To think that if the school uniform states black shoes the kids should be wearing black shoes?

[Annabella92]

I probably am being unreasonable. I'm just frustrated by a daily battle I have with my child. The school dress code is black shoes with black or white socks. Every quarter the newsletter reiterates this and seeks to remind parents. So I make sure my child has black shoes, two pairs actually, one waterproof more expensive pair as they sometimes have to go through long wet grass to get to school. And every morning is a battle to get them to wear black shoes with black or white socks (which I bought plenty of too). They say everyone just wears their normal coloured trainers and whatever socks and when I go to school pickup, they're not wrong. So it seems this is voluntary in practice and next year i can save £100 on shoes and socks and not have to deal with the drama every morning. I'm.a natural rule follower but feel like an idiot

TLDR: if something is part of school dress code it should be enforced, or just dropped altogether?

That might well be the case.

But the OP's school has a uniform and school are sending letters asking parents to adhere to it. It's not hard to adhere to. There are no financial excuses either - if socks are a financial issue, then buy black and white only so there's nothing else (my DS only owns black ones actually). And ditto shoes. Kids need shoes so just buy them in black.

this bothers me so much with schools. my sons school has a uniform but they are not fussy about it (we are new to the school). told sons teacher that he is wearing normal shoes as needs new school shoes and can he wear a long sleeve top under his polo and teacher said he doesn’t mind. he said children are there to learn and he doesn’t care so much for the uniform. it’s brilliant. the children all still look smart but most importantly they are happy and feel supported

Your child will always push back on rules. Tell them two wrongs don’t make a right and stand firm.

Ah, the British school uniform fetish on full display here. You have been well and truly brainwashed.

We're talking about a primary school child here ffs.

Primaries can't enforce uniform rules, legally, can they? They can have uniforms and request that you buy uniforms but they can't sanction children for not following.

So the school is correct.

Up to you what you do in this situation. You can either choose to follow it or not. Depends on how important it is to you personally. If it's important to you, crack on spending money on school shoes and arguing with your kids. If it's not important to you, let them wear trainers and save yourself some money and aggravation.

It all changes at secondary anyway.

Our primary is the same they keep reminding us to send children in black shoes but take no other enforcement action. Id say it's about 50% wearing other colours. I think mandating footwear for little kids is ridiculous and did say to DS that the school don't seem to mind so maybe he could just wear his normal shoes. He won't have it though, he likes to follow rules, so we have to buy a pair or two of stupid black brogues every year. So stupid.

Primaries do tend to be a bit softer on it, partially because they can't really hold the students responsible. I remember my DDs Year 6 class starting to wear joggers, trainers etc. as the parents decided that they'd done paying for the uniform. It'll likely be a lot more rigorous at secondary

@Annabella92 it is not enforced because at primary school uniform can't be enforced; essentially it is guidance that they hope parents will follow but there can't be sanctions at primary level so it'skind of pointless

in most of continental Europe uniform is not worn for school it really doesn't cause huge problems as it's the norm from day one it is not comparable to a mufti day

while i'm not anti uniform it should be much simpler for primary I would just have black/ navy or grey bottoms and a polo shirt and a coloured sweatshirt. flat shoes or trainers, waterproof coat, PE kit any shorts and t shirt

The uniform thing in the UK is mental especially at secondary. I see zero benefit to dressing all teenagers of both sex like 1980s male office workers.

Its certainly not "preparing them for the workplace" unless maybe that workplace is Butlins? Although maybe even they've dropped the blazers!

If you (inexplicably) want them to all dress the same then just have a school t shirt/ sweatshirt and tell them to wear black on their lower half.

My dd primary are very strict about shoes but dd will only wear purple trainers (ASD) and they said it’s a reasonable adjustment. Maybe some of the children at OP school have some kind of similar issue

DC1’s secondary school tends to be very rigid about their uniform policy, children who don’t wear the correct uniform will get into trouble unless they have a uniform pass allowing them some leeway.

My younger DC’s primary school is much more casual about the uniform. There is one, but minor deviations are overlooked.
My DC have occasionally put their colourful trainers on instead of their school shoes on non-PE days, I’ve not noticed until they get out of the car at the school, and when I’ve apologised to the teacher manning the gate - usually the head teacher - the response has always been along the lines of “it doesn’t matter as long as the child’s here and ready to learn”

So it might be worth asking the teachers at your school whether the black shoe rule is one that they really care about, or whether it’s one that they’re happy to ignore.

I think it depends on why the rules aren't being followed. We have a lot of lower income families at my DD's school. While the school do have a prescribed uniform and send reminders to parents re adherence, they are also sensitive to the fact that some parents simply can't afford multiple pairs of shoes for their children.

Some of course just don't follow the rules because they don't want to/can't be bothered with the battle, but the school can't distinguish between the two without singling kids out.

Don't lower yourself to other people's standards

This all makes sense except why send the reminders which will, if nothing else, make people who would prefer to follow the rules but can't feel bad. I fully endorse the idea that making parents buy an extra pair of shoes for no reason (other than it apparently makes 6 year olds more visually pleasing) is ridiculous. So don't do it at all!

I always get the kids a kind of black runner/shoe alternative- I always feel for girls wearing eg patent shoes given they run around for about an hour a day!! Shoes just shouldn’t be a thing in primary!

They are. If you had a child that felt a bit different and wanted to fit in, would you chastise them to mind their own business? Do they have any sense of their own taste or preferences or do they wear a purely utilitarian uniform of your choosing. If not, you'll find their tastes and attitudes are very much influenced by their peers. In their likes and dislikes. These do not appear in a vacuum. If my child needed special shoes, and they wanted them to look as much like their friends as possible, I would absolutely sympathise with that. I wouldn't just bark at them that other people's shoes are none of their business. That would be cruel and ridiculous.

Yes! Stop regularly publishing the reminder in the newsletter. Enforce it or drop it.

It’s a lot deeper than that. But this is just a chat a forum, so I simplified.

Have you ever bought the £10 shoes from supermarkets? DS would completely wreck them within a fortnight, they'd be falling apart. They also hurt his feet.

Apart from that he is autistic and has sensory issues, so we ended up trying walking boots which were ok for a while, and school were fine with it (primary).

Then we had a couple of years where he would only wear wellies. Now he'll wear ankle wellies, which look smart enough for school and not that far off black shoes.

This. I haven't RTFT but I'm sure there are probably many factors involved, including the fact that people may not financially be in a position to buy a separate pair of school shoes.

If they have the rule it should be enforced.
However, I am one of those people who think all of these rules are ridiculous. I live in another country where there's no school uniform and also teach in a couple of schools there.
I don't think it matters what shoes kids have on their feet as long as they aren't inappropriate or dangerous for the school environment - ie. with heels or open-toed. All the energy and effort put into creating and enforcing these rules could be put iin somewhere else.

The question relates to all children at OPs child's school.

I agree with that, not sure why the school send reminders (they aren't frequent, maybe once or twice a school year).

Can't you ask a teacher - say that you've noticed other kids wearing non uniform shoes and will let DD do likewise unless you hear that the rule is being tightened up.

Bitter much!

Why is it crap parenting to have a different opinion to you. There are parts of my parenting I'm very strict about, particularly their manners and behaviour towards others.

Making them adhere to pointless and outdated rules isn't something I'm going to put much time and effort into.

I was able to send them to non uniform primaries, unfortunately there are no non uniform secondaries near us. They make the decision on what part of the uniform policy they follow, and they take the punishment if they get into trouble. As it is the school doesn't care touch about the uniform policy after the first couple of weeks at the start of year either.