Is neighbour overstepping?

[Hereforthekickz]

I have posted previously about my elderly Dads recent accident. Just to recap….
Dad had a fall 5 months ago and ended up in and out of ICU as he suffered a severe brain injury. He has a female neighbour who he has lived next door to for years. She is the same age as Dad (78). They didn’t have much to do with each other but had polite conversation.

When I went to his house after the accident she had pushed a note through the letter box as she was concerned she hadn’t seen him so I explained the situation and we exchanged telephone numbers in case something happened at his house.

Since then she has been messaging me often or calling. She is nice enough but I am starting to feel a bit uncomfortable. Myself and Dad are private people and Dad has lost mental capacity. I am not sure he would want her knowing his personal situation and he has said in the past that she can be nosy and interfering.

I feel like I have told her too much about Dads situation without thinking. I guess I was grateful for any support in the beginning. In the beginning, she kept saying she would be very upset if he went in a nursing home and that he should be at home but she didn’t understand the situation and that Dad would not be safe at home. I really felt like this was none of her business and her comments made me angry. She messaged me often asking how Dad was.

She went to visit him with her daughter in the nursing home last week. I was really surprised by this and I don’t know her daughter at all. She called me to tell me they both cried after seeing him and her daughter said “don’t worry Mum, I will never put you in a home”. I didn’t like this comment as again, I had no choice. He is too ill to be at home and I felt like I had to explain myself to her.

She is visiting him again before Christmas and she has bought sweets for the staff.

She asked me what was happening to his council house and then kept saying “you can’t give it up as he will be moving back in the future” (He will never be able to move back).

When she visited the home, she told staff he needed speech therapy and staff told her that I was dealing with it as his advocate.

Now don’t get me wrong, part of me thinks she is kind and is concerned about my Dad but another part of me is concerned that she is overstepping and getting too involved. She doesn’t understand the full situation and she doesn’t need to but she is giving advice and asking about things that have nothing to do with her. I don’t need her to watch his house as I am there often checking his mail.

The gas safety man came to my Dads the other day to check his boiler and her daughter went out and told him there was no point checking it because he was in a nursing home, I know it sounds like I am being difficult but I didn’t want him knowing. I was aware and was dealing with it via the council.

AIBU? Should I be grateful for her concern and stop being paranoid?

I think you are being unreasonable. Could you not take comfort that she cares for your Father. Be happy with the occasional visit to the care home. The visits are rarely more than an hour and staff won't divulge person information if the visitor is not in the care plan. One visit and another planned before Christmas is hardly overstepping. Some sweets for the staff is a kind gesture. Why would you deny your Father that company?

I was delighted when the family next door to my elderly mother would visit my mum in the care home and take her little gifts. It was break in the monotony of her day.

I wouldn't read too much into the daughter's 'Dont worry mum' comment. The son of my mum's cousin ( my second cousin) said exactly the same to me and even suggested her taking her out to live with them. Well 18 months later his Father's dementia had advanced with night time wanderings resulted in missing person searches and injuries, so his Father had to go into a home. He did apologise for the comments. Nobody wants it to happen, a lot they will be able to manage it but when the time comes.

You say the neighbour is the same age - I think there are other factors, she is probably projecting. Is this her life if she has a fall? Will people look out for her? She may be worried about who moves into the next property - perhaps not an elderly gentleman who keeps himself to himself?

Sometimes when we're upset we focus our feelings on other people. I think you've been overthinking this.

I think her comment about her daughter was uncalled for. However it was nice of her to visit your dad. I also wonder why you don't want her keeping an eye on the house if it's empty.

I'd also be annoyed that she was speaking to staff about his care but she seems harmless enough. (You should meet my mum's neighbour).

Regarding her questions, just thank her for her concern and tell her he's fine.

I'm sorry about your dad💐

yanbu. The comments about the home were horrible and must have been really hurtful. At best, she’s thoughtless and can’t empathise with what you’re going through. At worst she’s nosy and interfering like your dad thought.

I would probably kill with kindness. Go round with a box of chocolates at Christmas and say, ‘thank you for all your concern at this difficult time. We are over the crisis now and this is the new reality, so I don’t need your help anymore. I wish you all the best…’ and then just ignore or slow fade on her texts and calls.

I’m so sorry for what you’re going through.

YANBU OP. I don’t think you’re being paranoid either.

The visits, checking in and bringing treats for the staff are a nice touch. But, the comments re: “she would be very upset if he went in a nursing home” are uncalled for, as well as her telling other people his/your business.

She may be lonely, bored and getting extra involved just for something to keep her occupied. She may be absolutely lovely and means well and is just ignorant and clumsy with her words. Or she may be deliberately spiteful and a ‘busy bod’ with form for this type of behaviour.

All you can do going forwards is lower the contact. If she calls you, don’t answer. If she messages you, don’t respond. If she sees you going to and from your dads house tell her “Sorry I can’t stop and chat”.

I’m sure as time goes on the contact will eventually lessen, her visits to the nursing home will become less frequent and there will be a point in future where you will never see her again.

Just concentrate on your dad at present and try and not let her comments or behaviour get to you or affect you anymore.

I'd let it go - she is probably just being thoughtless, voicing her own fears about her own vulnerability.

It's not like you'll have to put up with this for long as I can't see how he can keep the tenancy on the council house much longer given he isn't living there and won't be returning, unless I have the wrong end of the stick and you're living there?

If you do see the daughter again I would tell her to butt out, you're dealing with the house and any related issues, so has no business telling anyone what to do there (couch this as politely or not, as you like!).

This woman and her daughter seem a couple of overbearing nosey bitches who need to butt out. Too much damn time on their hands by the sound of it.

Seems as if this neighbour has experience of trying to organise other people's lives - without bothering to ask if it's OK.

I think the advice above about you maybe overthinking things a bit is valid. With much of it, it just doesn’t really matter. Her comments and judgement are irrelevant. She has no power. Let it wash over you.

However, is your dad in a fit state to consent to the visits?

If not, since he’s expressed concern about her nosiness before, I would be a bit concerned that he’s being taken advantage of with her visiting. Do you know how he feels about it?

Well I don't know, I would take it badly. I would feel she is being judgy and making assumptions with her nursing home comments. People find them very easy to make but the reality is, family members can't provide the needs. If he needs lifting with equipment that's a two person requirement with training. Does she want to foot the bill for daily private carers? I don't think so. Trying to keep a parent home when they require around the clock care can be more damaging and risky depending on their needs. They just have their fairytale image though and find it easier to paint a sob story then deal with reality as it is too close to home.

If heaven forbid something happens to your neighbour, the daughter will eat her words when she sees what is required and the training needed with good proper care. That's why you have nursing homes with trained staff and a nurse.

I had this exact same situation with a relative. All boiled down to the fact she didn't know who would move in next door when we returned the house. Sorry about your dad.

YANBU. As they’d had little to do with each other before your father’s health declined it seems intrusive to now be getting so involved with their opinions, comments and visiting him; especially if he doesn’t speak as well as he did and can’t tell them he wants his privacy. They sound like the sort of people who insinuate themselves into other people’s lives and problems for an ego boost- to show the world how caring they are even when that “care” is unwelcome.

They are not taking your father’s feelings into consideration (given he’d previously had little to do with them), they don’t give a toss about your feelings and they stupidly told the engineer that his house is unoccupied. Hopefully he is trustworthy.

You’re in a difficult position and it’s very sad when we are faced with a parent needing residential care. I hope you have someone looking out for you too. I would let the staff know the minimal extent of your father’s relationship with these people. Maybe they will agree imposing on a man who cannot say no is intrusive and deal with them accordingly.

These clangers on always appear. It's the helpful guise so they can nose about your life and enjoy watching your misery. Any attempt to stop them is met with a 'I was only being helpful'.

I'd pop by and say that your dad has been upset after both her visits and say that you would prefer h3r not to visit anymore. You can tell the care home not to grant her access too.

We see it all the time in hospital, a neighbour or distant friend/relative turn up, under the pretense of helping and caring. But often they cause upset for everyone, staff, patients, family that are dealing with the day to day slog of a poorly mum/dad.

I think they have crossed a line and I would stop engaging with them.

Tell both of the annoying fuckers to fuck off and get a life of their own. Nutters

Personally I'd be furious and I think I'd be telling her.

Thank you everyone for your honest comments and taking the time to reply.

Just to answer some points….

I would never deny Dad a visit because he needs stimulation, it’s good for anyone with memory issues. However, Dad does not have capacity to make his own decisions and I do know that he would not choose to be in her company. In all honesty, she got on his nerves and he thought she was nosy and pushy.

She did message me a couple of times in the beginning if I needed to know anything about the house (someone delivered a parcel etc). I am at his home frequently to do checks. Dad is being assessed currently to see who pays for his care so I didn’t want anyone associated with the council knowing he was in a nursing home until we know for definite that he won’t be coming home. Anyway, I don’t think it was up to them to say that.

I do think she is being kind to a point. I do feel uncomfortable at some of her remarks and I am overthinking things just because it has been such a difficult and emotionally challenging time. I am my Dads only advocate and I dont think he would be happy that she is getting so involved.

She hurt my feelings when she kept saying that he needs to come home. She said she would get the neighbours to help him at home. I tried to explain he needed 24 hour care but then wondered why I was having to explain myself to her. There are other things that she says that make me uncomfortable like saying she goes to Church and prays for him and then makes racial comments about people taking all the benefits. It’s just not what I am about.

I have only met the daughter once and the neighbour a couple of times.

❤️

Just to add….
She told me how she and her daughter cried when they left the home saying it wasn’t the man they once knew but they didn’t really know him unless they had a relationship I never knew about! Which I doubt!

She gave her opinion that it was a very nice home and that, if he wasn’t coming home, I should keep him there. Again, I have to think how I would deal with this if the boot were on the other foot. I wouldn’t give any opinion or make comments about him being in a home. It’s be hard enough to come to terms with.

Nope. The comment from her daughter would have been enough for me to tell her to step back.

I'd be quite firm and tell her he wouldn't want her visiting so don't go again.

Her comments about your DF being in a home are hurtful when you are doing what is best for him.
We had a similar situation with a neighbour of MIL when she was terminally ill. He kept telling her carers that he was doing shopping for her and looking after her, and asking questions about her flat.
When we went to hers after the funeral there was a note pinned to the door from another neighbour asking us to call him before the estate agents if we were putting the flat up for sale. Not even sorry for your loss etc.
Some people are genuine but others have ulterior motives.

I read your update, please be assured you know your Father is in the right place. You know what his care needs are - I said further up that a visit once or twice to the care home is hardly overstepping but their comments are definitely overstepping.

Tell them you find their comments upsetting. Your Father has been assessed by professionals not an elderly neighbour. I still think the woman under playing your Father's condition because she sees her own fate - Verbal incontinence needs to be nipped in the bud.

@Kitkatcatflap I really appreciate your view and comments.

I came here to get other people’s opinions because it’s a very emotional experience and I don’t want my reaction to be based on my emotions. I don’t want to shut people out that are good for my Dads wellbeing and mine.

As you can imagine, I have realised through all of this that some people are not genuine and have a different agenda and that some can’t or won’t offer me the support I need at times. Some have surprised me, some not so much. I am getting stronger now and I don’t want these types in my life. Dad doesn’t suffer fools!

@mnreader she has only been once in 45 days to visit him with her daughter. Dad would not remember the visit or who she is and staff didn’t say he was agitated or upset with the visit.

She is planning another visit before Christmas.

Hurtful and annoying but I wouldn't assume bad intentions, just ignorance and poor empathy plus projecting her own worries for the future.

It's nice he has an extra occasional visitor. Perhaps have a frank in person conversation with her to manage things?

'Madge, it's nice if you want to visit Dad but please we've assessed his situation and needs thoroughly and the home is the most suitable fit for him now. Unfortunately it's looking unlikely he'll be moving back home so it's best we don't get his hopes up or confuse him. We will manage the house in due course but for now, it needs to be safely maintained so any gas engineers etc need access. Please call me if you have concerns rather than turning them away'

Don't show excessive gratitude or tell her much personal information about your dad but let her know politely what his and your boundaries are whilst allowing her to visit if she wants.

Could be worth speaking to staff too so they know who she is and what to expect

It does sound like she is overstepping somewhat and some of her comments are not great.

However, it is often hard for people to get the balance right between not caring at all and caring too much.

I am wondering from what you say whether most of her concern stems from the fact that if your Dad leaves she will get new neighbours and is worried about how that will turn out.

Obviously she is also probably worried about herself and what might happen under similar circumstances, which might make her more personally involved because she sees herself in the same situation possibly.

And because she is retired maybe she doesn't have a huge amount to do with her time so she can take a greater interest.

Sorry your dad is so poorly. I'd make a visit to her before Christmas (and to your father's home to collect any mail etc.). I'd tell her thank you for looking in on Dad before he left but you'd actually prefer it if they didn't visit. He's not up for visits outside of the immediate family now so while she may have good intentions, no more visits.

Also comments to people calling at the house are to stop as they have no idea what the plans are for it. You could decide to gut the place and put it on the market or you could rent it out or whatever - it's none of their business.

You will keep her informed as to your Dad's condition (keep it very bland if you can) and leave it at that.

I'd consider bringing her a bunch of flowers or something (nothing too expensive) as a thank you but her concern can stop now. She may be eyeing up the place for her daughter or other relatives.

Also if you haven't started the process already, you might want to get utilities moved into your name or give them regular readings of the meters. Also get some security on the house (Ring doorbell, alarm etc.) so that you can monitor the place remotely.

Good luck with it all.