Rude, Racist or Right?

[tarmactreacle]

I rarely travel by bus but yesterday I was queuing behind a man for a bus to town.

When he got on he said "name of destination". The driver replied "no, it's "single to name of destination PLEASE". Have some manners, We're in England"

The man then politely repeated what the bus driver had asked him to say, took his ticket and sat down.

The man was black and the "we are in England" felt unnecessary and made me feel uncomfortable.

What are your thoughts?

Racist 💯

The man was rude just to say destination, for example, "Broadway".

The bus driver was not wrong to request a please.

The bus driver was very, very wrong to say "single to Broadway please" and expect it to be repeated.

The bus driver was racist and execrable to say "we are in England".

However, I am sick and tired of being the customer/client/patient and not receiving "please and thank you's" I do call it out because it's rude and discourteous.

Hmm… I was in Bermuda and was very properly schooled by a bus driver. I was rustling about as I boarded trying to sort out the fare and said ‘one adult please’ she gave me a look that Granny’s have perfected over the millennia and said “The proper way to board a bus in Bermuda is with Good Morning”.

Obviously I felt my own Granny’s eyes boring into me from the great beyond so restarted with a proper “good morning, one adult please”.

Was that racist or xenophobic?

Afterthought… we ended up sitting right behind the driver and she wasn’t wrong… everyone that got on that bus started with a good morning especially the students. She explained that any misbehavior (including omitting the proper greeting) would be reported to the school and detentions would be handed out. A lot of people even greeted the bus at large.

"I have now reported the driver", I hope you can live with yourself if he loses his job, suffers from extreme stress, gets ill as has happened to many people who have been cancelled for perceived (and often mistakenly perceived) racism. It is shocking how people are 100% mind readers over hearsay. Be kind.

@biscuitandcake it's implying that people with different coloured skin or who appear 'foreign' don't have manners. People in other countries have perfectly fine manners, maybe they don't speak English? But this customer clearly stated in English where he wanted to go. That's all you need to do with a bus driver. Forcing someone to say please and then being racist isn't helpful in the slightest.

Oh give over.

And there it is. White privilege.
You say perceived/mistakenly perceived, I say irrefutable. You just can't see it because you haven't been on the receiving end of it.
(Yes I'm making assumptions, apologies if mistaken.)

Whether she was racist is a more complex question linked with colonialism, race relations, whether white people can ever experience true racism etc....but she was definitely rude, and unnecessarily so. You were still polite and not disrespectful to her, there was no impact to her from one person not greeting her with a good morning.

Any etiquette guide will tell you that the absolute rudest thing you can do is correct someone else's manners, and to do so, particularly in public is far worse than whatever etiquette you consider them to have breached in the first place...

Oh get a grip
He's not going to lose his job over one complaint

If he's got a reasonable excuse or rationale that OP might have missed he can give it and no further action will be taken. If this is the only complaint of this nature that has ever been made he might get a mild warning. The only way any serious action would be taken is if there had been previous issues to suggest racism and if so he will deserve it!

Besides which even then it will probably just be sent on a diversity refresher training course or something.

Yes, racist.

I don’t think it’s a complex question. I was both a visitor and a minority in her country. She was also not rude at all. I appreciated the fact that she took the time to correct me so that I wouldn’t be inadvertently rude during my visit.

Now I will admit that I didn’t see if she corrected any locals… but that was down to lack of opportunity more than anything as everyone else said good morning.

Interesting that a similar situation can be viewed in different lenses though.

@DoTheDinosaurStomp as the vast bulk of respondents on this thread can see that it was racist, I'll just let you continue to stomp around maintaining it's just rudeness. Whatever.

yes definitly racist, would he say the same to a white person who said the same? if it was a white middle aged , middle class person i bet he would have kept quiet

No matter whether the passenger was rude the driver lost all the moral high ground when he chose to be racist in retaliation.

The last sentence was racist, no question about it. At the least the driver needs some training. What about being kind to the passenger?

Do you think the OP shouldn't do anything? How does racism get tackled if it's never called out or challenged? Do you think everyone should just give the benefit of the doubt or look the other way? Because there's nothing kind about that and nothing changes if no one acts.

I'm interested to know, who are all these people wrongly accused of racism that you refer to?

‘We should just #BeKind. And does racism really exist, anyways? Because I’ve never had anyone be racist against me. Now yes, before you ask, I am white, but I don’t see why that should make any difference. And again, please, may I remind everyone to #BeKind? And please do think of the bus drivers just teaching black people to be respectful’.

Well yes, I agree I think?

@Sunkisst yeah, I'm very over #BeKind.

I try to teach my daughter we don't have to be kind all the time, just don't be unkind. That's heavily linked to my views on female socialisation though, and I'm yet to see little boys in tshirts with "be kind" on them.
Anyway, I'd say this bus driver was actively being unkind, because he could. And he thought he'd get away with it because there are no colleagues around and he'd take a punt that no random would bother their arse and make an effort on account of a stranger. The sad thing is probably most people wouldn't.

I have said this is England or UK to teens and people acting as if they are in the Sopranos and growling all the time.

@biscuitandcake sorry, I wasn't trying to rant at you.

I'm not sure why you think I'd disagree with you, I thought it was rude too.

1. There's no way he's losing his job over this. Worst thing that will happen is a telling off or some sensitivity/inclusivity training,but even that is doubtful. He'll probably just have to keep his crap in his head from now on. Oh , the horror.

2.Why wasn't he kind to driver? Why do we always have to be kind to knobs/people who are knobs?

1. OP is being KIND. She's being kind to the man and any other passengers that might get similar treatment (even if he and them don't know it).

i wonder if the driver can live with himself being a casual racist.

I wonder if the other people who heard his casual racism and did nothing can live with themselves.

The fact is he is very unlikely to lose his job because a 3rd party complained. And that is ok with me. Someone needs to have a word with him about how he talks to customers. It is ok for a customer not to say please or thank you and for the driver to think they are a rude dick. That thought should stay in their head though.

also, for pp, saying "this is England" to teens talking as though they're in the Sopranos is a WHOLE other kettle of fish, assuming you are either their parent/relative or a teacher. I would agree that it's rude to bowl up to a random bunch of teenagers talking like that and saying it to them.

Update:

I received a reply from the bus company.

"Based on your information and CCTV reviews, we have identified the driver. The behaviour described is not acceptable. The driver will be reminded of our standards and they may face disciplinary action if deemed necessary. Additional training will be provided to prevent future incidents."