To be worried about what the Labour government will do next?

[Scenicgirl]

Let's be honest, Labour has been a massive disappointment for this country, pissing off the pensioners with taking away the WFA, the farmers, NI changes which impact employers, immigration etc and today refusing compensation to the WASPI women after they ridiculed the Conservatives when they didn't commit to a solution. Don't we deserve better than this constant shit show of lies and deceptions which were clearly spouted out purely to gain power?
For the 1st time in my life, I worry about where we are heading.

@Alexandra2001 The employee NI cut was a bribe for votes, and it would have been much more preferable to reverse that, rather than use the stealth employer NI tax. Everyone will end up paying for it in the end anyway, but in a much less obvious way.

The Employer NI rise is also having a much greater impact on certain industries, particularly those that employ a lot of part time and younger staff. The impact will (is already arguably) result in job losses and companies struggling. All of which will eventually meant less of the much needed money for services. Tax revenue will decrease and the benefits bill will rise.

Where should we find the money? I think a huge amount of unpopular changes need to be made. We need to move towards a privatised European/Aussie style of health care for one.

We need to stop spending on green policies that are costing us billions but just drive our production to China etc. None of that is helping the planet.

We need to help businesses grow, employ more people and have much less reliance on state help.

As previous posters mentioned, we need politicians who actually have business knowledge and drive to change things for the better, rather than seeing politics as a career and caring more about their party than the country.

If we currently had a government that put party above country it would be a lot more popular. Look at all the policies that are attracting criticism right now, if they were putting party first they wouldn’t have made those hard choices.

'So a minority will squeak'

The private sector is definitely not a minority and it's growth or not impacts what the public sector gets so that's pretty much including everyone

Also borrowing was high in the budget about £70bn in taxes plus high borrowing

Public sector payrises were above inflation. Most civil servants are getting at least a 5% payrise.

My point still stands in any event. Despite the alleged £22billion black hole we can afford massive payrises for well paid people in the first place but not the winter fuel allowances? It's odd. You would suspect if you were cynical that pensioners have been targeted because they often don't vote Labour.

Their decisions are very much in line with party ideology. Unfortunately for the rest of us.

Their decisions are very much in line with party ideology. Unfortunately for the rest of us.

Yes they are party driven and responses are too.

Where would you get the 10.5 billion to fund this waspi payment?

£1,5 billion the ex miners have shared is money that was already in their pension fund, previously held back.

Public sector workers aren't "well paid" at all & it was a pay rise recommended by their pay review bodies, set up under the previous govt.

Where do we get the £10billion per year hunts NI cut has cost the GOvt?

WFA? correct thing to do, however, threshold too low, we should not be giving public money to pensioners who have plenty.

People who oppose Labour all complain about tax rises etc but with borrowing at post ww2 record levels, caused by economic mis management by the Tories, we cannot borrow money to fix the country.

so who to tax???

Debt to GDP was out of control by the time we were affected by Covid... so thats not an excuse.

All public sector pay rises were above inflation? All public sector workers are well paid?

Average public sector salary is c 35k. Taking into account that some public sector workers, highly trained and skilled professionals such as doctors, for example, are paid well above that, this leaves a lot of people paid significantly less.

It’s lazy to insist that public sector workers uniformly receive excellent pay and conditions. When I see that argument put across, it throws doubt on the accuracy of what else is being posited.

Tax Amazon. I've said it before. Not pensioners, children or farmers.

Debt levels had improved hugely before covid due to the "austerity" policies of George Osbourne in part.

Many public sector workers are paid more than Keir Starmer. And for example train drivers are very well paid. Get rid of a decent number of the managerial class of the Civil Service who don't seem very good at managing rather than paying them more.

I'm not saying I agree with the WASPI payment actually, unlike Keir Starmer (hypocrisy and lying again) who said it should be made, as a lure before the election. I just think it's interesting that Ed Milliband raided the fund that was meant to be held as an emergency cushion to protect miner pensions, in order to give the miners more money now. And how it could be argued that as all the miners I know are men (apologies to any female miners on here) Labour are happy to make extra payments to male pensioners but not female ones.

It's interesting.

Councils in London are currently spending 190 million a month collectively on temporary housing.

Lack of access to health services is damaging productivity and leaving large numbers of people too ill to work.

Lack of social housing means the tax payer is pouring billions into the pockets of private landlords in the form of housing allowance.

Thatcherite economics are what's landed us in the position we're currently in, where austerity has damaged public health and our infrastructure, and it's costing us billions.

Too many people in the country unfortunately. Thatcher didn't reckon on the country's borders being removed.

"Many public sector workers are paid more than Keir Starmer"

A tiny, tiny number of workers in the public sector are paid salaries of over 100K. 0.5%.

And the idea that someone can look at a service they think is poorly run - not any specific service but to vaguely wave a hand at the public sector and go 'just get rid of managers' - what qualifies you to make that judgement?

"Labour are happy to make extra payments to male pensioners but not female ones"

That's a reach.

The fact any are paid more than the PM is ridiculous.

@izimbra that still doesn't negate the economic issues with going higher with debt

Look at France recently

www.euronews.com/business/2024/09/27/french-debt-soars-reinforcing-concerns-about-its-budgetary-control

Plenty of articles along the same lines

Well...male pensioners are getting extra payments whereas by definition WASPIs , being women aren't. QED.

She is a self confessed social democrat.

At least someone has addressed the elephant. You'll get yourself banned though once the racist comments start flying!

At least someone has addressed the elephant. You'll get yourself banned though once the racist comments start flying!

I put some info as the pp requested it on policy

It was stats and policy rather than myths

Taxing Amazon on all of their UK profits wouldn't raise £10 billion, it would at most raise approx £360million.

Cutting a handful of civil servant jobs wouldn't either.

No, public sector debt in 2010 was 65% of GDP, by 2019.20 it was 85%, its now almost 100%.

Austerity, along with Brexit, are two of the worst possible policies the Tories pursued, Austerity was needed for 3 or 4 years, perhaps until 2015 but then they should have rebuilt the UK.... now we have huge costs for not maintaining our infrastructure.

Starmer supported the Waspi's and that was unwise, however, it was NOT in their 2024 manifesto, there was no lying.

You keep trying to make the comparison to Miners, making this a sex based issue but it clearly is not, the miners had a final Salary scheme, they did not get their full pension, thats fraud.

90% of Waspi women, along with men who have seen their pension ages rise, knew in plenty of time.

so, i'll try again, how would you and others raise £10.5 billion???

I am so tired of these Labour bashing threads. Can't be arsed to read all 37 pages of it.

Remember Liz Truss anyone? Brexit? It will take years to right the mess the last Tory government has left us in.

@izimbra Of course you can evaluate whether a service is well run and delivers what it sets out to do! This is vital value for money evaluation. Where services don’t meet criteria, they are often poorly run. Often they are incapable of change. We pay a high price for poor services which let people down. Having said that, how services are funded and what they are expected to do, matters. This is where poor politicians have let us down. Socialist policies are non starters. No r can afford the higher taxes needed. Growth is needed and lower taxation. Then people make choices about spending. Growth is key though. Plus we need lower expectations of the state.

Yes France 10 year bond yield 3%, UK 10 year yield is 4.5% and went from 1.8% to 5% under Truss.

Servicing that debt is cost France far far less than it is the UK....

The USA, often held up as economic model the UK should follow by many MN posters and right wing politicians, has a public sector debt far in excess of France at 122% and rising.

Oh it was all Hunky Dory under Truss Boris and Sunak, no problems at all, Starmer has wrecked the UK in just 5 months.....

There have been plenty of Tory and Reform bashing threads. If you don't like it why contribute, just scroll on by.