To ask how ‘rough’ is this rough area?

[Jumell]

Strangers in your block of flats asking you to lend them money ‘til their dole money comes through then stropping off offended when refused

being bitten by Rottweiler outside flats

heroin addict dead in flats - body lay undiscovered for 2 weeks - admittedly happened, but admittedly NOT during time I lived here

kids graffitiing stairwells with pens

my windscreen wipers snapped off in flat car park

woman I suspect is prostitute due to comings and goings - but not 100% sure and u may have got it wrong

loud arguments between neighbours about noise

a few serious ex offenders housed

• however - it’s otherwise alright ! 👍😀

Really? Or are you asking that in a serious manner…?

No, this poster seems to be spoiling for a fight. I think they're bored (and a bit sad tbh).

A shame the other poster withdrew her post because of it...

I’m not spoiling for a fight at all. Life means you’re going to have people disagreeing with you strongly at some point. You wouldn’t be spouting off on this forum if you didn’t accept that deep down. The poster had said it was a man that saved her from a terrible reality. On a post where someone is expressing how uncomfortable their life is on a council estate. Wrong timing. Suck it and swallow if you’re too dense to see that’s wrong timing.

Very rough

Thank you 🩷

In fairness, the rats and mice were in the last place and we were moved for that reason (and all the others obviously).

So now while the inside of our flat is actually gorgeous and big and open plan, it's completely unliveable for us for all those new reasons. Taking my kids there with the promise of a better quality of life, and then it being what it was, was completely heartbreaking.

We are lucky that we are moving early next year, but my God, the breakdowns I had and the battles I fought to get there.... Nobody should have to live in these situations where they can't have a basically decent and safe home. Huge rethinks need to be done in planning for housing. It's not surprising that most people find living in poorly sound proofed flats with other people with all sorts of issues really difficult.

This is very useful advice - thank you and good for you !

I live in a rough area, the block of flats I live in had a murder a few years ago, I live next door to a drug dealer, had a prostitute live above me & an alcoholic woman above her. But the drug dealer has helped me carry my shopping when I was struggling with my mobility, persuaded ds to come home when he ran away after a meltdown, offers help when he sees me, is polite & I would rather live next door to him than some of the neighbours I have lived next door to in other places I have lived. You could be living in a so called posh area & have problems, there are goof & bad wherever you live.

Of course that's Extremely rough and if that's where you live, you have my sympathy. I live in outer London/suburb zone 6 and have never encountered anything like you describe apart from drug dealing but that's because I see cars pulling up at large expensive houses very late at night, and things (money/obv cocaine) being switched from car to person standing next to it!
I used to live further in, Zone 3 SE London and still didn't.
I moved to zone 6 when my eldest child was 2 as I wanted her to have a better standard of life - more green, better schools, community spirit etc.

What you describe is awful.
A friend of mine (single, civil servant working mid management for MoD) did live in a council block in Thamesmead (think clockwork orange) and some of what you mention, I could see happening there - there was a 'HELP' lighted sign above his front door which could be illuminated from his flat. That was unnerving when I visited.
He has since moved to a better place. I hope you can relocate too.

Please tell us where as I'm planning a move to a seaside town on SE coast now my kids have flown the next and it's so much cheaper than outer London - and when I visit it seems idillic

Re Jaywick. My mum's family had a holiday home there in the 40s(my grandparents). They lived in Dulwich Village and it was owned by my great grandparents who also lived in Dulwich Village. My mum was horrified and upset to see it in a documentary a couple of years ago. Likewise, she was disappointed to see Peckham recently when we had to drive her to St Thomas hospital. I never went to Jaywick as they sold in the 60s and bought one in Birchington, Kent. We still have use of that one. Birchington is still very nice.

Thank you - oh gosh my ex partner lived in Thamesmead as a kid!

Margate

Blindly just seen it's Margate! Friends of mine moved there a few years ago from Hackney and made a fortune by doing so. Now have a large house, renovated to their specifications and bought 2 air bnbs.
I'm hoping to move to Ramsgate/Broadstairs/Westgate on seaBirchington so hope theyre not like you describe.

No Ramgate and Broadstairs are infinitely better so fear not !!

Sounds like where I used to live. Was a young single mum. The worst bit was the life for kids. My friend taught in the local primary and told me that all (literally all) in his class were on the st risk register because of their circumstances. This is going back quite a bit but it made me so sad and the thought that my son would end up on it too because of where we lived (though I am sure I had that overblown in my mind) ensured that I did everything to get us away from there. I would see toddlers in the street being screamed at and told to fuck off for asking their mummy to slow down because their little legs were too short to keep up. As an example. I’m haunted by some of it to be honest. Sometimes I think everyone should see it so that there is more hope of change.

Thanks @Jumell
If you're in a council or HA flat, could you be relocated on a swap?
My friend did so successfully from Whistable (she'd moved from London but relationship failed) to a lovely place in Bermondsey? That happened really quickly.
Another friend got a swap from London zone 4 to Somerset.
Thamesmead is now actually a lot better than it was 20 yrs ago!!

Yes I could look into a swap. Glad it work out for your friend!

I know Whitstable well and feel that it’s infinitely more desirable to move to than where I live though !

I live in a not so great area in a housing association flat. I don't care what people get up to in their own properties as long as it's not causing me any aggro personally. Police visits/a woman on the game/drug usage in private properties doesn't bother me. I mind my own business as a rule of thumb. I wouldn't like to be asked for money from neighbours though. Fortunately that doesn't happen to me.

What part of Peckham was that? Rye Lane is an experience, for sure, at certain times of the day. But there are extremely expensive houses on neighbouring streets. And a lot of the rough estates in north Peckham have been demolished now.

But it is not "the poor" it is the anti social - being poor does not mean you grafitti,.damage property, take drugs, act offensively- it does mean that you can't move away from an area with anti social problems though - we need to tackle the anti social problems as people should not have to live with this happening around them.

It depends a lot as to whether you have kids or not.

I lived for a year as a student in a notoriously rough estate (since been pulled down). Filthy stairwells, dilapidation severe: don’t think the council had maintained it in any way for over a decade. Noise pollution and people openly dealing heroin from certain known flats.

I actually was fine living there as a 20 something student. Had no real problems, never felt threatened or unsafe. I shut the door on it when I got in and didn’t hang around.

But there’s no way in God’s green earth I would have brought kids up there.

I have lived in areas considered rough. I would say that term is usually used to mean working class. How “rough” somewhere feels tends to be how much crime you experience as a non gang related person in the area. I’ve lived in areas of high crime but when it’s mostly gang related and had a minimal impact on me personally… apart from the heartbreak of seeing 9 year olds on bikes delivering drugs and the police more interested in occasional arrests than protecting these children.

What you describe sounds pretty tough. But I guess it depends on your experience. If you have friends and family and community it could feel largely great, despite the drug overdoses and prostitution.

Come on - are you being deliberately disingenuous? Antisocial behaviour is directly linked to poverty. I live in a middle class road - none of my neighbours touch me up for money, have gentlemen callers all hours of the day and night, nor do we trip over the homeless or drug addicted, though there are areas in the local town where individuals impacted by these congregate. The police have never needed to break down the doors of the local properties and, in fact, have only visited our road half a dozen times in 20 years in response to very occasional attempted burglaries.

Of course ‘rough’ means ‘poor’, and all the social and economic impacts that flow from it. I grew up in one of those council blocks and had to step over the comatose tramp lying in his pee who often took refuge in the ground floor stair well on my way to school every morning or when playing.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/impacts-of-anti-social-behaviour-on-individuals-and-communities/anti-social-behaviour-impacts-on-individuals-and-local-communities

Don't forget that even within very small localities, the area can be massively different.

I live in a town in the SE and "rough" streets and estates are interspersed with very nice areas.

I don't know if it's by virtue of design or whether this is the case in other towns, but there isn't even a single "rough" estate in this city that doesn't have a nice part, with good resources.

On the flip side of that, it can be quite depressing to see run down areas with really poor and badly maintained play equipment, and then houses less than a mile away with beautifully kept green areas and really cool new parks. And they are quiet too, despite being in close proximity to the "rough" areas.

I completely agree that ASB is associated with poverty, but it's completely disingenuous to suggest that it's somehow exclusive to low SES.

Middle class and rich people do drugs too, and can behave poorly, be abusive and have mental health issues.

Obviously the biggest difference is the resources to manage life, so poor people don't really have any respite or buffer - it's a lot more visible, and that in itself has more of an impact on the affected people.