My town has really changed

[CatbellsOnTheSeashore]

In a confusing and not very pleasant way.

It was gradually changing for the worse before covid, but the pandemic seemed to accelerate it, and I am wondering if anyone else has noticed anything like this.

It became more insular whilst more populated, the population increased quite a bit over the past 5 yrs. More and more dereliction, low council maintenance and an influx of troubled people housed around the town centre, which is now a no-go zone. Areas surrounding have steadily grown worse also, as it seems to be spilling out.

What does feel really different is that there are now lots of groups of men, hanging around drinking or sat on pavements together (not begging). Drugs took over the local nature paths and canal walks so now there are large groups of people out of their heads lying on old sofas at the locks, it's really grim. Women who used to cycle and run in these areas have more or less moved elsewhere or stopped.

More and more standard sized houses in low to middle income areas are becoming HMO's, yet with poor refuse organisation and not enough parking. I'm not exaggerating when I say there are literally trails of dog shit in the streets in many areas, too, which pretty much hangs in the air and the place stinks. That, and skunk.

We live in a decent part of town but it is coming closer, and I only have that perk due to inheriting my parents bungalow. More and more people are moving out.

On a walk to Sainsbury's yesterday two guys were holding onto a sign pole hovering over a bin. As I passed by one of them vomited into the bin and then spat/gobbed an inch from my feet - he didn't notice me particularly, but it was quite sudden or I'd have given them a wide berth.
This isn't unusual now.

I know people usually blame the cost of living and covid, etc, but this was definitely on the rise before. There is far more noise pollution as more buildings go up, usually industrial, and the roads are a nightmare. Infrastructure for actual people is decreasing.
That said, I don't think most of these people were thriving before, so it isn't a sudden change. It is as if a new kind of culture is growing, that doesn't care a damn about anything. Everything is vandalised or shat on. More and more windows are broken in properties close to the town centre, and I doubt most of these people were thriving before the pandemic hit.

Is this bad luck or is anything like it happening elsewhere?
We are definitely looking to move away.

I agree. Followed by Liz Truss. We have still not recovered as a country from the economic damage she did to us.

I live in a city that gets a bit of a rough ride, usually from people who’ve never lived here, but the central shopping area / high street is thriving with pretty much every shop you could wish for and there are lots of busy restaurants both chain and locally owned. Independent coffee shops etc and they’ve done a fairly decent job of helping homeless people off the streets so the tent cities that were common a few years ago are no longer here. There are however large pockets of deprivation and drug use but I feel that has always been the case. There are large v expensive new build estates and in many ways the city has improved over the last few years which seems at odds with other towns.

Boris promised to 'Get Brexit Done'. He got it done (making us all a lot poorer) and then imported millions of random migrants to the country from mostly outside the EU.

I live in a seaside town in the south which used to be popular as a place to retire.
I've lived here all my life. It used to be lovely, and is now an utter shit hole. Hardly any shops in the town centre, druggies and homeless everywhere, knife crime and immigrant hotels. The stench of weed everywhere, and piles of rubbish fly tipped on the high street, which the council do nothing about.
And in the summer we have swarms of people coming to the beach, and literally leaving their shits in takeaway boxes on the sand.

@Missamyp I partially agree, But if you talk to people what most really miss is secure decently paid work, decent local services, and a sense of community. They might talk about the mines reopening as a way to bring that back - they are wrong. But those are the perfectly valid things they want.

This. People who have the wherewithal to make it here have money, education and supportive families. Honestly we'd be better off just letting them buy plane tickets! The truly needy are much less likely to escape war and pogroms.

So why did the party that 'got Brexit done' create more immigration? Did the people who voted for that feel comfortable with it, or duped?
What does our government (whichever it is) get out of that, typically? Who profits from it?
That's often where the answer lies.

I also agree that the housing market is at the top of the list of issues in the UK, possibly the most responsible facet for poverty, depression and stress.

@summershere99 that is interesting. What is the town?

Well , we will have to agree to differ. It’s hard to find the statistics on illiteracy and lack of European standard ‘skills’ , or on the ability to speak English to a reasonable standard. Our Givernment doesn’t make them available. (Being a cynic, I suspect this is because they would not be very favourable, or otherwise surely they would be headline news).

However, In Germany and Sweden they do keep and publish these statistics, and they show very low levels of literacy, competence in the host nation language and acceptable qualifications. That’s why both these nations are attempting to close the door, and even deport the undesirable.

I expect you will tell me that the literate, highly skilled and qualified migrants have all avoided Germany and Sweden for some unknown reason, and flocked here instead.

Also, those saying there are a large amount of illegal immigrants, how do you know in any given situation? Language barrier? I ask in earnest as I haven't a clue.

Sounds like most northern towns tbh. The decline happened under thatcher and its continued. If it helps I went to Wigan before covid and it seemed as shit as my hometown (similar size town in Yorkshire) then, so maybe you just hadn’t noticed yet. Years and years of lack of investment, lack of prospects and loss of industry. The longer we go on the worse it will get, even though it seems like it can’t get worse.

I don’t live in my hometown anymore, I live in a city in Scotland . Most young people with prospects (or LGBT) left my hometown so the cycle continues

I agree. The really needy who are less likely to get and keep a job either stay in war torn countries, or flee to the other side of the border. Getting to the UK takes money and resourcefulness. No one lazy or without skills is able to do this.

It won't be true for every single individual but it is true for the majority.
It was true in the 1990,s when my father ran establishments for a certain clientele, and is still is true today when it comes to East European, Middle Eastern men congregating in your local Coffee Nero. I know a lot about that side of things.
No doubt you think that all those barber shops and car washes are legitimate employers of poor, displaced migrant men. Or a cornerstone of bustling cultural diversity?
I'm proud of that last sentence, would make Guardian with it 😁

Sorry I did mean legal immigration. Just saw and was coming back to edit! It was clearly a typo. I wouldn't bother to quote illegal figures as I have zero trust they would be accurate.

I'm rushing around - taking DC to piano lessons.

My case in point, why do people respond so aggressively if immigration, illegal or legal is mentioned as if there's no possibility that there is a direct link.

@Allthegoodnamesarechosen Perhaps you can provide a link that tells us the proportion of asylum seekers in Germany and Sweden who are illiterate or have low levels of literacy? I googled and although I can find lots of statistics, I cant find that. That is if they exist.

Devolved cuts and devolved blame. You’ve been taken in easily it seems.

@QueenCamilla The men I see congregating in cafes are not from Eastern Europe.
We have clear money laundering businesses in our City, I have already posted about this here. For example an estate agent with stock house details that has never been opened once in two years. Or shops in places with high rents that hardly sell anything. There is a largish corner shop like this that has half empty shelves and only really seems to sell chocolate bars and cans of pop to passer byes.

A lot of towns near me have gone downhill. I live in county Durham. Durham city was beautiful. It's now full of boarded up shops, HMOs, every available building is turned into student accommodation. The community is gone. Drunks and druggies everywhere along the main street. It's heartbreaking to see.

Let's face it, if you're a working class boy you're best bet is to get your GCSE's, train to be a mechanic/plumber/spark and then bugger off to Australia or Canada

That's what I'd do.

Sounds exactly like where I am, when I bought my house most of them were owner occupier and then things on the nearby road began to go downhill with loads of unofficial HMOs, and it now looks like a Dickensian slum, My street is now heading the same way. I am hesitant to say this because I worry about being called a racist but what has really changed things in a negative way has been the amount of Roma people in the area. It was always mixed, (think Polish, Aiasan, Afro Carrriean and English ) people had pride in their homes, worked, and abided by some sort of social contract but the Roma seem to live differently. I have some of them living near me and they are just so problematic, the noise and rubbish is horrible and they have trashed the house they live in. The family who lived next door who had lived in their home for 12 years upped and left after 10 months of noise and having rubbish flung into their yard. They are just not plugged into main stream society. I appreciate that they have been victims of prejudice for centuries but they really don't help themselves.

You know, I think it's sad that subjects such as this always become an argument about our two party political system or immigration. Neither of those things are the entire story here, at all.
To my mind this has been an issue, a growing issue, since at least the mid 00's (as in actual visibility). Remember the 'chav' insults and asbo's?

Do people honestly think the tories or labour are responsible for the rise in dangerous dogs? (for example)...because I don't.

Why do we, as a country, never want to look at our culture or ourselves? There's something else going on here, even if politics exacerbates it.

Liverpool and Wirral here, I'd say the same, it's no worse and probably better than 20 years ago. In Liverpool town centre there are more homeless people than 20 years ago but that started soon after the initial austerity cuts. But overall it doesn't feel more dangerous. Liverpool was always extremely poor though so maybe there's been less decline.

What’s with these barber shops? My nearest town would barely meet the criteria to be called a town and I think they are six of them now. Is it money laundering? There’s also an enormous nail bar, has taken over what used to be a grocers, with a small display of polish in the window and a desk and chair right at the back. Are these businesses similar?

Even on a UK holiday this year in a lovely village the road was chock full of revving, ear splitting car noise. The modded stuff. It's everywhere!
Again it feels like a male issue. Most of these are native white men, likewise the dangerous dog owners. They're not a stereotype, I see them more and more.

It may sound silly but I do get the feeling that (many) men are really fucking angry and they are taking all space back for themselves.

i could not agree more.