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Sara Sharif case - update - horrifying

1000 replies

amIloud · 13/11/2024 12:21

This case is just beyond the realms of horrifying,

www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cgl461xwg3do

This poor child.

OP posts:
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34
Bignanna · 12/12/2024 19:10

amIloud · 12/12/2024 17:43

If this isn't whole life I don't know what is. I hope the CPS appeal the sentence if it's not whole life.

Whole life meaning literally that, hopefully.

Turmerictolly · 12/12/2024 19:14

The Family Court process is opaque but I expect the details about how/why it was decided to return her to her father will come out when there is a public review.

Anonymousess · 12/12/2024 19:43

Peonies007 · 12/12/2024 18:56

There is certailnly 1 (13 yo), but it seems she has another older sibling or someone similar age. Check child Z and U
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-14183893/amp/Sara-Sharifs-childhood-protection-order-killer-father.html

The article I linked earlier has the information you’re after, here’s a bit of it🙂

The documents disclosed to the media show that Surrey County Council first had contact with Sharif and Sara’s mother, Olga Sharif, in 2010 – more than two years before Sara was born – having received “referrals indicative of neglect” relating to her two older siblings, known only as Z and U.

The authority began the first set of care proceedings in relation to Z and U in January 2013, which then involved Sara within a week of her birth.

They were eventually taken into care whilst siblings/Sara remained with parents.

Peonies007 · 12/12/2024 20:02

Anonymousess · 12/12/2024 19:43

The article I linked earlier has the information you’re after, here’s a bit of it🙂

The documents disclosed to the media show that Surrey County Council first had contact with Sharif and Sara’s mother, Olga Sharif, in 2010 – more than two years before Sara was born – having received “referrals indicative of neglect” relating to her two older siblings, known only as Z and U.

The authority began the first set of care proceedings in relation to Z and U in January 2013, which then involved Sara within a week of her birth.

They were eventually taken into care whilst siblings/Sara remained with parents.

Edited

Thanks, I missed that 🙈.
If she had two older siblings (only one is Sara's brother and BB wasn't on the scene). Must be another mother still?!

WillowTit · 12/12/2024 20:04

i cant believe making the names of the social workers public is ever a good thing.
it will cause a witch hunt.
the did not murder Sara

AlexaSetATimer · 12/12/2024 20:22

Meemeows · 12/12/2024 11:16

Honestly, I think the "heads should roll" reaction - although understandable, and clearly some of the individual people involved in this were utterly incompetent - will not fix the problem.

The system they are operating within does not work. Even the children who are lucky enough to happen to get competent social workers/ judges are failed frequently.

The rules are wrong. The priorities are wrong. The assumptions underpinning the entire system and the basis upon which decisions should be taken are wrong so even if procedures are followed appropriately children are still failed and subjected to abuse and neglect, completely needlessly.

Furthermore, any system should account for the fact that a certain proportion of social workers/ judges will be incompetent, as is the case in any profession. Safeguards to ensure that this is picked up at the time and there is sufficient oversight and independent review as decisions are made (not hand-wringing after the fact) should be an inherent feature of the proceedings, given that the purpose of the system is (or rather, should be) about the protection of vulnerable minors.

Unless the entire system as it stands is ripped down and rewritten from scratch nothing will change.

Absolutely this.

If I hear "lessons will be learned" one more fucking time after the murder of an innocent child, ... sick of the whole system.

Tandora · 12/12/2024 20:24

TwigletsAndRadishes · 12/12/2024 15:54

I'm not drawing equivalence at all. But the information that has come out post-trial clearly shows that she wasn't safe with her mother either. It might be fair to assume that she would still be alive if she's remained with her mother, but clearly she was not capable of parenting adequately in a non--abusive, non-neglectful way. This poor child was failed by just about everybody.

It might be fair to assume that she would still be alive if she's remained with her mother

might be fair ?

Tandora · 12/12/2024 20:26

Meemeows · 12/12/2024 16:11

It is a systemic issue. That's the point.

Removing incompetent people within the system, or idiotic judges, or overworked social workers who missed something and letting them take the fall might make people feel better and think "justice has been done". But it won't have been.

Of course people should be accountable for their decisions when they're responsible for child safeguarding, but it's a bit late by the time the child is dead.

And who will it help? Will it bring Sara back? Will it bring back the others, the list too sad to go through yet again. No, it won't. Will it stop this happening again? No, it won't. Because the entire basis upon which the decisions being made is wrong, so even if the protocols as they stand are followed properly children will still suffer and die. And these won't be the last incompetent judges or social workers who ever exist, realistically.

If people actually want this to change, want to not be reading about another child like Sara in 6 month's time, then the entire system must be changed. Children will continue to suffer and die like this until this happens.

The next Sara's process has already begun. In fact, there are hundreds of them, around the country, going through this right now. Just having got home from school to be welcomed by a beating, being burned, being locked in a cupboard, starved, humiliated, sexually abused, tortured. This is their reality, every day of their lives. And it will never change unless the voters of this country make clear to politicians that they will not vote for any party who does not fix this. It's barbaric, and it does not have to be like this.

It's all very well looking back afterwards about what went wrong and holding people to account (rightly) but the greatest service to Sara would be to look at what must be done now to stop others suffering to same hell of which he entirety of her short life consisted.

It’s not about incompetent individuals though. It’s systematic bias against women in the family courts because of the fathers for justice movement. It is systematically endangering children and women. It needs to be addressed and even in this case people are largely excusing it (oh the mother was bad so that’s why they gave her to dad).

Anonymousess · 12/12/2024 20:29

Peonies007 · 12/12/2024 20:02

Thanks, I missed that 🙈.
If she had two older siblings (only one is Sara's brother and BB wasn't on the scene). Must be another mother still?!

This article explains the events surrounding Z in more detail: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgedlr7qg1o.amp

Z is the child of both of Sara’s parents, a full sibling. It’s quite scary actually because Sara ended up dying to the exact same abuse Z suffered…bite marks, iron marks, cigarette burns.

However what is striking is that Z was taken into care, so presumably Sara’s mother wasn’t deemed fit enough to keep Z safe. Z also accused her of hitting them.

What is really sad, is that Z is old enough to stumble across media coverage of Sara’s murder. They’re around 17.

Villagetoraiseachild · 12/12/2024 20:41

Are there previous cases of illegally trafficked British child citizens being brought back to the UK when their parents are in jail?

Can it and does it happen?

Who would be given the responsibility to advocate for these children?

ContactNightmare · 12/12/2024 20:48

Anonymousess · 12/12/2024 20:29

This article explains the events surrounding Z in more detail: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgedlr7qg1o.amp

Z is the child of both of Sara’s parents, a full sibling. It’s quite scary actually because Sara ended up dying to the exact same abuse Z suffered…bite marks, iron marks, cigarette burns.

However what is striking is that Z was taken into care, so presumably Sara’s mother wasn’t deemed fit enough to keep Z safe. Z also accused her of hitting them.

What is really sad, is that Z is old enough to stumble across media coverage of Sara’s murder. They’re around 17.

Edited

Christ. So on that occasion, someone did make the correct decision. And why was this not relevant to the family court years later for Sara?

Peonies007 · 12/12/2024 20:53

Anonymousess · 12/12/2024 20:29

This article explains the events surrounding Z in more detail: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgedlr7qg1o.amp

Z is the child of both of Sara’s parents, a full sibling. It’s quite scary actually because Sara ended up dying to the exact same abuse Z suffered…bite marks, iron marks, cigarette burns.

However what is striking is that Z was taken into care, so presumably Sara’s mother wasn’t deemed fit enough to keep Z safe. Z also accused her of hitting them.

What is really sad, is that Z is old enough to stumble across media coverage of Sara’s murder. They’re around 17.

Edited

I thought U was full sibling? If U isn't then who is their mother?
It's definitely says in quite few places S had only one full sibling.

Sara Sharif case - update - horrifying
Peonies007 · 12/12/2024 20:54

Peonies007 · 12/12/2024 20:53

I thought U was full sibling? If U isn't then who is their mother?
It's definitely says in quite few places S had only one full sibling.

Oh, I get. Two full siblings, one taken into care, one still lived at home.
Tired today.

Anonymousess · 12/12/2024 21:10

ContactNightmare · 12/12/2024 20:48

Christ. So on that occasion, someone did make the correct decision. And why was this not relevant to the family court years later for Sara?

Exactly, history is literally repeating itself here. The information about Z has made Sara’s death much more harrowing.

It seems Sharif set out for full custody of Sara after being very familiar with the court processes following the permanent foster care placement of Z. He never stopped abusing the his kids. He simply learned what to say/do, to get authorities off his back.

He was the one who filmed Sara accusing Olga of abuse, which led to the family court placing Sara with him. It’s possible he coerced Sara to make those allegations. She might have been scared about being split up from her siblings, she probably missed Z after they left, Sara was also in foster care and didn’t want to return perhaps. Sara doesn’t seem to have disclosed her abuse to any other adults - in contrast, Z frequently disclosed their abuse to outsiders.

Anonymousess · 12/12/2024 21:15

Peonies007 · 12/12/2024 20:54

Oh, I get. Two full siblings, one taken into care, one still lived at home.
Tired today.

Yes, that’s right!

It is a revelation that she had another sibling taken into care. There was probably a media embargo on the existence of Sara’s eldest sibling until recently, due to the risk of prejudice of the trial. So we’re all finding this out together.

ARichtGoodDram · 12/12/2024 21:16

Anonymousess · 12/12/2024 21:10

Exactly, history is literally repeating itself here. The information about Z has made Sara’s death much more harrowing.

It seems Sharif set out for full custody of Sara after being very familiar with the court processes following the permanent foster care placement of Z. He never stopped abusing the his kids. He simply learned what to say/do, to get authorities off his back.

He was the one who filmed Sara accusing Olga of abuse, which led to the family court placing Sara with him. It’s possible he coerced Sara to make those allegations. She might have been scared about being split up from her siblings, she probably missed Z after they left, Sara was also in foster care and didn’t want to return perhaps. Sara doesn’t seem to have disclosed her abuse to any other adults - in contrast, Z frequently disclosed their abuse to outsiders.

It’ll be very interesting in the (inevitable) enquiry to see if the allegations against her mother have any proof to them or just the video evidence produced by her father.

It’s quite staggering that they made such a strong decision in the case of Z, but then such a stream of cock ups with poor Sara.

Anonymousess · 12/12/2024 21:31

ARichtGoodDram · 12/12/2024 21:16

It’ll be very interesting in the (inevitable) enquiry to see if the allegations against her mother have any proof to them or just the video evidence produced by her father.

It’s quite staggering that they made such a strong decision in the case of Z, but then such a stream of cock ups with poor Sara.

The kicker is…it was the same judge who made those decisions. The judge who placed Sara with Sharif, also presided over the other family court proceedings.

The serious case review will certainly make for interesting reading.

Peonies007 · 12/12/2024 21:57

Anonymousess · 12/12/2024 21:15

Yes, that’s right!

It is a revelation that she had another sibling taken into care. There was probably a media embargo on the existence of Sara’s eldest sibling until recently, due to the risk of prejudice of the trial. So we’re all finding this out together.

I'm wondering if that sibling had a different father?
How can you return two siblings back but not the third to the same violent house? Doesn't make sense 😢

AnneShirleysNewDress · 12/12/2024 22:02

The judge should never be allowed to preside in family court, or any other court, again. Appalling.

Birdscratch · 12/12/2024 22:07

When it’s about returning a child to a family surely the parent’s behaviour towards everyone who has lived in the home is relevant? If a parent has been found to be abusive towards one child or towards a partner they’re a risk to all children in the home.

Anonymousess · 12/12/2024 22:11

AnneShirleysNewDress · 12/12/2024 22:02

The judge should never be allowed to preside in family court, or any other court, again. Appalling.

I am curious about how the local authority as a whole will respond to this. It seems so scandalous but judges tend to be above reproach. Will Surrey council throw the judge under the bus? Or will they double down on support…

Merryoldgoat · 12/12/2024 22:13

If a parent has been found to be abusive towards one child or towards a partner they’re a risk to all children in the home.

Totally agree. I cannot understand why there is a presumption that even abusive parents are better than none. Being abusive and violent to ANYONE should preclude a person from having any contact with their child.

Peonies007 · 12/12/2024 22:14

Anonymousess · 12/12/2024 22:11

I am curious about how the local authority as a whole will respond to this. It seems so scandalous but judges tend to be above reproach. Will Surrey council throw the judge under the bus? Or will they double down on support…

Director of Children's Services will get her Damehood?

AnneShirleysNewDress · 12/12/2024 22:34

@Anonymousess Sadly I expect the latter.

Anonymousess · 12/12/2024 22:48

The video of Sara singing and playing her guitar has me in tears. She genuinely saw a light amongst the darkness. Almost seemed like she was singing those lyrics to herself to reassure herself.

It feels like merely the tip of the iceberg has been revealed. There are shocking details in every article. He terrorised his 1st pregnant 17 year old Polish girlfriend and followed her to Poland after she fled from him. Unsuccessfully locating her, he moved on to finding his next victim for the sake of his visa. He met Olga on that trip to kill his 1st partner…

Fast forward to him fleeing to Pakistan, the unorthodox methods the Pakistani police undertook are like something out of a film.

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