To be fed up with an education system that ignores bright but quiet kids.

[ButterMints]

DD9 came home last night upset because once again her efforts in class had been ignored.

The teacher in the class had awarded class points to kids who had "worked hard in maths".

DD had got every question correct but didn't get a point. Points were awarded to children who didn't get 100%.

This seems to be a pattern with both my kids, where they are consistently ignored in favour of loud but less successful children.

My older child left primary school last year frustrated and disillusioned with school, having spent much of the time in class reading whilst others caught up with the work that they had already completed. And in their words, "I get 100% on my practice SATS papers every time and get nothing, but the kids who go from 50% to 60% get all the rewards."

I get it, I really do. Teachers have finite resources. But as a parent it's incredibly frustrating to once again find myself reassuring my child that their efforts do not go unnoticed.

It's a sad reflection of an education that is letting children down across the board. Schools desperately need more funding so that ALL children can reach their full potential.

I’ll let you off because you’re so young I have lipsticks older than you. But you’re embarrassing yourself here.

I agree. Yes, I was lucky academic work came easy but that meant I placed no value on what I achieved and because I never received any recognition from anyone else, I thought whatever I did wouldn't be good enough. Even 100% which meant it wasn't my work, but me.

@GrassIsPurpler actually my DD’s primary school was mainly concerned about the kids that were likely to fail SATS or be so disruptive that kids might be injured or unable to learn anything.

It was allegedly an outstanding primary school (the kids were bribed with promises of sweets, films instead of class time, and extra long breaktimes to behave well for OFSTED visits).

The laser focus on SATS results has actually shifted focus away from average kids, to focus on those right at the bottom of the pack.

Average and well-behaved is a gift easily taken for granted by a teaching staff under huge pressure to deliver results.

Patronising ageism really is not nice.

The whole idea of pitting kids against each other is pretty fucked up tbh - no matter hiw they dress it up. Can't they just enjoy learning or is that too radical a concept?

This completely misses the point. I very much doubt whether the 50/60 % actually work more but even if they do, the 100% ones who get ignored are bring let down. They have hearts too.

This is why we went private. I have a child who is very quiet and reserved but extremely academic. He would have completely been overlooked and passed over. I absolutely don't believe that a bright child will succeed anywhere. If it's the wrong environment it could be the worst thing for them.

SAME.

Oh I wish I had this problem!!

@ButterMints, I get it. I taught secondary DC and I awarded verbal praise for improvement to all DC but on prize giving the award from my subject always went to the DC with the highest grades over the year. I was HoD and that was my policy across my subject. Every single year I did this. Several DC who won an award told me it was their first because teachers in primary schools kept giving the awards to badly behaved DC who improved their behaviour for a week or so. Then they got placed above DC who worked hard and behaved well every day. I'm all for giving effort awards to some of these DC but not excellence or attainment awards if other quiet well behaved DC perform better.

I think most adults would be pissed off if their employer had an 'employee of the month' award, and it always went to Jonny because he usually dicks around and leaves early, but one time he actually did his job properly, rather than Stevie who quietly gets on with meeting all his targets.

Agree. Ironically, in the workplace, Jonny is the one who always seems to get promoted...

(Because people who quietly do their jobs are needed to keep doing just that. If you promote those people, the work will no longer get done and that's a problem. Kind of like how in school, there's no benefit to the school in pushing a child who's meeting the minimum reporting standards beyond that, so they focus on the others who aren't and leave those who are to their own devices.)

I agree with this. I feel my kids were largely ignored in primary school as they were no trouble, quiet and academic. It seemed like as they caused no issues, they were overlooked. The loud children who were often troublesome seemed to get praised for being ‘big characters’ and their bad and disruptive behaviour was minimised. They got the stars on the board, achiever of the week award early in the year and the parts they wanted in plays. It’s very demotivating for kids like mine. Two teachers actually forgot to give my child achiever of the week, when they’re all meant to get a turn, and they both said something like ‘oh I presumed they had already had it as they always do good work and are so good’. One added ‘ they’re such an easy child, I forget they’re there’. Like wtf? That summed up our primary school experience really.

It’s was/is a totally different story in secondary school. My kids academic ability, effort and good behaviour was/is recognised regularly. Awards go to children who are consistently well behaved and consistently put in effort as well as those who achieve well academically. Secondary school isn’t perfect but my children were/are actually seen.

Its a shame though because my children weren’t/aren’t as bothered about being recognised/praised as they’ve got older, they know that what matters is doing well for their own future, not what a teacher thinks, but it did matter to them when them when they were younger at primary school.

Hmm, your children aren’t a reflection of an entire education system though, what you’re saying is anecdotal and could be completely unique to your children’s school and the teachers they have. But anyway, I mean it might be that the teacher is trying to praise those whose need an incentive such as positive reinforcement to keep trying rather than ignoring your children’s efforts. There is also the saying; ‘shy bairns get nowt,’ which even as someone who is inherently not super confident and loud, is somewhat true, unfortunately. Who do you remember from school? The quiet kid in the corner or the louder ones?

I agree with you, OP. When I was a teacher (years 5/6), I would've preferred to have been more able to recognise those who consistently worked sensibly and achieved highly using the school's various rewards systems. However, we were explicitly told that the most challenging pupils had to receive the certificates, extra playtime, etc as it would motivate them to continue to improve/ behave. It didn't. Plus, many of the 'good' children missed out on opportunities such as becoming a form rep for the same reason.

Despite this unwritten policy, the parents of the badly behaved would always complain that the 'bright kids' were receiving all the praise and shout about how unfair I was being to her darling who only misbehaved in class as I was a crap teacher.

It is interesting that there are still invisible kids.

Academically good, vocally quiet, behaviour as expected.

As i said... my girls were like that .... at primary school 18 years ago. I was like that 50 years ago. Times don't change much really....

DD used to get in trouble repeatedly for sitting doing nothing in maths. Has she done all the work I asked? Yes, and the extension work. And there's no other work until everyone else is finished. So, I say to the teacher, it's quite good for you really she is sitting quietly doing nothing and not causing trouble, given there is nothing for her to do. Yet, she kept getting in trouble for it🤯

I don't agree with all the arbitrary prizes and rewards, especially when it just goes around the whole class in turn.

Having said that, the grades at the end are the only thing that's important and that's really what kids should be told.

I have DC with a real mix of abilities - one is quiet and studious and just gets on with it what ever life throws at him . Getting zero rewards has made no difference to him at all - it has taught him to just shrug his shoulders though and get on with the task in hand without being celebrated . That’s part of life.

On the other hand the DC that struggles really does benefit from a bit of praise

I disagree. You don't know how hard that child worked to get 100%. The 50% child may be smart enough to achieve100%, but just not have bothered. Each individual is different. DD paid absolutely no attention to geography because she hates it and it reflected in her grade, which was abismal! On the other hand, she worked really hard on history (which she isn't particularly good at) and achieved quite a high grade.

Lots of schools don’t praise all abilities though, that’s the issue. They don’t praise higher achieving children, they’re often just ignored. If they praised both, that would be great.

It’s the same with behaviour, kids that consistently behave well get ignored, those that behave well for an hour get rewarded. Reward them by all means to encourage them, but don’t leave out the kids who consistently show good behaviour because when you’re say 7, it feels very unfair that you behave well all the time but never get chosen for extra playtime or iPad time or whatever.

I agree with the original post here. What is the point in giving some children extra time or help for exams when they won't get that in the real world? OK, so you got a B instead of a C in maths, which later means you get X job...and now you can't do said job as the deadlines are too tight and you don't have the extra help you had all the way through your education. So you end up either being ultra stressed and feeling a failure, or end up fired, or both!

What's wrong with acknowledging that not everyone can get things done well in a certain timeframe?

I also agree with the original poster. Exams are to test how many questions can be answered in a given time. Making the time flexible so that each child can answer the same number of questions makes the whole thing a pointless exercise.

As pp said, might as well just give everyone a B and be done with it.

I think it depends what we think the purpose of exams is and what they are measuring.

Is it to measure how quickly you can write for instance? Will that impact in your job in maths at a later point. If your extra time is because you write slowly due to a physical disability for instance. I never handwrite anything, ever.

My friends son is blind. It takes longer to read braille than print apparently. is reading the question quickly something we are actually wanting to measure. It might be. His employers know he is blind. His job doesn't involve reading questions quickly. He still needed to demonstrate his comprehension skills somehow though.

I worked in a prestigious private school where almost half the kids got extra time in exams or some preferential treatment - they could use a laptop as their handwriting was a bit slow, they could do their exams in a separate room so they could have a bit of a walk around if they felt like it, they needed extra time as they has some anxieties etc. Parents paid £200 for a private assessment.

My autistic son has slower cognitive processing, are you saying that he’s going to fail in life anyway so let’s start with school?? Don’t be ridiculous.