Tired of the performative beggars and alcoholics this time of year

[Onand]

Is anyone else sick and tired of the huge number of ‘homeless’ beggars, alcoholics and addicts that descended on the streets since the Christmas rush started this year?

Manchester is rife with them- this year there is a particularly ropey bunch of alcoholics/ addicts that are obnoxiously ‘sleeping’ or sitting with their bags pointing directly out into the street instead of being against a wall, they’re building ‘dens’ in shop doorways which stink of human faeces and piss, dealers go from spot to spot, dogs forced to sit in uncomfortable situations (often not even their dog as the same one gets passed from beggar to beggar).

It’s a self perpetuating problem because soup kitchens serving buffets set up and cater meals for them whilst they’re generally being a nuisance and making the streets look an absolute shitty mess. Why are they tolerated? People need to stop giving them money as it just encourages them to keep doing it when there are services in place to help them.

Bah humbug I know, but It’s beyond grim.

When I lived in Edinburgh the beggars worked shifts outside the local 24 hour store. A car would pull up and they’d switch. All the paraphernalia stayed so sleeping bag over the legs, blanket round the shoulders sign and cup. I stopped giving after witnessing a changeover but it was a busy spot so I’m sure they still made lots.

I literally do not recognise the London you purport to describe

I think OP is using the term 'genuine homeless' in the same vein as the 'deserving poor'.

I'm here to find out what performatively 'sleeping' means.

Eh?

I suspect the 6 year old understands it a bit better than some of the posters on this thread...

Neurodiversity can be a factor too, people with ADHD can have addictive personalities. Addiction is very complicated. I have addicts in my family in contrast to incredibly successful family members, all with a fairly typical middle class background.

🥱

I guess it's better that the cash is obtained through shoplifting and burglary and mugging. Let's face it, an addict t will feed their addiction whether a passer by gives money or not

Yeah we have two who've appeared in our small town last week and set up camp in the high street. Reported to a homeless charity who sent someone to offer support and they refused help.

its the dogs that kill you??

I think Manchester City centre has a terrible problem with homelessness, but not quite in the way you say. I've seen the large tent camps near the railway lines. I think it's one of the few places where I've seen homeless people so desperate that they have approached diners, in restaurants and coffee shops, to ask for money.

When the heading referred to 'performative' beggars, I thought it meant like they were putting on a Christmas pantomime or playing the harmonica

It's inevitable that when there is money or good made available,there will be people who are taking advantage, and if it's lucrative enough they will take advantage systematically and in numbers. And there are places where begging can make good money.

Christmas time tends to have a lot of extra money and such made available for those in need, so inevitably people like that come out. I used to volunteer for an organization in a major city that gives out Christmas meals and gifts, and they were part of a network of such organizations, part of the purpose being to make sure people were not getting 5 differernt meals and sets of gifts which people certainly tried to do.

I work in a small town now where the main Christmas charitable group don't have those kinds of resources, and people do take advantage.

It can be hard for people not to become cynical, including people who work with such populations. It's a reason some people burn out after a few years. You have to be able to manage some complicated feelings and the people who are the most "be kind" often aren't the ones who keep doing that kind of work IME.

Personally, I get most frustrated by the people who totally buy into the disease model of addiction and want to totally absolve addicts of all personal responsibility. It's not true for one thing, as anyone who has to deal personally with an addict knows, but it's also not doing them any favours; the only path out of addiction is to accept responsibility for their lives and how they affect others in their lives. Remaining in addiction means death, sudden or in increments. And ultimately I just don't see enabling that that as being a "kinder" attitude.

I have Roma neighbours and my life has been a living hell since they moved in, constant noise, an everchanging population of around 10 adults crammed into a two bedroomed house, drug dealing, rubbish dumped everywhere, they used my address for various fraudulent activities and I got all the threatening debt collection agency letters, benefit fraud stuff from the DWP. I feel horrible saying this but it is cultural, we have a lot of Roma now round where I live and they cause havoc, and it is true that the girls are pulled out of school at around age 11 and the boys rarely complete their education. Girls are expected to spend their time cleaning and the boys will have more freedom but will mainly be involved in whatever the family does ot make money. For all they they are nuisance they are also exploited by terrbield landlords who rent out substandard accommodation to them knowing that they won't complain and indeed do not know how to complain. The rents are paid in cash which means the landlords won't be paying tax . Like you I feel sad about all the children who for cultural reasons and the generational mistrust of authority will never get the chance to achieve their potential.

Unbelievably offensive post. Societal collapse is everywhere. The haves have way too much. The have nots… fuck all. I don’t believe ANYONE wants to sleep rough, especially in our wet cold winter months. We’ve got such wealth in this country and people begging and sleeping in doorways 🤦‍♀️

Let’s just get them off the streets, like they did for Prince Harry’s wedding 😡

For me, it’s not about absolving of responsibility but looking at the reasons why.

I don’t claim to know those reasons, but in my view to become addicted to the level you beg strangers for money, or to sleep on the streets instead of in the warm home of someone who cares for you - something has to have gone very wrong.

Most of us, even if the worst happened, have somewhere to go and wouldn’t rough sleeping in December wouldn’t be either the norm or the preference.

You can acknowledge someone is choosing to take drugs to deal with whatever it is their dealing with, and still have some sympathy for that.

That’s a completely separate argument.

If those children believe they are reaching their potential by dropping out of school, learning to be homemakers, whatever - it’s not up to us to tell them they’re wrong. We can’t be telling people how to raise their own kids, beyond abuse etc.

If that’s the life they want and believe in, that’s up to them.

My lovely friend ended up sleeping in Tesco shop window for a couple of years from young teenager. He sorted his life out with the help of kind peoole around him. Hes a wonderful person

Im very glad you are not one of them and can look down on them. A change in circumstances for any one of us could see us in the same position

The last part of this post is important.

In the last three years, on probably a dozen occasions, the stresses I have been dealing with have pushed me to an unhealthy "fuck it all" attitude and I have drunk to painful excess and engaged in risky behaviour. My nearests and dearests have reacted mostly with compassion, but also a measure of tough love clearly defining the fact that if it keeps happening, I would be cut off.

At my age, in my 50s, I have just enough self preservation or survival instinct to keep myself in check. It means I live a very small life, away from temptation. I could easily tip over the edge when it seems everything that can go wrong does go wrong. My fear of complete rejection is one factor that keeps me going, alongside fear of the pain it would cause my family or friends if I did do anything "stupid". Also, ridiculous as it may sound, my cat.

However, I'm constantly at war in my own head with a voice that tells me it's all essentially pointless, and I am pointless.

In many ways I'm lucky - I am housed, and can just about cover the basics on a limited income while I try to rebuild my entire life.

This is why I don't judge. Because it is very much a case of "there but for the grace of God go I".

Maybe you haven’t felt the effects of what drug addicts actually do then As a kid, a drug addict broke into my bedroom. I am permanently traumatised.

Hateful? Please take a walk down the main streets in Manchester. It’s completely blighted by these vagrants. It’s shocking that we have to tolerate it as a society because the negative impact they have on businesses and those trying to enjoy the city is quite significant.

The saddest part is that these addicts and beggars give genuine homeless or destitute people a bad name. The fiver given to an addict to go towards their next hit could literally buy food for a family dinner for someone who has literally nothing despite working or caring for someone, instead the spice dealer loitering around the addicts gets paid.

The ones camping out on busy shopping streets are often there because they have total disregard for the system, they won’t work they chose a life of drugs or alcohol and before you come for me about that- no one forced them to drink or do drugs. They’ve often left a trail of destruction behind them in the form of their devastated family members who tried in vain to help them countless times.

So save your sanctimony.

That must’ve been terrifying. I’m assuming this was a random burglar and not a family member on drugs ?

It is sad that your privileged upbringing didn't raise a compassionate or decent human, OP. Tell me OP, when you have had traumatic events happen in life, did you get up, paint a smile on your face and go into work the same day?

You seem to have completely misunderstood my OP, these people are addicts and beggars who pile into the city at peak times to capitalise on the goodwill of naive people to fund their next hit or bottle.

If only we could get them off the streets. That would be a step in the right direction.

If you’re so sure that no one could ever want to sleep rough then go volunteer for a homeless charity, you’ll soon be back voting YANBU