To be horrified at how much worse the "grooming gangs" actually were than I thought

[OneAmberFinch]

There are several other threads about Elon Musk, Labour, Jess Phillips, etc.

I don't want to discuss them in this thread. The other threads keep getting derailed and I just want a place to discuss how absolutely horrifying the new details that emerged this week are.

I knew that there were "grooming gangs" who would entice girls in care or from broken homes to be their "boyfriends" by giving them cigarettes and vapes, for example.

I didn't know that girls as young as 11 were being brutally tortured and raped, that people had been killed over it, including one policeman who arranged for some of the rapists to get off, houses burnt down. I didn't know the details of the violent gang rapes which I won't repeat here but you can find on X.

I'm just genuinely shocked and horrified.

Some of the court transcripts circulating are from 2013. How did I not know?

We know why you re doing this, its about discrediting Labour, you don't give a fuck about children.

Labour voters believing the absolute worst of everyone else is nothing new but I wonder how old you are, this is a rather childish and petulant statement to make. Do you really think that the rape and torture of thousands of children is only of interest if it can be used as a political football?

Playing Politics with the lives of children

Says the poster whose main concern is protecting the reputation of a political party.

As another poster has already pointed out this has been going on for 40 years, there's plenty of blame to go around.

It’s bollocks, it’s a way for an individual to gain influence as a go between nothing more and nothing less. They get involved in stuff as a “fixer” negotiating between parties. Wtf does it have to do with them? The police should speak directly to the accused.

There was a story about a local councillor who had to run interference to get his own fucking cousin to hand a child back. They were negotiating at a petrol station. What the police should have done is taken the guys license number and address, bashed down the door to his place, gone to see his mum and made a big noise when they pulled up outside her house, put an alert out on his car to be stopped. Why are you fucking negotiating!?

Well said

Anyone trying to make this about the labour government needs to give their head a wobble.
Let's ignore the vast underfunding to social services.. to all public services. Let's just pretend the labour government made the police so woke that they ignored the crimes of Muslim men. The police.. an institution known of course for its love of non white communities and it's adherence to far left values... the police..
🤣

Of course it does , that’s undeniable but to say it is always men and NEVER women is just not true and that narrative could cause a child to not report abuse or be believed if their abuser is a woman.

If you're here trying to discredit the OP and all those who agree with her, just note that you are in a minority. 87% of people on this thread are horrified by what has been uncovered, and that number would be higher in the general public, given this is a left-leaning forum. Who knew that most of the population are such far-right racist bigots?

I certainly am one in that case. I never realised!

@FOJN and playing semantics over the volume of girls attacked.

1 girl is one girl too many.

It is more likely that a woman would end up in jail for abuse than a man. They get pretty free reign hence the issue in the first place.

How predictable for someone to post this. I guess the council officers who failed to do their jobs said the same thing. There is something systematic, calculated and deeply sinister about the abuse of these gangs. The perpetrators are largely male, from particular ethnic groups that have troubling cultural practices and attitudes to women, children and sexual relationships. Why does that causes PP to be sarcastic? Children have been denied justice and protection, the police have been corrupt and negligent, safeguarding broke down for reasons to do with cultural sensitivity and fears of racism. The details of what some of the girls went through are sickening.

@Thatcastlethere @Chipsahoy

totally agree with it being culture, rather than religion.

and I recognise the hatred aimed at young girls. I, too am from a middle class, educated background- like most of my friends at the time. We still had people looking at us like we were dirt in our small, socially conservative town for showing too much leg, wearing make up and laughing with friends.

and that was mostly from stuck up, snobby older women.

female sexuality gets policed by everyone

But religion is highly relevant in this case as it relates to how the paedophile selects a victim.

Well plod has been pretty fucking quick to adopt the trans cause but since most trans activism is profoundly misogynistic that should be no surprise. They do like non-hate hate crimes too. So much easier to intimidate someone on their doorstep at the weekend rather than the heavy lifting required to investigate and stop an Asian grooming/ trafficking/ pimping gang.

Indeed. I just came across this on X, and I can't describe how angry it makes me feel.

I’m not talking about this as a particular case. Of course, many paedophiles will use institutions like the church to perpetrate abuse. But it’s nothing to do with religion.

and no religion makes people thinks it’s ok to abuse anyone. If these abuser were good catholics or good Muslims, they’d be keeping their dicks in their trousers and only having sex with their wives.

i was responding to the general comment about culture. The perpetrator is irrelevant really- it’s the way society responds that is what allows it to continue. If you’re surrounded by a bunch of woman haters and misogynists, you are less likely to be believed and more likely to be blamed.

Yeah wasn't that the case where his accuser was convicted of perverting the course of justice - said he made it up I think. I believe he died not knowing this and the police had to apologise to his widow.

But in this case (which after all is what we are all talking about) the perpetrators selected their victims on the basis they were NOT Muslims (so they could be Christian, Hindu, Sikh) and therefore able to be abused as they were considering dirty. So religion is a very important factor. I'd say an aggravating factor. I thought that sort of ethnic/religious identity was a protected characteristic these days..oh hang on...that doesn't apply to white Christians. Apologies.

I read that at one point 1 in 73 Pakistani men in rotherham had a conviction for sex offences. There is clearly a problem within the Pakistani community, I mean these peoples families came to court and harrassed the victims. There was zero shame. I remember listening to a radio interview on the bbc asian network channel. A young woman who knew some of the abusers was horrified and said that all the families she knew were blaming the children for enticing the men.
We can see from the treatment of the girls by all the white people around them that this attitude was also present there. But to pretend that this isn’t a problem of culture is being disingenuous.

I posted previously about Matthew Syeds article on cousin marriage. He spoke to a worker at biobank (they collect and analyse genetic data in the UK) who found that the rates of children born from incest (as in a child fathered by their own maternal uncle or maternal grandfather not cousin marriage) was substantially higher than the “norm”. The guy refused to talk about it and the information wasn’t written up because no-one wanted to touch it. It means that that there are rapes of women by their fathers and brothers that are being hushed up. And literally no-one cares NO-ONE. Even people who know its wrong don’t want to touch it because they think they will be hounded for speaking about it. Syed is no reactionary, he’s a very sensible, rational, thoughtful considered man. He’s not making it up. Women are literally being raped by their fathers and brothers and having to carry the child that is conceived by that rape and not one fucker cares.

There is a cultural problem here. Ignoring it also means we ignore the Pakistani women being abused.

“But I quickly discovered that researchers wouldn’t return emails or calls. When I got through to one geneticist, he said: “I can’t go there.” It was like hitting a succession of ever-higher brick walls. I then came across evidence that scientists examining the UK Biobank had found that levels of incest (father-daughter, siblings etc) were significantly higher in the British Pakistani community than the wider population. This was a disturbing finding, possibly indicating abuse of a shocking kind. But the paper was never published, disappearing into what I can only describe as an Orwellian memory hole. When I approached the researchers, they were not prepared to talk on the record. One said that he feared he might not be able to bring up his children if he whispered the truth and lost his job as a result. It was like something out of Kafka.“

In an effort to anti-racist people are willing to throw a whole heap of women and girls from different ethnicities under the bus.

Legally it is aggravated if you can prove racial or religious hatred as motivation.

An angle that was not considered on prosecution but should have been?

These disgusting men were just products of a highly misogynistic society both in terms of immediate religions which met its match with a misogynistic police force and councils. Combine that with a lot young children who were deprived or easily manipulated and you can see this happen again and again.

I don’t blame one party or the other. It’s all on hatred of women and punishing them. No political party will ever convince me that they care unless they put serious money and serious penalties in place for sex offending and stop the overall pretence that men and women present an equal risk. They don’t.

sorry to be blunt, but you are completely wrong about this.

no where in Islam ( or any other religion) does it say that you can sexually abuse or even be sexual with someone from another religion and it’s ok.

these abusers use religion to justify their abhorrent actions. Do you think they are going home and treating their Muslim female relatives like queens ? They tend to be abusive at home too.

also - they are choosing these girls because they are accessible. Not because they are white, or a different religion

There were muslim victims too, they need to be acknowledged as well.

This. The failure is part of ensuring that multiculturalism is seen as successful and positive. As the poster above notes, police forces all over Europe have masked the ethnicity of the perpetrators of certain violent sexual offices against women and children. It is deliberate. We weren’t consulted on effectively open borders and they certainly aren’t going to let the electorate know of certain unintended consequences
of mass migration.

You sure about that? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_views_on_concubinage#:~:text=The%20verses%20of%20the%20Quran,25%2C%2024%3A30).

Those of us that did know were silenced. Even if we found out after the case was heard.
News and Media outlets were told to shut up.
There are LOADS of things about crimes that are deemed too sensitive for the public’s ears and those facts are kept out of circulation with an exchange of brown envelopes.

I see on EM twitter he has reposted a tweet asking for people to write to their MPs calling for a vote of no confidence in government on the back of this scandal.