.

I agree and I've gone self employed as a result of them revoking WFH with a massive pay cut.

Interesting that my old employer has hardly any women over 40 out of around 500 staff.

IMO corporate culture is pretty anti-family full stop - and this mainly falls on women in reality.

I work full time, hybrid 2 days in and 2 days wfh currently. I'm also a single parent.

I simply don't have time to ponder the patriarchy in between it all. If you're not happy then maybe look for another job.

Getting to the point where childcare responsibilities are actually celebrated and honoured is the step that’s needed, not forcing women into a corner again

WFH shouldn't be a form of childcare though.

Yeah, yeah. Some folks are skivers but the majority of WFHs are conscientious and actually put in more than their contracted hours because they aren’t wasting their lives on unnecessary commutes. Prove me wrong.

@Yestttlo Can I be assumptious and assume your children were born during or post lock down?

OP here on a quest to bring down UK PLC GDP one mid day washload and leisurely home lunch at a time. It's time to put your big girl pants on and get back to the office OP. You don't have a choice and it's time to stop your duvet day existence at home. Your country needs you.

Winning hearts and minds is never effective when one resorts to huffing and insults.

@iamnotalemon intentionally missing the point. Wfh removes the stress involved in pick up with extra travel etc etc as I assume you know

It is absolutely the patriarchy forcing the return to the office. It’s the senior men in their late 50s/60s (and it is the case that most senior roles are held by men) because many women who would have been in those roles were driven out when they had kids - the motherhood penalty.

Return to the office suits those men - the whole system we work within was designed in an era when men were the breadwinners and their wives supported their careers and many of the older men still have that system at home.

I support working from home across the board, not just for mothers, but for fathers too. I have the choice to do what I want and I chose to work in the office most of the time because it suits me, but my dh works from home 80% of the time because that’s what suits him. We have similarly demandigg no jobs and each do roughly 50/50 of the childcare and household stuff depending on who is busier at any point in time.

@Itsalwaysfools true 😂😂

What bullshit. Most histories of feminism will tell you that a, or even THE, main method of patriarchy was confining women to the home, while making public life the sole sphere of men. This is still the case in many countries in the world today. Fighting the patriarchy involves claiming our right to be out there in the public sphere, not claiming that we should be stuck alone at home because it’s easier to do the laundry, FFS.

You sound like a delight.

It's not just childcare though is it? It's avoiding a big commute on top of juggling everything else.

WFH is great with older kids who don't need babysitting but are too old to leave alone.

Not in my case. My workplace has always been on site every day, apart from during lockdown - as soon as it was allowed we were back on site as usual (our jobs could be done completely remotely). They are now implementing a hybrid model, and the only person who fought it tooth and nail was the female CEO. She, and the others at exec level, can wfh whenever they please, but she didn't want anyone else doing so. Apparently the board had to say that since she had no valid argument apart from "I don't want them to have the option", the policy would be implemented soon as everyone else is very much for it.

Well absolutely, but while we’re living in the current world, are you wanting women to sacrifice their options for ideals?

employers are the patriarchy. Wake up a bit.

Nah, not in my book

Patriarchy is assuming the women does more than an equal amount of the household chores and childcare, often while blaming something other than the person not doing their share.

See, fixed that for you.

Well said.

This absolutely.

@Ossoduro2 you’ve summed it up better than me

This.

I don't feel this is a patriarchy thing. It's in most cases a "need to know my staff are doing some work" things.

My DP wfh. I can't in my job. He does manage to put a wash on and run the hoover round. I don't know what the patriarchy would make of that.

This.

And there is evidence that WFH is harming young women's careers.
Hybrid works best I think.

You sound absolutely ridiculous and very entitled. Why not make your lazy husband do some more chores and childcare if you're so concerned about the 'patriarchy'?