AIBU in thinking this could spread rapidly to other schools? Parents have to come into school to change NT DCs if they soil themselves.

[CwmYoy]

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/schools-tell-parents-if-your-34349942

It's been a long time coming but I can see it will spread now there are fewer TAs.

As long as SEN needs are taken into account I think it's a good idea.

So people are happy to deny a child education because of something out of their control?

My son soiled himself a few times in Reception, he was late to toilet train but was mostly clean by the time he started reception. Unfortunately he was scared of the toilets there, due to them having workmen in who set off a drill next door while he was in the bathroom, and also scared of the flush.

He was diagnosed with autism and adhd at 8. So he had SEN, but was undiagnosed, as a lot of kids that age will be.

It’s not about denying a child an education, it’s about getting parents to parent-a d for a lot of people, the only way is by inconveniencing THEM, and not leaving school to do the parenting for them

But if they are that sort of parent then you risk leaving a child in a unsupportive home without any external support.

do we really want to alienate the parents of potentially at risk children?

And some parents will try everything they can but for whatever reason their child still has accidents.

I've changed enough nappies of my own children, those of friends' children and nephews and nieces that I genuinely don't have an issue with changing a child as part of my teaching job, but then who is teaching the other 29 children? Some schools are absolutely skeletal with staff - we don't even staff the school office full time, let alone have enough floating TAs. We also don't have anywhere particularly suitable to change children and as we're a listed building it's incredibly hard to get planning permission to make any changes. Our school is over 150 years old - schools have changed drastically in that time but buildings haven't kept pace. We don't have anything like the breakout space we need for children needing sensory time or interventions. As for money for staffing... And even when we do have money, it's almost impossible to recruit because the role is badly paid and undervalued. There are many teachers and TAs happy to help who are held back by resourcing.

The problem I see with this is SEN needs are often not identified or assessed until much later. There is a child in my DD class who has issues with soiling in nursery and reception but it was not the parents paid for a private assessment in yr 3 that his needs were diagnosed.

There should be special schools geared up for those unable to use the lavatory.
Why should teachers have to be personal carers ?( a very smelly job)

Years ago this wasn’t an issue.
Yes, the occasional wee in reception class, but poo was almost unheard of.

Toilet training seemed to be done much earlier on in a child’s life.

Maybe the comfier nappies make it easier to not be toilet trained?

There aren’t special schools for the children who have severe needs and are crying out for places.

the idea of shipping children off to a special schools because of bowel and bladder problems is frankly rediculous!

@oakleaffy yes there should be , but there aren't.

Our local SEN school (the only primary and we have kids coming out of county) currently has a 3 year waiting list. Where do those kids go?

Doesn’t that go for the parents that will have been informed, as well?

It's a good policy.

I know people are saying SEN may not be obvious at age 4 but surely this would have been the case 20 or 30 years ago too yet kids weren't starting in nappies then.

In France all children have to be potty trained to start school, it’s a blanket rule (like having all their vaccines).

@Jeezitneverends all the kids still in nappies at my school are non-verbal/mostly non verbal and functioning at the level of a 2 yo at most, some a lot younger. How exactly do you toilet train them?

I totally agree parents should come in and do it.
I teach year one without a TA - I can’t leave the other 29 children to change children and I certainly don’t have another adult to do it with me to be in line with our intimate care policy.

If your child isn't toilet trained then send them to nursery not preschool. Yes, toilet training can be hard but I find it astounding that parents feel it's appropriate to send children to school still in nappies or regularly soiling.

I agree with others. NT kids should be dry. Mine were by 2 and 2.5.

How many kids in nappies do you actually have in your class? What about last year? Two years ago?

I can see employers more than happy for their staff to leave work in order to make their way to their child's school to change a nappy.

It's not always about toilet training. My nephew has been having a horrible time with constipation which means he sometimes had accidents. It's an ongoing process getting him sorted.

You do realise that SEN don't disappear at age 5 right? You can only postpone for so long...

last year 1.
Year 2 have none, my one from last year has got it now but has accidents.
Reception have 5 but we think 3 will probably be diagnosed with some sort of SEN

It's not just "lazy" parents. It's also parents who are totally paralysed by being told continually that they're doing everything wrong, and who are being bombarded with various potty training plans and schedules, and "signs they're ready", and who just don't know where to begin.

I know a lot of my friends were horrified that I took mine out of nappies "before they were ready" (around their second birthday). And yes, mine had quite a few accidents, and they weren't "done and dusted" in three days, or whatever the magic number is.

But in my experience, a few wet trousers is much easier to deal with than a 3.5/4yo who's become very resistant to making the change from nappies to toilet (and they're probably too big to be comfortable on a potty by this stage which doesn't help).

yes a girl same age as my dd when 4, 20 + years ago, parents had to go in

she did have medical issues

Disability money ( pip to pay for a carer?) What happened before all this has come to a head?

Why are there now SO many children who aren’t toilet trainable children compared to 20 yrs ago?

It was never mentioned in the past - so something is awry in society now- something has changed ( excuse the pun).

What is different now?
Diet?
Parents having children much older?

lack of HV?