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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To want a way to label the reasonable fear of the variety of Islam that wishes to impose Sharia law?

492 replies

Oodiks · 22/11/2024 19:40

I understand that there are different sects within Islam and that while some pose no concerns, others do. I am horrified at the type of Sharia law imposed in Iran, Saudi Arabia, and Afghanistan, which denies women human rights, but it's hard to talk about those reasonable fears without being labelled Islamophobic. It's not unreasonable to fear a religion that imposes such harsh lives on women.

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JaneJeffer · 22/11/2024 20:47

soupfiend · 22/11/2024 20:04

Actually people have said that criticism of Hamas comes from Islamophobia. So it does get misused and bandied about. Apparently if you highlight that Hamas are terrorists and just as violent and unhinged as the current Israeli strategy, you're racist and Islamophobic. Read any thread here about it.

Much like being labelled antisemitic for criticising the Israeli government

Silvan · 22/11/2024 20:48

I would add it's really important to be able to say what you do and don't like about some religions or cultures. It's also fine to be unhappy about the rapid social or cultural change that sometimes goes alongside mass immigration.

What (obviously) isn't fine is hostility towards individuals, sneering or disgust towards a particular group, calling for violence or discrimination and so on.

Tabitabtab · 22/11/2024 20:48

Sharia Law is just God's law as to how humans and society should behave

JaneJeffer · 22/11/2024 20:49

this is also seen in hardline Christmas groups
Santanists?

hazelnutvanillalatte · 22/11/2024 20:49

headstone · 22/11/2024 20:45

You’re right hazelnutvanillalatte Saudi Arabia was a place full of naice white people until they started letting Muslims in, now look at it.

Islam isn't a race. HTH

XmasMarkets · 22/11/2024 20:50

Tabitabtab · 22/11/2024 20:48

Sharia Law is just God's law as to how humans and society should behave

So made up then.

Mumblechum0 · 22/11/2024 20:50

Sharia law is very much a thing in the UK. I’m a willwriter and several prospective clients have requested Sharia wills, whereby sons get twice as much inheritance as daughters.

ive always turned down the work as it goes against my ethics but plenty of firms will happily do them.

Completelyjo · 22/11/2024 20:50

Sometimeswinning · 22/11/2024 20:43

Really? You don’t think there are any Sharia councils in the uk? Hint: There are.

Like someone said above though I’m way beyond anyone accusing me of any isms. I really don’t care. Op can ask a question and if you’re offended make sure your defence isn’t completely ignorant of facts.

That’s got nothing to do with “law” though.
There’s a Sharia council a handful of minutes from me, if an Islamic couple want them to deal with their divorce that’s on them, it doesn’t infringe in my rights in any way.
Do I disagree with it? To an extent yes because I come from another part of the UK where women would also have to seek advice from the church and the church encouraged them to stay in shitty situations.
Ultimately people are free to take part in a religion of their choosing though whether or not any of us think it’s valid.

Kwiaenrker · 22/11/2024 20:51

This reply has been deleted

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Don't be so ridiculous

username8348 · 22/11/2024 20:54

Tabitabtab · 22/11/2024 20:48

Sharia Law is just God's law as to how humans and society should behave

I'm an atheist.

Precipice · 22/11/2024 20:55

Longtimelurkerfinallyposts · 22/11/2024 20:17

If you live in the UK it's not a reasonable fear at all.

If you live in the US, it'd be reasonable to fear Christanity being weaponised against women in a very similar way to what happens in Muslim countries.

If you just identified as 'feminist' it would be very clear to most people that you were opposed to any legal framework that treated women as second class citizens, whatever religious beliefs are being used as an excuse to create that system. But please don't use that word if you aren't actually prepared to let women who live in places like Iran, Afghanistan and Saudi Arabia tell you what they want their lives to be like.

What is it that you mean with your last sentence?

If even the majority of women in (whatever country) were to freely express that they wanted to be subject to restrictions by law and custom that their male peers are not, it does not follow that feminists should be in agreement. Feminism is not about women's choices, alone or for the majority. Feminism is about the social and legal liberation of women.

Tabitabtab · 22/11/2024 20:57

XmasMarkets · 22/11/2024 20:50

So made up then.

It genuinely could be by divine decree. I've been on my own spiritual journey for a few years and there are times I genuinely do believe the Islam may be the truth. I toy between Christianity and Islam.

okright · 22/11/2024 21:00

I dislike and fearful of the unfeminist elements of it. I hate to see women fully covered. I despair for women living in extreme regimes.

Oodiks · 22/11/2024 21:00

Tabitabtab · 22/11/2024 20:48

Sharia Law is just God's law as to how humans and society should behave

Your god, maybe; I’m an atheist.

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kazzieB · 22/11/2024 21:02

It bothers me that religions enforce rules like headscarves, burqas, etc. Don't fucking tell me what to do. See also women not allowed to become priests and the misogynistic Bible stuff. None of this is divine law handed down from a booming voice in the clouds, it's all just stuff some bloke made up. That's all it is.

Completelyjo · 22/11/2024 21:03

Tabitabtab · 22/11/2024 20:57

It genuinely could be by divine decree. I've been on my own spiritual journey for a few years and there are times I genuinely do believe the Islam may be the truth. I toy between Christianity and Islam.

Your spiritual journey is and should be irrelevant to the law of the land.

Sharia law should have nothing to do with the law in a secular country, neither should the ten commandments or the golden plates of Joseph Smith!

Womblingmerrily · 22/11/2024 21:04

This is Stacey Dooley's visit back to her home town in Luton.

I think this demonstrates that there is something to fear from fundamentalist Islam in the UK.

I fear it. It really depends where you live, but if you live in an area that has a large and growing population of people who believe in a fundamentalist form of Islam then I think this represents a danger to some women in that area who are seen in a negative way and can be subject to insults and intimidation particularly from young men and women who have been taught they are trash, as seen in this video where Stacey is insulted and intimidated by individuals.

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Vanessashanessajenkins2 · 22/11/2024 21:04

I'm muslim. I married a fellow indian muslim when I was very young in a quasi arranged marriage. I met him and got to know him. Thought I liked him.

He was okay when we lived together, however he started a drug addiction which led to me funding everything, him losing his job, getting addicted to all sorts and stealing money from me. He went out to buy drugs once and left the main door outside unlocked and we got robbed. He started to beat me when I refused to have sex with him.

I had no idea what to do. My mum wasn't supportive and wanted me to change him.

I ended up leaving them all and moving to a different city. Got a new job. I was 22 and had never lived by myself before without my family.

I went to the sharia council in Dewsbury and spoke to an imam about my situation. He met my ex and persuaded him to give me a divorce. I got a divorce and moved on, remarried ( an english legal wedding) and had kids to a good man.

I don't know much about sharia law although the Islamic finance makes sense to me (I work in the finance industry). It was horrid that my ex had to give me a divorce but that's just how it is and I had go work with the tools that were available to me. I'm glad the imam listened to me and didn't ask me to go back to him.

I know girls that are now refusing to go abroad and threatening families with calling the police if they are forced to marry. I really hope, here at least things are changing.

I do pray for my cousins in Kabul who had to leave university and now can't even have a mobile phone. I always try to be grateful and remind myself how lucky I am.

kazzieB · 22/11/2024 21:05

T4phage · 22/11/2024 20:45

I think climate change will increase the numbers of muslim migrants coming here and at some point the balance will tip towards a change of governance in the country in order to reflect the needs and wants of its citizens.

Hmmm. I believe this is what's known as the Great Replacement Theory. You could maybe email your post to the Spectator's letters page. I bet they'd print it.

T4phage · 22/11/2024 21:09

kazzieB · 22/11/2024 21:05

Hmmm. I believe this is what's known as the Great Replacement Theory. You could maybe email your post to the Spectator's letters page. I bet they'd print it.

Hardly. It's logical to assume that a country with a rapidly falling birthrate and an influx of people coming from other countries will eventually be overtaken.

Not everything is a conspiracy theory even if some conspiracy theorists have adopted some parts of it and twisted it into their own belief system.

Naunet · 22/11/2024 21:10

Tabitabtab · 22/11/2024 20:57

It genuinely could be by divine decree. I've been on my own spiritual journey for a few years and there are times I genuinely do believe the Islam may be the truth. I toy between Christianity and Islam.

What are basing this on? Have you tried out all 4000 odd religions? All the different gods? You presumably don't believe in all of them? Atheists just believe in one less than you do.

Annabella92 · 22/11/2024 21:22

This reply has been deleted

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Don't be so silly and naive.

turbonerd · 22/11/2024 21:27

Dariamar · 22/11/2024 20:08

I don't know why the Muslim religion attracts so many extremists...because on its own it's peaceful religion...not feminist but not violent. But with all the calls to Jihad, Sharia law...it is now something people fear. If even 40% of people In Gaza support Hamas, that is a lot of people following an extremist ideology and it will take a lot to get to peace from that start point for example.

It is not a peaceful religion.
Like many other religions it is a warrior religion.

It was created to unite arabian tribes in a fight over land and trade. It’s done pretty well.

Edited: the goal of Islam is to have Sharia Law. That is not to say that all muslims want that. But the Quran abiding devotees do want that.
Just like some (many) Christians would like their religion to be reflected in the laws in their countries, etc.

I wouldn’t want either. Because I am a woman, and I like the rights I have equally to men, and because it took a bloody long time to get them in the first place!

Oodiks · 22/11/2024 21:36

Batmanisaplaceinturkey · 22/11/2024 20:05

Oh here we go again, another thread about Islam, how Muslims want to impose Sharia law blah blah yawn.

You don't think Muslims want to impose Sharia law?

OP posts:
Oodiks · 22/11/2024 21:38

JaneJeffer · 22/11/2024 20:49

this is also seen in hardline Christmas groups
Santanists?

LOL

OP posts: