Too be really fucking angry with people who just let abuse happen- Sara Sharif

[dinomirror]

Reading it now its horrific. People saying we heard screams- and yet did nothing??? How does a person just think that no im not going to report this, most likely because they cant be bothered/ dont want to be involved. Scum of the earth the dad is. The stepmother ( and her sister!) going on and on about how they feel bad etc and dont do anything!

Even if you're from the same ethnic background...u have to admit not all people from that background think hitting and smacking a child is not okay...they only fear it once someone's been reported and had their child taken away or if they're bullies they tell their kids not to say anything.

People worry about neighbours, school teachers etc. But have babies with anyone who throws then some attention and does nothing then moves on and lets the next imbecile near their children

Both parents in this case as bad as each other but social services and school did bear some culpability. I'm angry at them as well.

Calling out racism does not result in women and children dying or being abused. Only the perpetrators of the abuse are responsible for it.

Calling out racism does not prevent anyone from reporting abuse. There is nothing racist about seeking to protect a vulnerable peraon from any background.

The false perception that abuse is somehow an integral part of certain religions and/or cultures might result in people failing to report abuse, because they mistakenly believe that they will be accused of racism. The problem here lies not with the fact that actual racism gets called out, but rather in their false assumption that abuse is a cultural issue.

Abuse is abuse and it happens in all cultures. There might be culture-specific nuances that impact on when that abuse happens or how it is expressed (e.g. English men tend to be more abusive after major football matches, some cultures might frame it in terms of concepts like "honour" etc ) but ultimately, it is still abuse, and anyone who sees the perpetrators as human beings first and foremost, rather than as representatives of a particular ethnic group, will have no hesitation in reporting it as such.

Sorry, my previous post was in response to this but I forgot to quote.

The only victim here was Sara. It's nothing to do with racism.

Of course Sara was the victim, and her death had nothing to do with racism. Nobody is arguing that it did.

It's just a shame that the thread has attracted a lot of racist posters. It's disgusting that they seek to exploit an innocent child's death in order to promote their abhorrent views, but some people will stoop to anything.

I am a teacher also. Education is a right in this country, as it should be, but the government do not have control of our children to the extent that they get to decide to take them from us from 9-3, Monday to Friday. It is a parents choice to decide whether they make use of free education offered in public schools, or provide alternative education, that fulfils the child’s right to an education. Let’s not get confused regarding who the primary decision makers are regarding children, it is those with parental rights, as it should be, and would be very concerning if that wasn’t the case. There are abusive teachers also, and children can be exposed to many things at school. Issues arise in countries where children are treated as though they don’t have parents, and the government have to step in. Some children are abused which is a sickening tragedy, but the majority of parents are perfectly fit as parents to decide whether to send their child to school, or whether they have the resources, time, inclination, and financial capacity to homeschool their child.

It's not a patriarchy issue, because the mother was as culpable. That's what I meant.

I guess I struggle because I know about growing up in domestic violence and patriarchy (albeit I'm not Muslim and I'm white) and I want to feel compassion for the mother but I struggle with this . A child doesn't have a choice in the situation. I get that my own mum was scared to leave, and I guess I have come to terms with that but I just feel that if you going to remain with a violent man at least get the kids out.

I 100% think in part that minority privelege played a role in her lack of care and support, (I am biracial by the way) many authorities are extremely cautious to not overstep with minorities in case it is perceived as racist and biased. I also know (being raised in a predominantly Muslim family), that Islam does promote violence towards women, and that many Muslims consider how they discipline and deal with issues in their own families, to be above the law. This doesn’t mean that most Muslims are violently inclined, not at all, but it IS a part of the culture, and Pakistani culture also, as several of us who are either of that religion, or have been raised in that religion, have expressed on this post, we don’t need virtue signalling from people who know nothing about Islam and Pakistani culture, because to act as though it’s not an issue, is not only ignorance, it is also insulting to those of us who understand these things culturally and want to tackle those issues in our own communities. My conclusion with tackling that issue as an individual, was to have nothing to do with Islam, although I am polite and respectful to my father and Muslim side of the family.

The religion people are trying to refer to is not to harm any living being let alone a child. The religion also emphasises on a quick dignified burial which where these monsters have left her body for days on a bed after committing a horrific crime which again is forbidden to harm a living being let alone a child that was entrusted to them by God to be loved and taken care of and again against the religion I've been taught. These are evil violent people and have committed a horrific crime that has no place in this religion. Another thing to add which is to never stay silent if there's any cruelty involved which again goes against my religion where you must be the voice of the victim. I'm a Muslim and have parents and grandparents heavily involved in all the female family members education and wellbeing and have always been loved and looked after, I'm not sure what some posters are fucking talking about referring it to Islam as if it it's acceptable. You basically either come from a fucked up family and would have experienced the same level of abuse if you were to be born in a different coloured/ faith family or you know fuck all about Islam.

@LongLongLiveLove it was her step mum not her real mother. I hope it will come out why she and her brother were removed from her real mum.

"I'm a Muslim and have parents and grandparents heavily involved in all the female family members education and wellbeing and have always been loved and looked after, I'm not sure what some posters are fucking talking about referring it to Islam as if it it's acceptable. You basically either come from a fucked up family and would have experienced the same level of abuse if you were to be born in a different coloured/ faith family or you know fuck all about Islam."
Well said @teatimelover !

Mormons also have a history or plural marraiges and having a thing where you have to defend the ideology.

I know some ideologies teach lies about biology being a good thing and some teach that you can lie about what's written in a book to fool people into thinking it's something it isn't.

People can make observations about ideologies.

Step parent situations, just don't help children at all, nor do ideologies that normalise such behaviour.

Polygamist Tom Green was initially a member of the mainstream LDS church but was excommunicated when he adopted the practice of plural marriage. He resided in a makeshift trailer park in southern Utah with his large family who lived off the welfare system and a small income provided by selling magazine subscriptions. Those of Tom Green's wives who were not legally married to him would often file for welfare as single mothers to receive money. The Green Family came into the spotlight in 1999 when he told Dateline NBC that he had multiple wives during the making of a documentary.[39] Green and his large family had begun to broadcast their lifestyle in the years prior. They appeared on talk shows (including the Jerry Springer Show[40]) and in other documentaries explaining their unique familial situation. All of this media exposure sparked interest in Juab County Attorney David O. Leavitt to begin an investigation.[41] In April 2000, Leavitt charged Green with bigamy, criminal non-support, and child rape.[42] The main offense against Green was his marriage to Linda Kunz, who was 13 when the couple was married.[43]
After examining birth certificates, prosecutors discovered that Tom and Linda had conceived a child when she was only 13 years old. In June 2002 Green was sentenced to five years to life in prison and was released in 2007. He died of COVID-19 related pneumonia in 2021.[44] Green is often credited with bringing the underground practice of polygamy back into the legal spotlight.

Completely agree, there should be some compulsory monitoring, both for safeguarding but mainly to check that they are receiving an adequate and broad education. Schools, nurseries, childminders are ofsted'd to check standard of provision, home ed shoykd be no different. Every state school child costs over 5k to educate, and there should be funds for tutors for home school educated children too, to help support and guide parents who have, for various reasons, decided that home Ed is the best option for their child. The vast majority will be doing it with the best intentions, but these tutor visits would also provide a safety net for those who have, like Sara's family, decided to do it for negative reasons.

Tutors like teachers and school nurses who don't understand biology, can be abusers.

I know the home Ed was the end of for poor Sara but please remember she had been at school for years whilst being beaten black and blue according to the step mum, so badly she couldn't walk etc.

It beggars belief no signs of abuse where seen before the final few bruises.

Bruises and a removal to home school should = red flag.

Why didn't it here?

It's obvious, people are asking questions!! The child is swiftly removed??

Sara's stepmother has refused to give dental impressions.

Sara was, amongst her other abuses, bitten repeatedly and so hard that dental impressions could be taken from her injuries.

Of the 3 adults living in her home, 2 have given dental impressions that do not match Sara's bite injuries. 1 adult has not, the step mother. It's pretty fucking obvious who was biting that poor girl so hard her skin was broken. She was an abuser just the same as Sara's male relatives - her husband has just chosen to protect her.

The neighbours are fuckwits. You hear children sounding in fear; locked in rooms; in pain - you fucking do something.

May Sara rest in peace.

Are you referencing gender ideology with this comment? Or suggesting that tutors would physically abuse the children?

And yes, anyone can be an abuser, parents, extended family, professionals, but the parent would generally be present with the tutor which would be a safeguard, the idea of the tutor in home ed would be to review and support the education being provided by the parent.

Bruises are seen, and reported so many times by schools. The families are interviewed by social care, they provide an explanation for the bruises which social care somehow accepts and the case is closed. I have myself as a health professional reported an incident where the child said his Dad had punched him and he had a black eye. The Dad told social care that the child fell into corner of a table, the case was closed.
The child was later admitted to hospital and found to be covered in bruises and removed from the family, returned to the mum a year later after she advised she had left Dad. I did a home visit - Dad is there, I report this to social care, nothing hapenned. Child again becomes withdrawn and fearful and aggressive towards other children. Concerns raised, nothing happens. Later Dad arrested for assaulting Mum, who refuses to press charges so nothing changes, and on and on it goes.

Yes, there is something you can do about children who tell teachers to fuck off - there is a lot you can do in fact - for a start the idea of telling a child what is and is not acceptable behaviour appears to be beyond most teachers
You're spouting rubbish

Kids are mostly home ed because they have SEN and because the school generally can't support them / isn't the right environment.
We had a tutor for a year paid by LA for 10 hours a week.
She was brilliant for my then 7yo to teach him strategies of self regulation but didn't teach him to read or write.
On paper that would be 'failing', but in reality you can't get child to learn if in constant fight/flight.
So a tutor for child with SEN, who don't know what they are doing (most don't), it would be a disaster.

Yep, absolutely, they would need to be a tutor with experience in SEN.
At my SEN school we have several children who are home ed due to being too medically unwell to attend, and the school employs a teacher who visits each of them for a couple hours 3 times a week. Nowhere near a full education provision, but often it's all the child has capacity for amongst medical appointments, being drowsy from meds etc.

And self regulation is something every child benefits on being supported with. My daughters mainstream primary places a high emphasis on this for all children, to enable 'readiness to learn', how to manage their big emotions, and it produces children, who despite spending much less time on reading and writing than other schools, are far ahead academically because the children are engaged, and happy.