Arguing with an old lady

[MrsTurner3]

I was at an old run down shopping centre today. I had my 4 year old walking and my 1 year old in the buggy and needed to get the only working lift so I stood waiting for about 5 minutes for it for to up and down past my floor several times before it finally stopped for us. I had noticed an old (70s ish) lady stood waiting behind us and as the lift stopped and everyone piled out she edged her way around us to be first outside the door.

I should say here that I hate people who jump queues and think they are entitled to things more than other people. It's a big peeve of mine.

I just knew she was making her way to get in there first so I started pushing the buggy towards the lift and she turned around and said " Are you going up or down?" I said down (I'd pressed the down button outside). And she said "Oh well I'm going up, so we will go up first, and then you can go down". I was annoyed and replied "Well no, since I've been waiting longer we will go down first and then you can go up." She got in the lift and pressed the button for her floor and then said "Oh look, my floor has already been pressed by someone." She had a smug smile on her face.

Maybe I need some therapy to understand why people being smug and entitled triggers me so much - anyway as I'm getting into the lift I blurted out "You are so rude you know. First you push in front of me, then you tell me I have to wait for you to go to your floor and then I can go to mine, then you blatantly lie to get your own way and look really happy about it". She said that when I get to her age I will understand and I said something along the lines of "Just because you are old, it doesn't entitle you to get your own way and do whatever you want". She got out of the lift and laughed at me and walked off.

I wish I had kept my cool. I had to explain to my 4 year old that mummy was standing up to someone being rude and trying to get their own way, but I think the message of "don't be a pushover" will have been lost to the image of me just arguing with an old lady.

I know I could have done better, but am I totally unreasonable for not wanting to be a people pleasing pushover and for actually standing up to people, regardless of their age? If she had been feeling unwell or looked infirm and at least asked if we could go to her floor first rather than tell me, I'd more than likely have said yes.

Just because she’s old doesn’t mean she’s not an arsehole. And I say this as the daughter of an elderly arsehole.

Do you know, I thought you were going to talk about letting her go first. If I saw an older person waiting, I'd let her go on first and wouldn't bother about going to her floor before mine because I'd be modelling courtesy to my children. As others have said lifts can be quite random anyway, and if it's one floor up and several down it makes sense to go up first (were you nearer your floor?) The way you have made this as big issue about justice doesn't I think reflect especially well on you; the way you have told it of course you are in the right. Sometimes being in the right is not the most important thing.

The woman used her age as an excuse for her behaviour. It wasn't bigotry, it was a description of her to provide context.

And this proves what?

Because one " older woman" was unpleasant to you is this supposed to prove all " older " women are unpleasant.

Do you never come across unpleasant people who aren't " older " than you?

Just wait until you are " older" and people start stereotyping you because you have had the audacity to actually age. It's not pleasant.

She sounds horrible, I’m sorry you had to put up with her rude behaviour. I’m well on my way to being her age (56) and I would never dream of behaving like that. My 88 year old mum, on the other hand, is one of the most entitled people I know. Sadly there are plenty rude and entitled arseholes of all ages 😟

I had noticed an old (70s ish) lady stood waiting behind us and as the lift stopped and everyone piled out she edged her way around us to be first outside the door. I should say here that I hate people who jump queues and think they are entitled to things more than other people. It's a big peeve of mine.

Also if you could both fit in the lift why on earth does it matter if she went round you to be by the edge of the lift. It's hardly jumping a queue for a ticket or something. You do sound like you were weirdly triggered and wound up by something that (a) doesn't matter and (b) was very likely to be behaviour because she needed to use the lift and found standing for any prolonged period painful so wanted to be sure she got in the lift.

I would understand more if you were in a queue for the last Taylor Swift tickets or something where+1 in the queue might mean the difference between success or failure but for a lift where you can both fit in? It's really odd to get that worked up about it.

Yanbu. I hate this kind of entitled and inconsiderate behaviour from people of any age.

The woman used her age as an excuse for her behaviour. It wasn't bigotry, it was a description of her to provide context.

You'll see from the opening line of my post that my remarks referenced a later poster. I read your OP and I was aware that the rude woman in question had used her age as an excuse. Rude selfish people will use anything as an excuse, it does not mean that her age caused her rudeness, which was what a later poster (the one I quoted) implied. It only means that she was a rude person who happens coincidentally to be old.

She sounds like a rude entitled knob. 17 or 70, you don't behave like that. Well done for calling her out, OP!

The woman didn't use her age to excuse her being rude. She told you you'd understand when you got to her age. You have chosen to interpret that as meaning you will understand why old people are rude when you get old. But it could also have meant you'll understand why I want to get to my floor/my car/home/off my feet as quickly as possible when you get to my age, could it not? In fact I'd say that's more likely as very few people when told they're rude and liars respond by agreeing with you, with or without their age as an excuse.

Alwayssomethingtheretoremindme
You’re getting a bit boring now. The op was telling us she went into an M and S and an older women was rude. She never said all older folk! She wasn’t stereotyping older people, she was telling us about the scene in the shop. If it was a middle aged person, she would say middle aged.

Why does her age mean that she is "weak"? I didn't challenge her because she was older or because I thought she was weak. I challenged her because I felt she was rude and entitled. But I mentioned her age here as it added context, seeing as she used her age herself as an excuse for her actions.
And she was being far more aggressive towards me than I was with her.

Yes. Lift etiquette is you ask the other person where they are going and press for them/ let them choose first.

Or you argue - after you - no you first etc -

True that she was pushing in, but did it really matter that you went up a couple of floors before going down? It would only take an extra minute or two. Maybe you were both making too much of who got their needs met first.

She was very rude and used her age as an excuse so YANBU.
Some of the follow up posts implying all older women are rude are ageist because they generalise.
This particular woman was rude and it was worth pointing it out to her.
I'm 72. I feel the same inside as I always have. I do wonder sometimes how I'm perceived. Don't suppose it matters really. I know that I am generally polite, not right wing take everyone as I find them etc.

Well it was only one floor down for me, and three up for her, then it stopped at every floor on the way back down. I'm curious why you think it's only right to be courteous and let an older person go first though. The lady appeared to be completely mobile and able. My mum is in her 70s and she wouldn't expect someone to offer for her to go first on something just because of her age, she would wait her turn. I had two tired children who I needed to get home for their tea and I put my children's needs first. It sounds like you think I should be teaching my children that I will put other people's needs before their own, even when that person has been rude to me?

So if her age is irrelevant and it's no different from arguing with a person of any age, why were you concerned about your DC seeing your 'arguing with an old woman' rather than simply seeing you arguing? It was you who framed the altercation as particularly bad given the age of the person you were having a go at. Why do you think its worse because she was old? Why would your DC?

I think it's odd that you've told me to be careful to assume anything , but you've assumed I'm young and healthy and didn't also need to use the lift quickly.

You should be teaching your children that it's not necessary to go hell for leather at other people over every small thing that annoys you. That some things are important and other things are not. In your OP you actually say you know you should have 'done better'. Some of us are agreeing with you and saying yes, yes you should. Why are you now arguing with those of us who agree with you?

In my opinion, like going through a door etc it's good manners in a lift to allow others to go first. Since when did everyone become so angry and entitled?

Hell for leather is definitely an exaggeration

I think you’re right that you could have done better, but the other woman could have done better too. However I think you’ve made this more about “giving as good as you get” and modelled unnecessary aggression in front of your children, and it all sounds a bit juvenile. It might have been better to have modelled quiet dignity. I’ve no right to judge you, once or twice I’ve done similar and regretted it, but since you asked, I think YABU.

That sort of thing though is someone who is struggling. I know we all have to manage whatever challenges we have, but something that outspoken and unprovoked is a case of having mental health or cognitive challenges I’m sure. I find it helps me to approach that sort of interaction with a bit of compassion - though I fully understand how unpleasant it must have been for you. I do think, though, it runs deeper than her just being rude.

Apologies I misunderstood!