To think the royal family should pay proper tax?

[marmaladeandpeanutbutter]

I think the RF should pay corporation, capital gain tax and personal tax, like every other family and company.

I was watching the channel 4 Despatches programme tonight, and was so astounded I
rewound and took notes. Yes, I should get out more! But in case you didn't watch it:

◦	£132 million is to be paid by government (ie tax payers )  to the Royal Family in 2025

◦	The RF also have extensive land estates (Duchies of Cornwall and Lancaster). 

◦	How the RF make their millions has been kept secret from us and parliament for centuries

◦	Over 5000 of their undeclared properties were discovered by Channel 4 despatches. 

◦	We pay, for example £1.5  million for Dartmoor prison every year, although it’s empty and not usable because of radon gas. We must also pay for any repairs

◦	The RF say they aren’t funded by the tax payer, but channel 4 says that in fact they are, and that they make many millions from us.

◦	Several state schools have to pay the family rent

◦	The family charge us for training our own troops to defend our country on their land. Despite the King being the head of the armed forces, they are cashing in. They refuse to say how much they charge.  They even charge for use of jetties on their shores, eg from where naval vessels set sail

◦	Even the NHS is  not exempt-they say they are “helping the NHS”  . Yes, but it turns out that it is by renting out land eg at Guys and St Thomases for lucrative amounts. All free of corporation tax, naturally, unlike any other company.

◦	Even some local charities and community groups pay them, all the while the RF is promoting them.: “Millions of pounds in rent”, including for MacMillan and Comic relief, of which the former has earned the RF £22 million. 

◦	They have new mining interests, often at odds with environmental campaigners, with potential risks to land, water and animals . 

◦	Many of the homes they rent out are amongst the lowest 14% in the uk in  terms of condition eg mould, cracks, no insulation. They say it “may not be feasible” to comply with UK environmental legislation, even though all other landlords must.

All whilst exempt from the corporation or capital gains tax paid by every other company. They pay some income tax, but they won’t divulge details.

The greed is shocking and breathtaking. I don’t want to hear another word on helping the environment, fixing the climate or eradicating homelessness from their mouths.

No wonder they are so astoundingly, breathtakingly rich.

I think this programme will become a big talking point in coming days.

I can't see much popular support for a referendum on the monarchy. Perhaps you should lobby one of the political parties - otherwise your protest is tumbleweed.

I don't live in the UK, went back last year to see family and friends, visited some old haunts. I passed by a foodbank behind St Pancras station, and was horrified to see the royal warrant insignia in the bottom left corner of the banner zip-tied to the railings of the school where the foodbank handed out food a couple of days per week.

Got home and looked into it further: that particular foodbank is seeded by the Trussel Trust, which seems to me to be a sound non-profit providing free food to people in need. Couldn't find anything about the royal warrant insignia on that particular foodbank, but was horrified to see that a food bank in Wandsworth had been visited by Charles and Camilla in 2021, where they went to see what type of food the poor need and receive from that foodbank.

I just couldn't compute. Forget Marie Antoinette letting them eat cake: this is the 21st Century and there's a literal (future and now sitting) king and queen going around a foodbank, to see what it's like! How are Brits not up in arms about this??! The ACTUAL king and queen! Visiting a FOODBANK, to see! I think some Brits are now blind to just how backwards that is.

More googling led me to see that certain royal warrant holders have made donations to the Trussel Trust. This means that for-profit business (the one I remember was a purveyor of luxury Christmas bits and bobs, crackers and wrapping paper and greetings cards etc) who have accepted a royal blessing, have given some money to a charity that relies on DONATIONS to provide basic foodstuffs for people who can't afford to feed their families. So the royal family has outsourced to the private sector the giving of donations - for food. What their subjects need to stay alive. They're not doing it themselves, they've outsourced giving to people who want royal approbation.

And people just go with it, weeping and standing for hours on end to pay respects to the late QEII who enabled and encouraged all this, tuning into the coronation of the next in line in an outrageous display of extravagance.

I felt like I was living in a parallel universe.

Have you seen the papers / social media over the last few days ??
There is plenty of anger .
You are very confident that the Windsors are loved ( based on what I do not k ow as every figure / crowd is down ) so I’m sure you’ll agree we should have a question on the ballot paper . No need to panic and ask for a detailed plan yet . Let’s see the truth because it sure as hell isn’t the tabloid pack of lies / pr puff
It would even benefit royalists as they are older - young people vote less

Sorry that was to @Clavinova

@foodbanknamechange

Tbe royals regularly turn up at food banks. empty handed and looking gormless

Get a few photos with the poors don’t you know - slap it on the insta for some PR

Yes it is jarring but we’ve had our taxes pay off Andrew’s accuser ( Duchy money) and Charles stealing intestate people’s estates for himself - we are pretty numb to it all Luckily the Dispatches programme has woken lots of people up . Many former royalists now tweeting as such and well done to them - it’s hard to have the scales fall from your eyes

Problem is nothing will be done about it. The Royals will put some PR puff piece out. They'll roll out a picture of the kids at a Christmas event, the Daily Mail will lap it up and make something up about Meghan Markles Christmas jam failurw and they will carry on business as usual. The Panama Papers thing didn't do anything. The only reason HMQ paid some tax is because she asked the public to pay for Windsor Castle and thete was outrage. Her beloved Andrew sent staff I to the burning building to collect paintings and they got fire damaged stock from the Windsor Castle shop as thanks.

You are very confident that the Windsors are loved

Saxe-Coburgs, surely ?

It would be useful if people link proof of what they are saying. I suspect people are spreading misinformation because they can on social media. For starters as far as I know they are not billionaires. Many rich people in the U.K. have much more than them as seeing in the Sunday times rich list. They are little fishes in comparison.
I am laughing about comments like I suspect Willliam is worse? Really why is he worse?
As a friend of mine from abroad said what set this country apart from many other countries? Or what is this country without the monarchy? Old fashion may be but the soft diplomacy that comes with it? It is really priceless. Do people really want to do away with the advantages of having a monarchy? I believe potential leaders risks like Putin and Biden are much much worst.
How much do each person have to pay to have the monarchy? Really? You would be surprised. Hardly parasites as they are full on working. Which is why Meghan said fuck this when she lost her freedom.
Would you rather they are abolished but are happy to pay thousands in taxes for the people on benefits that are not working? ( I know some do but for the ones who do not) it would seem to me you are getting more out of them than people against them led you to believe.
https://www.yourlocalguardian.co.uk/news/national/24472087.much-royal-family-cost-breakdown-key-figures/

Much better to have them. There are some ridiculous claims definitely out of envy and ignorance. Yes, they should pay taxes. However, many people legally do not pay taxes so it is in the detail of how things are done. They give so much back than other rich people.

We don't have a choice with the Royals. They can be absolute twats and we won't be able to do a damn thing about it. We pay whether we like it or not.

How much do you pay a year?

We don't have a choice with the Royals

The Labour Party only secured 33.7% of the vote in the last general election - Keir Starmer isn't most people's choice either.

Do you literally not care about any of the things mentioned in the Dispatches programme? Can they do no wrong in your eyes, just because they were born into the RF? I personally don't think we'll ever get rid of them, but the least we can expect is that they dont take the piss. And actually what's even worse is that we should expect the mechanisms of the state to protect us and hold the powerful to account, not let a ceremonial head of state demand whatever they like and keep their secrets for them.

Actually the entire Parliamentary system is nonsense, including the electoral system but I didn't hear The Tories clamouring for proportional representation, ever. In fact when they had a chance to change the system to a fairer one, they actively campaigned against it. Labour won under the current electoral system on a minority of the vote, as has every other government.

Who knows what % of our individual taxes and charitable contributions they have creamed off via their charges of eg £11 million to the nhs or overcharging macmillan - that’s too complex a calculation and us plebs have had these practices hidden from us to date. Add that to the millions upon millions of avoided CGT and IHT, oooh I don’t know - can you work it out, can anyone?

But the short answer to how much we each pay per year to support this morally bankrupt billionaire familiy is too much, much too much.

Oh, the pp who thinks Meghan hated being in the royal family because the "work" was too hard. Brilliant stuff. She'll have done more work in one day on set as an actress than any royal does in a year of ribbon cutting.

The royals don't really need to bother with the PR machine, when so many useful idiots will defend them, no matter what.

Man alive, if royalists could spend five minutes as a fly on the wall of any group of toffs, let alone the royals, they would be straight to the barricades and wheeling out the guillotine.

I've been in the company of these sorts of people from time to time—trust me, they think we're all scum. You only have to look at half the threads on MN to see what even the middle classes think of the people they see as beneath them, do you think the aristos are any different? They just have more people to be cunty about.

The notion that kings and queens love and protect their people is straight out of fairy tales. The real ones have only ever used "their" people as servants, serfs or soldiers.

@dottiehens

I haven’t clicked on your link - I’m sure your local free paper is very good but forgive me doubting that they have put in years of journalistic reseach into that piece . If it says the royals cost us £1 each - that was debunked years ago along with the ‘they bring in more than cost ‘ lie .

Charles IS a billionaire - in fact the conservative estimate is 1.8 billion ‘private’ ( stolen) wealth . The other 500 million he takes from us - you know some pocket change for his helicopters .

A billionaire and his son with their hand out for £100 from volunteer lifeboat crews .
What an image .
I have always believed that you have to be - how can I say this - unquestioning - to be a royalist . How can you continue to defend this ruthless greed ?

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/apr/05/how-the-british-royal-family-hides-its-wealth-from-public-scrutiny

@MrTwatchester

Ha! Perfectly put

https://act.38degrees.org.uk/act/royal-family-profiting-tr

To think the fundraising many of us do for the NHS and cancer charities gets syphoned off to the Royals is appalling. They are independently wealthy billionaires who get to hide their financial shenanigans and their Wills. The reason why they get this privilege none of the rest of us do is blindingly obvious.

And then we have William going to end homelessness while his family fight over who gets which mansion! Beyond hypocritical - positively scandalous we have to suffer this. As for Charles championing the environment..............

Yawn. Sure the programme really emphasised the hundreds of millions paid into the public purse every year from the income from the crown estate? If not then the findings are completely pointless. Not sure I’d want to pay tax if I’d already agreed to hand over all of my family’s estates income every year either (minus the sovereign grant that everyone gets their knickers in a twist over, obviously).

its pretty obvious that any change would result in the majority of the estate being signed over to them and a significant loss of government funding - no? Unless you think we can really just reclaim private property as public. Hint - we can’t without a forced revolution…

@username7891 the the monarch has paid income tax on the Duchies and personal investments since 1993.
The monarch pays VAT and capital gains tax too.
The government collects any profit from the Crown Estates and gives the Royal Family a SHARE of this, the Sovereign Grant, therefore they do not pay taxes on it.

@RaspberryRipple2

You appear to think the royals own the crown estates

You are wrong - they don’t . I know the name is misleading and really should be changed but it was all handed over by George 11 ( I think) . He was bankrupt and that was the condition of his bailout .
So… what’s your point exactly ?

I really don’t care and I am not a dying Royalist. My point of view if that of a foreign person who think you are making a big mistake. Have had conversations around this subject with friends who like me live here but are from abroad. The U.K. is making very big mistakes and every time you will become more and more irrelevant. Your lost not mine. I have never known people from a country that hates themselves or their country so much. It is weird. Hope you get your republican dream somehow.
My point was also about all the stuff people are saying here without links or proof.

the monarch has paid income tax on the Duchies and personal investments since 1993

that tells a story - they were forced to pay tax in 1993! My family, like most of the population, have paid tax on their earnings forever - no choice!

You are not. I really don't think there is any need for a royal family in this country and I would be happy to see the back of them, especially after reading the OPs notes.