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Original poster

to be a bit surprised at the misogyny described/displayed on mn at times?

458 replies

nickytwotimes · 25/04/2008 13:40

Right, well, first off, I love it here. i especially love it because there are plenty of intelligent, witty posters.
However, I am frequently surprised at threads relating to pornography, exchanging sex for "gifts" and fanjo shaving, etc. Now, I know we've all got different ideas about what is acceptable, but sometimes it's like feminism never happened.

OP posts:
PosieParker · 25/04/2008 20:35

My dp is hairy, never liked it before but now I love it because it's him. As he's got older he has his back waxed as he hates it. He always thought he liked tall women with dark hair and enormoous breasts before he met and fell in love with me, funny how all peer and cultural pressure can't stand in the way of true love and attraction. Romance romance romance.

cushioncover · 25/04/2008 20:36

I agree, Expat!
When all is said and done, my absolute main reason for waxing is not to look like a wooly mammoth when I take my kids swimming.

If I shaved my legs in the morning they'd be dark and stubbly by the evening. As it is, despite waxing for well over 10yrs, by my 4wk next appointment the hair is already long again. Bikini line the same.

expatinscotland · 25/04/2008 20:36

yes, but her perception of what we were sold is a product of her ethnicity, class and nationality.

if she were brought up, say, a poor, Southern African-American she'd have written a completely different book.

expatinscotland · 25/04/2008 20:39

well, tbh, Posie, i'm so shallow that a guy's being too hairy was a deal breaker for me, as well as having a small cock.

there was no 'falling in love' because i never waited long to get physical and the second i found out they were gorillas i left skidmarks.

expatinscotland · 25/04/2008 20:40

it was no kids, no small cocks, no cocaine use, no overly hairy body, no fuckwits.

those were my dealbreakers.

WideWebWitch · 25/04/2008 20:40

I still think if you want to disagree with Wolf you should consider attacking her arguments not arguing that they are invalid because of her upbringing, that's insulting imo. If she was poor working class then should we say "what would she know?"

Interestingly I heard her make a speech about The Beauty Myth and she made the point that as she was attractive people said "what would she know" and had she not been people would have said "ugly bitter feminist". She couldn't win. I reckon I could almost rest my case on that.

PosieParker · 25/04/2008 20:40

Tee hee, I have read snippets whilst babysitting at my sister's and so will not pretend to have read the whole book in context. I understand there's a focus on eating disorders and plastic surgery etc, women not men who are uptaking the whole thing and in a sharper rise than women %wise.
I just think if we blame men for all of the shit happening to women then we escape control and I cannot belive that to be true. We are a big enough group that could, if we stopped attacking eachother, be empowered and I can't see what that has to do with 'wax on wax off' (Karate Kid ref).

cushioncover · 25/04/2008 20:40

at the way Expat just tags small cock onto the end of the sentence as nothing more than incidental!

zippitippitoes · 25/04/2008 20:43

expat did you noticve that johnny depp is alive

i am trying to curb my necrophiliac tendencies as instructed

expatinscotland · 25/04/2008 20:43

I don't find that insulting at all, WWW. Her arguments are a product of all that and I can't relate to how she thinks and to me she comes across as whining and overly-sensitive.

She'd have benefited much by living abroad a while.

That's my opinion.

And yes, I read that book. Had to as part of a class.

PosieParker · 25/04/2008 20:44

Dealbreakers, do you love Dr Phil?
Mine were... hairy (oops, actually he wasn't so bad when we met just a little on the chest but as he's got older more has come), small cock (One week that relationship lasted!!), smoker, really strong accent (sorry for this) and no ambition (not money ambition could be a poor artist with an ambition to paint the most beautiful sunset) and kids!

WideWebWitch · 25/04/2008 20:44

And going back to the OP (have skimmed thread but not read it all), yes, sometimes mumsnet is like feminism never happened. Especially agree on the

a) it's ok not to expect a man to pull his weight domestically
b) men use porn and it's fine and doesn't exploit women, oh no, it's fine, women do it because they want to, they love it
c) We all wax because men prefer i
d) I want him to earn plenty of money but I am pissed off that I never see him (er, goes with the territory)
e) I give bjs for shoes

expatinscotland · 25/04/2008 20:44

the colour of Johnny's skin drives me wild!

imagine licking that smooth chest of his . . . mmmmm.

WideWebWitch · 25/04/2008 20:47

Oh right, so she's a whining over sensitive feminst? Should she just get over:

the pay gap between men and women?
rape convictions being low and not taken seriously?
patriarchy and the way it's affected women for generations
the fact that women DO shoulder much of the domestic burden?
the fact that lots of women die as a result of unnecessary plastic surgery?
the fact that girls are sexualised earlier and earlier?

I could go on, but you get the point.
Why is it being 'whining and over sensitive' to hold her views? Blimey.

PosieParker · 25/04/2008 20:49

Johnny Depp, too boyish bit like Judas Law!

I can't help but think about housework that as a SAHM (oh the shame of it) is part of my job and as I hate it I have a cleaner (although did write cleaver!!), porn I hate it, I don't wax anymore as I haven't got time but then it's only a tidy and moreso when I'm my slim self and not pre/post baby, dp does earn plenty of money and finishes at 5 and I would never give a blow job for shoes, for pleasure yes and the shoes well I get them anyway.
I once watched a Dr Phil where a woman had a menu and prices for sex, $20 for a blowjob $100 anal etc.....

expatinscotland · 25/04/2008 20:50

I found her whinging and narrow in scope, WWW.

I truly did.

You didn't.

Okay. Good. Read her books then.

WideWebWitch · 25/04/2008 20:50

Hmm, so this has degenerated into a discussion about Depp and cocks...

Btw I don't think feminism means not liking sex (not at all) or not wanting sex and love, it's not about not wanting to look attractive either.

You can be a feminist, love sex and men (or women)and want to look attractive imo.

PosieParker · 25/04/2008 20:51

But women should carry some of the blame for all that, surely?

expatinscotland · 25/04/2008 20:51

She lives in one little world, WWW, that's why I find her narrow in scope and whingy.

And NONE of those arguments is anything new.

It's old news she just re-hashed.

Big whoop.

expatinscotland · 25/04/2008 20:52

I thought all prostitutes had a sort of menu for the services they offered, though.

WideWebWitch · 25/04/2008 20:53

So what about other feminists then? Do they live in their own little worlds? Faludi and Dworkin and Greer? (Ok, Dworkin probably did )

PosieParker · 25/04/2008 20:54

Mothers are to blame for lots and lots of this, especially how men think they shouldn't do housework. My little boys are under no illusion that we all share a responsibility for everything.

PosieParker · 25/04/2008 20:55

This woman's menu was for her husband...

PosieParker · 25/04/2008 20:55

This woman's menu was for her husband...

WideWebWitch · 25/04/2008 20:56

Without feminism:

women wouldn't be able to work after marriage
women would belong to their fathers until they handed you over to a husband
women wouldn't be able to vote
women wouldn't have independent taxation, i.e. their tax would be dealt with BY THEIR HUSBAND
rape in marriage would be legal
women who weren't married wouldn't have access to contraception

and the gender pay gap is STILL there
and women still DO get discriminated against for having babies and for just being women

An awful lot of the above has happened in my lifetime, I remember the day rape in marriage became illegal.