To think I can’t control my child

[abangintoon]

I know I’m going to get pasted but I’m kind of hoping there might be some sympathy amongst the inevitable flaming.

He’s four. If I ask / tell him not to do something and generally he ignores me and carries on.

I have read the books and researched this and have tried

telling him what to do rather than what not to do - doesn’t work, still ignores you and carries on doing his own thing
a sanction or consequence, either doesn’t care or throws a tantrum but it doesn’t change his behaviour at all.
speaking firmly, speaking sternly, shouting - doesn’t care. Sometimes laughs.
Giving choices - doesn’t work, just says no to both if it’s something he doesn’t want to do or just ignores you.

I am sure there are more.

I know it can be a difficult age. I am not really posting for advice but more to ask if anyone else just accepted they had no power at all and sort of got on with their day. Fine at preschool by the way.

I think at this age you just have to persevere. One of mine was quite like this at the same age and I just plodded on with firm clear boundaries and we got there in the end. I never found that the 'praise the good, ignore the bad' thing worked though - he did need consequences, again and again. Also some kids that age seem to really react to sugar and / or screens, so experiment with really limiting both of those maybe?

You physically stop him. If he thinks that’s funny then OK! But he’s stopped and you are in charge. He doesn’t get to go back to doing it after 2 minutes or your stepping in again to stop it. You have the ability to stop the process that you dislike-‘and as an adult you do that. Regardless of the child’s opinion.

My son has processing problems.

We have to use less words, be extra clear and leave big gaps for him to respond, and only give one step of a process at a time. He us older now and can manage 2 steps.

It's more "shoes now' wait at least 5 mississpi seconds for him to respond.

Then "shoes"

I also find sometimes modeling what you want to happen can help. So you just do what's expected and hope he copies.

And non verbal instructions. Like just passing a toothbrush to him with now words.

@AD1509 sure if it’s possible. It isn’t always.

My child’s Neurodiversity wasn’t picked up at nursery. He’s academically able and wasn’t misbehaving so it was missed. So I wouldn’t discount it because they haven’t said anything.
Could you afford an assessment?

Please don't smack him or shut him in a room, those are just awful suggestions.

How much time do you spend doing things with him? Playing games, playing with his toys with him, reading to him, chatting with him as you go for a walk or make dinner? I think you need to build that bond up where he enjoys doing
things with you and spending time with you. Once you have that you can withdraw attention if he misbehaves or you can distract him from bad behaviour by offering an alternative that he can do with you.

If he likes walking over and balancing on things then use that to your advantage. Reward good behaviour by making a balancing course with sofa cushions, blankets, other cushions and anything else he could walk over. Make stepping stones for him to jump between, have a narrow strip ie scarf for him to balance along - and join in with him and have a few goes yourself too.

Pick up on anything else he likes - if he likes kicking something then find something that he can kick, if he likes throwing stuff around then find stuff he can throw. These may all be sensory needs.

The other thing I'd say is give him plenty of warning before any transition, give him chance to finish what he doing before he has to move onto something else. Don't ask him to do something and expect him to do it immediately, give him a few minutes and then remind him.

Make things into a fun game, who can get their shoes on first, clean your teeth and dance around with him while he cleans his too, can he put his toys away before you count to twenty etc

These are all things that worked really well with DS who it (much later) turned out had ASD. He wasn't picked up until nearly secondary school age and then it was only because his teacher went on a course and had a hunch.

I don’t think he has ASD. More likely to be poor parenting, but I am lost as to what I can do differently.

When giving instructions have you tried using visuals / objects of reference to give cues? e.g. “come to the table for dinner” is accompanied by showing him a dinner plate. “Wash your hands” a soap bottle etc. Photos can also work depending on his level of understanding.

Do you give him warnings of transitions? This could be verbal reminders or a visual timer like an egg timer. This can prepare him for having to finish an activity.

It may also be a good idea get his hearing tested to rule that out.

Single word instructions are also a good shout.

He understands those sort of instructions but ignores them. Or screams at you

I know I sound really negative - it’s been a long exhausting sort of day. I know there are probably reasons for the behaviour but it doesn’t make it any easier to deal with.

I think this is 4 year olds. My DD does not listen, and I don't always mean in a naughty way... I can be talking to her about something trivial and she is literally on another planet.

Ignore me if this already applies but you need to be really consistent in applying rules and consequences - don't just try something a couple of times and say it doesn't work, try it for a couple of weeks and then if it doesn't work try another tactic. Consistency is key.

He does sound like something neurodiverse is going on. At 4 he should be able to understand instructions, basic ones etc. That he can’t in any way link action or consequence etc does make it sound like he is delayed.
Moreover the walking on things etc does sound sensory. So he walked across the painting because he had an urge or itch to do so which would not be satisfied till he did. So he is doing what his brain is saying is the logical thing to do.
I would definitely read up about parenting a neurodiverse child and deploy those strategies. It may be that the cues you have to give him are different. Or that you have to break down instructions etc. And that while he won’t understand consequences immediately you have to keep persevering.

It relentless, but you have to keep on keeping on

Make him do what is needed.

Take control.

It will stick.

Have you read the thread? You can’t. I can’t stop him standing on a painting I didn’t even know was there, knocking all the cushions off the sofa, leaping around like a lunatic, climbing up the bookcase. Not without locking him up or something. I’ve no idea what that stupid GIF is trying to say.

Well, to be fair the consequence there was him getting punched ...

Did he need to be taken home and "punished" twice??

Definitely do not do this.

If you honestly think he cannot understand the words "we are leaving the park because you walked on someone's painting" then tbh I don't know why you haven't spoken to your GP/HV already. That is something a 4 yr old absolutely should be able to grasp, and if he can't then it's a clear sign of a developmental difference that you need to start investigating.

I have a 4 year old.

You can.

Some days she'll dead look you in the face and carry on doing the task.

I have to intervene.

Removing the object, removing from the situation with etc.

So, he pulls off all the cushions? So make him out them back.

He climbs up the bookcase? So pull him off. And tell him he is not allowed.

Every single time. Repeat repeat, repeat, until it sinks in he will have to comply with your wishes.

If you've basically given him an instruction and he's basically been allowed to ignore you for however long this has been going on, you're going to have to work work work at correcting the behaviour.

It sounds like he may have sensory needs with the climbing / jumping / standing on things. If you google sensory circuits there are lots of ideas you can do to help calm him. The nursery SENCO may also be able to give some suggestions.

No it won't make it easier to deal with but sometimes knowing why helps you pick a strategy that might work eventually.

You have my sympathy though. Some days are just so tiring.

I used to say 'this too shall pass" as sometimes just when I found a stage was beyond me, it would suddey click and then usually something else would bite me on the bum.

The gif, was expressing shock at locking a child away, and ignoring him until he quietens down.

Horrible.

I feel like you are thinking if you tell him not to stand on things once and he doesn’t stop it immediately and forever that he ‘doesn’t understand or doesn’t listen’.

What people are trying to say is that it takes time, consistent consequences, and repetition for it finally sink in.

Bring him home from the park every time something happens. He may not care today, or tomorrow, but eventually he’ll figure out that his park time is getting shorter and shorter.

You make it sound so easy @JayEffSee , it isn’t, it’s only recently possible learning difficulties have come to light and no one actually knows whether he has them or not.

I’m not ds and I understand it fine, but it just makes no difference.

Anyway it isn’t so much for advice as .,, I don’t know, like I say it has been a long day and I feel alone.