AIBU in thinking this could spread rapidly to other schools? Parents have to come into school to change NT DCs if they soil themselves.

[CwmYoy]

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/schools-tell-parents-if-your-34349942

It's been a long time coming but I can see it will spread now there are fewer TAs.

As long as SEN needs are taken into account I think it's a good idea.

Good luck convincing the right people though, that's the issue, being able to convince someone, then make them try get the funds, then finally getting the fund, to then finally put it to use.

How long would that take? Make parents potty train their children is the most practical solution.

The millions upon millions I am talking about are already there. They are already being spent by LAs in an attempt to get out of providing the support children and young people need.

No, what would make me look silly is talk about things I know nothing about or how they work.

What would make me look silly would be using opinion as fact.

What would make me look silly would be using opinion"someone said " and not bother doing my own research and reading and at least try to understand what I'm talking about.

Btw, if "anecdata" is good enough for the Welsh (you see, they didn't have actual numbers or stats, just anecdotal testimonies from teachers)to base policy on , it's good enough for me to use on a thread on MN.

Neither you do, but if they look clearly healthy and are functional enough parents should potty train them, just like it was done decades ago.

The reality of things is that forcing teachers and school to do it is not sustainable and will make everything worse for all children.

I haven’t claimed I do know.

”Look clearly healthy” is so ignorant. Not all SEND are visible.

but if they look clearly healthy

Meh , at least you dropped the pretence and faux naïveté act.

@BrightYellowTrain
Which is why I said convince the right people to use it in the right way.

@BlueSilverCats
Creating conspiracy theories are silly, trying to divert attention to me won't change that.

You're also using your opinion as fact, you keep talking about your experiences, but that's entirely anedoctal, so you're no different.

Ah, good old "my own research", which almost always mean "look for sources that agree with me".

You can use whatever you want on MN, won't change reality.

@BrightYellowTrain
Hoping that teachers and school will magically fix the situation is equally ignorant.

I can’t imagine how frustrating that must be for the parents. Local authorities shouldn’t be spending their time and money fighting tooth and nail to get out of doing their jobs, especially as this means they have even less money to fund the services they ought to be providing.

I know social services departments across the country are experiencing a funding crisis and we need to end this farce and get them working again.

Ah yes, now comes the demonization, cause someone disagreeing with you must be doing it out of malice or bigotry right?

I said and I'll repeat, situation not sustainable, none of you have any actual practical solution, insisting on teachers and school doing it will fail and make things worse.

Which is why I said convince the right people to use it in the right way.

You didn’t originally, actually. You originally said convince politicians. You edited the post as I was typing.

Hoping that teachers and school will magically fix the situation is equally ignorant.

No-one has suggested magic.

@CwmYoy why should anyone else be changing your childs nappy anyway! you should be toilet training your child before they go to nursery or school. that is the job of the parent!

@BrightYellowTrain
You didn’t originally, actually. You originally said convince politicians. You edited the post as I was typing.

Unfortunate timing, I did edit cause later I felt politicians might not have been the right word.

No-one has suggested magic.
But some insist the teacher has to do it, ignoring the reality of things, that it's not practical and sustainable as explained by multiple people, which is why I mentioned magic.

Oh i have plenty of practical solutions . They're just not palatable as they involve a lot of time, money and well thought out long term planning.

Then you should stop teaching and try get into a position of power so you can enforce your solution, easy peasy.

Still won't change reality of things, forcing teachers and school to do it isn't sustainable.

Decades ago many parents potty trained their children around 2 to 3 years old, maybe it's time to bring that practice back.

The practical solution is having a network where people can access help and support before their child starts school easily and from a central point. They could call it a sure start centre or something similar!

Most parents still do.

Unfortunately some think forcing the teachers and school to do it will magically work

"Will their ability to get well paid jobs be compromised so that parents like you let the school pick up the slack to allow you to have a better standard of living."

Firstly, the government chronically underfunding our education system is creating the slack, not me given that I'm a responsible working parent who is doing the job of two people. It's not just about a "better standard of living" I'm by no means a high earner. It's the difference in keeping a roof over my child's head and keeping him out of poverty. Those are basic needs not luxuries and NO child or parent should EVER be put in a position where they need to chosen between poverty and an education in this country. Yet that is exactly what you are suggesting. The other issue of course is then childcare. If my son was not in school at the age of 4 then how do you expect me to work at all? If you're pushing more people into poverty then expect to see overall lower educational outcomes as well as an increase in other social issues like crime/poorer health and increased pressure on nhs/ higher rates of exploitation/ more pressure on social services to name a few. That impacts everyone anyway, you're just kicking the issue a couple of years down the line.

No school will ever be a completely equal platform which is exactly why our education system needs better funding and an overhaul to create a more equitable system that keeps engaging vulnerable children alongside their peers without anyone becoming isolated unless it's absolutely necessary. We should be fighting to keep children in schools not pushing out the ones who perhaps need it the most. We have far too many pupils in classes now as it is. Teachers are being pushed further and further to the max and placing the accountability for that on the parents isn't going to fix anything it's just creating a government scapegoat. We do not ONLY value the outcomes of NT quiet and well behaved children. That's a race straight to the bottom.

Source: trust me bro

Forcing parents to keep their child at home/go into school isn’t practical or sustainable either. And may well lead to schools facing DD claims if they are judging needs on a child’s looks.

So can you explain the practical side of a child having a soiled and dirty nappy and a parent who commutes as many, many parents do? How long out of curiosity would you feel comfortable leaving a child in a soiled nappy for??

Indeed it's not either, I feel they're trying to force parents to potty train their child rather than outright force children out of school, now question is how well this will work.

I think bigger question is how long schools can maintain such thing, I can see some parents sue school pretty early, not reaching even half of 2025, but who would win? I honestly can see it going either way.

Only thing sure is that if we try force more responsibilities on teachers in the long run it'll just make the shortage even worse than it already is, cause I don't ser vast majority agreeing with being forced to change nappies as part of their regular duties.

Not sure why you tagged me. I don't think teachers should ever change DC's.

I feel they're trying to force parents to potty train their child rather than outright force children out of school

Except many on this thread are proposing children are unlawfully excluded, forcing parents to defer for a year, parents called in… If that happened and a parent decided to pursue legal action, they would ’win’ (Parents don’t really ‘win’ even if their claim is upheld).

It's not, unfortunately children are caught in the middle of a fight between teachers / school vs parents.

Don't get me wrong, I get where you're coming from, but teachers have been feeling they're forced against the wall for years now, it's why they shortage happened to begin with.

And as explained multiple times by different people, leaving things as they are and force it into teachers is not practical or sustainable, so schools are trying to force a solution out of this situation, someone will inevitably get the short end of the stick.