Should we be worried about war

[Seasidesand76]

Seen a lot in the news about Ukraine using USA missiles against Russia. I've been thinking more along the lines that it won't start a WW3 and will resolve at some point without the UK getting directly involved in war. But there seems to be more and more tension and threats of an all out war recently.

Should we be worried about WW3? I haven't been prepping or anything but does make me wonder if I should start getting a few days worth of food in case. At the same time I don't want to go down the prepper hole and start getting over the top.

@SoiledMyselfDuringSomeTurbulence

OK let's settle on a factual definition of:

""Ukraine has a corruption index that places it 104th out of 180 countries, with for comparison a corruption worse than Zambia but better than Yemen."

Now if you think that is acceptable then fine but I certainly don't want to see UK taxpayers money being sent to such a corrupt nation in the form of military aid.

Especially when you consider that yesterday the Government made £500 million of defence cuts including the only two amphibious assault ships that support the Royal Marines. At the same time the UK government is spending £3 billion a year in military support to Ukraine.

Actually I got it from Wikipedia or are you suggesting that Wiki has now been taken over by the alternative right Quorn folk or whatever other conspiracy theory.

The fact is Ukraine has a corruption score of 104 out of 180 countries placing it worse than Zambia.

If you want to see UK taxpayers money being sent to a corrupt country then please write them a cheque. Personally I would rather see UK taxpayers money being spent on UK issues including UK defence.

Didn't say anything about acceptable, so that's a strawman. I'm talking only about facts here. Actual ones, not anyone's feelz. I don't care about those. You are entitled to whatever thought process led you not to want to arm Ukraine against a much more corrupt nation, on the grounds of corruption. It takes all sorts.

Ukraine is not one of the most corrupt countries in the world, nor in the northern hemisphere. Both of those claims were wrong.

Is there a reason why Zambia has taken on such importance in this discussion, by the way?

The world is turning increasingly right wing. When it comes to politics theae days, stupidity and ignorance is admired. I hear it everywhere I go. Trump is the straw that will break the camels back. Yet I hear people who think he's a good choice!! And that's in the UK!! Insanity.

Sure, Blinken, Sherman and Nuland spent a lot of time serving in military operations. They gave Biden amazingly brilliant advice. Let's poke Russia more! Like they didn't poke it enough for 10 years or so.
Hopefully Russia won't respond.

Oh I don’t doubt we are closer to war. Biden has seen to that with his move on ATACMS and now a number of British Storm Shadow missiles have been launched into Russia. 🤦‍♀️

I’m not pro-Russia by any stretch but I think the notion that Russia wants to expand westward is nonsense. They have 11 time zones in Russia and no shortage of land. Putin is not Hitler 2.0 despite every attempt to characterise him as such.

I think Russia will respond, unfortunately. You can only poke a bear so much.

Yet they still invaded and continue to occupy land, so evidently they feel they lack something. More warm water port access, perhaps. For such a large country they don't have a lot of that.

This.

I am in my 60s and learned many years ago to not worry about things I have absolutely no control over until they happen.

You can give way too much headspace to something that may never happen.

Here’s a useful way to spend ten minutes.

That's probably what other countries said when the British Empire colonized most of the world!

Lmao. I'm familiar with Jeffrey's offerings!

@SoiledMyselfDuringSomeTurbulence

So would you agree that spending £3 billion of UK taxpayers money on military aid to Ukraine whilst simultaneously cutting £500 million from the UK defence budget is not in the best interests of the UK or UK taxpayers?

If they do, they'll retaliate against Ukraine, with more death and more destruction to follow. They know, like everybody else, that the nuclear alternative will atract a chain reaction which will end the world as we know it.
Blinken said that they have to make sure that every dollar at US's disposal must be pushed out the door, to Ukraine, between now and January. They are desperate to keep this war going

Depends really. Assisting the Ukrainians to fight Russia well away from us is absolutely in the interests of UK taxpayers. The UK needs Russia to do badly out of this, because the risk to us becomes greater when they're incentivised to attack more in Europe. I'm open to sensible arguments, note sensible, about how that should look.

If you're proposing that eg we give Ukraine £2 billion and spend the difference on some other aspect of defence, I'm ready to listen to that argument. Same with if you're suggesting giving more overall and have ideas as to how to fund that. Knowing that it's best for us to send military aid to Ukraine doesn't mean accepting that any one plan must be the best way to do it.

But obviously if your suggestion was something irredeemably fuckwitted like cutting all military aid to Ukraine, that wouldn't be worth anything other than derisory laughter.

But thats not what is happening, the £500m is being kept in the MODs budget, to be better spent.

Whats the point in spending money on Drones that don't work, Ships that have had it? or Helicopters that are 50 years old.

Plus all Healey has done is bought fwd their decommission dates.

They've just responded.

ICBM with a conventional warhead.

How worried is UK now about the poor East Europeans, of how they will be conquered by the big, mean Russia. Between WWII and 1989, they didn't give a shit about them. Between 1990 and 2014 they didn't know where the East European countries are on the map. Now is for the UK tax payer interest.
Everybody was fine until NATO pushed it's boundaries towards Russia's border. They were repeateadly reasured that Nato border will stop at Germany's border after reunification. When Clinton started to push for NATO expansion, all the Russian protests were dismissed. By 2008 the Baltic states were in NATO, right at the border with Russia, but was it enough?! no. Let's get Ukraine and Georgia as well!

Instead of economic support and help to bring the east european economies to the same level as the West, instead of trying to pull Russia towards Europe, send real economists to help and consulte in times of desperate chaos, offer solutions to facilitate the normal functioning of the newly "democratic" states, how about we concentrate on military expansion.

They're reducing the MOD expenditure by £500m by bringing forward the decommissioning of ships that haven't put to sea in years and aren't fit to go to see, but are tying up resources and costing the MOD cash to keep them secure and afloat.

The replacements aren't ready, but the ships being scrapped aren't currently usable. It's very unlikely they could be made usable if they were needed. This is just the consequence of not investing early enough and not having a pipeline of replacements coming through.

Yes. Sad. They say it wasn'r intercontinental, but doesn't make much of a difference anyway

The EU has invested hugely in the eastern accession states.

Russia hasn't been honest in its dealings with the west since Putin took over. It was dishonest with Ukraine, breaking promises left and right.

They did. But did they have a supervising tool, to check where that money went? It lined many pockets, giving birth to a new class, who never worked for money, but easily stole it.

I'm not saying Putin is some saint, I listened to him a handful of times in interviews, and he lies and embelishes like any other politician, maybe more.
I obviously don't know the man, but I know a bit about the people. They are good, resilient, country loving, very proud people, who grew more and more resentful towards the West as they saw how their country is treated with dismisal and condescension.

All this obsession to erode Russia started right after the dismantling of USSR, well before Putin

I read few posts on this forum related to the conflict and it's escalation. Most of the posters write about Russia like it's a big clown, a big joke. So arrogant! The mighty West will wiggle it's finger and Russia will go back in it's corner, trembling in fear. That if they dare launch nuclear warheads towards UK, they'll be blown to smitereens by the allies. It would be funny, if it wasn't so sad.

I wouldn't worry about bombs, they will just send some more Novichok.

You can consider is protecting yourselves but it's an enemy you can't see or guage. Alongside the Russians we have been seeding immigrants for years if they want to take it they will. As a society we are wide open. Those are the facts and little we can do.

It is also the fact that we are being pumped nothing but doom and gloom by the media. No wonder there is so much depression and anxiety.

Turn off your TV, Live your life, grow some veg, get a wind up radio, you will feel in control even if in reality really no one is.

I'm sure Trump will calm things and start a dialog as it's in now way beneficial to anyone .hopefully he can help rid us of Starmer and his disasterous party too .