What do we think of the 4B movement?

[JFDIYOLO]

It originated in South Korea out of the #metoo movement.

4 B comes from the Korean 'bi' meaning NO, followed by four things; no heterosexual dating, sex or marriage, and no childbirth.

It's intended to highlight and turn away from sex inequality.

It's currently being talked about a lot in the USA...

I wonder what the effect might be if this took off?

More women in female communities, maybe non religious convent type communities?

Probably an increasing rise in incel behaviour and assaults?

Also a knock on effect on dating aps, bars, clubs and their income?

What else?

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/4b-movement-trump-election-win-south-korea-b2643558.html

It's a load of nonsense based on a couple of tweets. It's not going to happen because most women aren't lesbian, and like dating, marriage, etc.

More power to them!

I am perimenopausal so my experience is different than younger women. I do have a teenage daughter.

I think women are going to have to be extremely careful with heterosexual sex simply for practical reasons. That doesn’t mean they have to completely give up the idea of partnering or parenthood. However, pregnacy in America is riskier in many states than it used to be. That trend may only get worse.

Women would be would be wise to set extremely high standards for sexual partners. They would be wise to set even higher standards for having unprotected sex.

if they want to give up on parenthood all together, that is understandable and should be supported.

I think it's something that makes good headlines, but very unlikely to be a large movement. I imagine the backlash to the perceived idea will massively outweigh the practical application.

Except it literally is already happening!

I thought it sounded petulant and its not practical. There will always be women happy to sleep with men so women taking a principled stance to abstain from sex until women's rights improve won't have an impact.

It seems to be blaming "all men" for the sins of "some men" and frankly should also be blaming some women who choose to espouse the same anti-feminist views. There are lots of pro-life women in America supporting taking rights away from the pro-choice.

I think that rather than an eye catching bullshit movement like 4B, it would be better if women were educated to have standards.

So a good partner who can atteact mates would be a good man who supports equality and lives those values by sharing an equal lifestyle with their partner (like so many men do today, but not enough men). It would be long term persuasive for women to vote with their feet, moving away from partners who won't live an equal life.

Yep this. If anything it's a great recruitment tool for the incel movement.

Probably an increasing rise in incel behaviour and assaults?

So, if women don't give men sex, they'll take it by force?

It seems to be very popular in South Korea. They have one of the lowest birth rates in the world. Good luck to them!

Is it though? Or is it just the media all reporting on the same one or two twitter or tick-tock accounts saying it should happen? Because looking at reports, I keep seeing the same two sites being cited and a lot of coulds, shoulds and maybes.

Never heard of it. people are free to do what suits them 🤷‍♀️

It's been happening for the past 5 years in South Korea.

But even in Korea it had no more than 5000 participants. Some say just 500. And that number has reduced in recent years. Out of a population of over 50 million it's a tiny tiny number. It certainly hasn't lead to female only communes or any sort of societal change. And there is no evidence that anything is happening anywhere else other than a couple of sites saying "this should happen".

Only on Tiktok.

I thought it sounded petulant and its not practical

WOW.
Have you seen the posts by incels & misogynists? And how greatly they've increased? We're not talking small numbers here.

Quite frankly, there's nothing petulant about saying you don't want to be involved with men when they will remove your rights and make it acceptable to abuse you.

This isn't tit for tat. What's happening in the USA is extremely serious and women have few or no ways to protect themselves.

It might not be all men, but sadly in the USA, as the election has shown, it's most men.

Anything that brings the world’s population down is ok by me. We keep being told that the birth rate is dropping. Well, that may be true, but it isn’t dropping everywhere. Africa’s birth rate is so high the African population is going to double. And even when the world’s population does start to come down, it will be falling from a dizzying height. In 1900 there were a billion human beings. Today there are eight billion and we’re heading for ten. It will take a long time for the world’s population to return to 19th-century levels. We’re sleepwalking into a climate crisis with a population that has exploded. On top of that, we’re about to get the first generation of anti-ageing drugs. If they work, lifespans could soon rise to 130 or 150. In other words, people won’t be dying and making room for the next generation.

This isn't tit for tat. What's happening in the USA is extremely serious and women have few or no ways to protect themselves.

It might not be all men, but sadly in the USA, as the election has shown, it's most men.

Polling shows that overall, 44% of women voted for Trump. Women there could protect themselves by not voting for fascists.

I agree @StopStartStop. Extraordinary implication that if women decide not to have sex with men, it will result in men becoming more misogynistic and potentially violent. So men’s bad behaviour is women’s fault. As always.

So because 44% of women voted for Trump the other 56% should just suck it up?
That 44% of women apparently voted for him is irrelevant here, women both as individuals and as groups can make decisions like this without being called petulant.

To suggest they're petulant is a bit like a poster saying "my boyfriend does x y z, are these red flags" and all the responses saying "yes, but don't leave him because he'll just get sex elsewhere"

It's not about the men, it's about the women.

I'm sort of following this I suppose but I had no idea there was a name for it until a couple of weeks ago. I have been married though and had kids, I'm just choosing not to get into anymore relationships with men or have sex with them. I have just been completely put off by men and find them overrated and disappointing.

I am not suddenly going to start sleeping with men just to not offend incels and sex offenders. I'm fine with them being sexless for their entire lives, I'm done pleasing men.

South Koreans say it has all been vastly exaggerated by Western media. It's a fringe movement, if you can call it that. It's supposedly an online thing for a few thousand women, at most.

of course they will , that’s literally what rape is.

Even if 100% of women adopted this, it's not really going to affect incels is it

Isn't this just a new version of political lesbianism?

My gran used to call these ladies 'spinsters'.