To think it's cruel to enter your child for nine 11+ exams?

[48wheaties]

Seen the news article about the child from Isle of Wight who passed nine 11+ exams in various counties all over the country. I think it's unkind to put a child through that. Yes, he's a bright boy, but what are the parents thinking? And no, I dont know them personally. (Runs for cover)

I think it’s the same study if you do 1 or 5 tests no? Sounds like he has a ton of hobbies plus a youtube channel!

With the bucks test, I know people get upset about children sitting it who live far away. But I don't think it's the case that if you banned the out of area kids that there would be 600+ more local kids who got a space in a gs. The numbers are all factored in by the bucks authorities as at the end of the day there are limited places at gs. I actually think have the appeals process being relatively lenient for borderline cases (about 35 per cent of local kids are successful at appeal) is a good thing as it allows a route for kids who would do well in gs but didn't do as well on the test. It gives flexibility and control to the bucks admission authorities. I realise it creates months of stress to local kids who are borderline but that's the same as most kids in the big cities who wait until March to find out if they got the school they wanted. I think grammar schools aren't great in principle but if you are going to have a system like that I think the bucks one is the best (esp as legally they can't prevent out of area people taking it). There's quite a few kids just over the border in Berkshire or Oxfordshire or Milton Keynes who do bucks year and do get in by the way (and live fairly close to gs) so again I don't think it would be fair to ban out of region kids totally anyhow.

A school mum who recently relocated to a grammar school area told me last summer 'I told X we made a huge change for him to have the chance to get a great education so he better bloody pass!' Says it all really...

I always really enjoyed doing exams, so I wouldn’t have minded this at all, but I was also very good at exams and wouldn’t have needed this many

. It’s only cruel if too much pressure is put on the child, and one way of doing that would be sitting so many tests. Most kids shouldn’t be doing more than three.

I just think it's really poor form TBH - if you don't live in catchment or within the usual distance of offers given BEFORE the exam is taken, there is virtually no chance of getting a place. It's clearly stated

I currently know 4 Y6 DC who just missed the 121 mark who are now going through the review process. They are in limbo which is really stressful for them and their parents.

I don't live in Bucks, however, I do live within catchment for 2 grammar schools as they are only a few miles away. That's why offers are given to DC in Berks / Milton Keynes etc They live within the catchment boundary

As I said upthread, parents who do this have either not read the.admissions rules, or they have and don't care. Both of these are twattish behaviours because they impact on DCs who do live in catchment while affording very little benefit to those who don't. To put it into perspective, according to the local.govern!ent website there were no successful grammar school appeals from out-of-county applicants in 2023.

Obviously there aren't hundreds of local DCs missing out but there maybe dozens. The appeal process is stressful and leaves families in limbo for quite a while. Appeal panels are independent and can make their decisions on a very subjective basis - I fail to see what's so great about that.

Even before I clicked on the link, I knew this is going to be someone with parents of Indian origin!! And before anyone says anything, I'm of Indian origin myself!! Hence I know how mad the Indian community is over grammar schools! I know someone in real life who's child sat more than 9 exams, passed them all with flying colours and then the parents didn't know which school to choose😂

On a more serious note, what these parents don't realise is that they're taking away spaces from other children in areas which have catchments associated with grammar schools. Even if they do decide to move into the catchment area, they should have narrowed down their choices and not done 9 exams.

We live in South east and my child sat 2 11 plus exams. Amongst my Indian friends, we were the only ones who didn't do the Surrey/Sutton exam as we were very clear that we don't intent to move there no matter how good the school is and how well our child does in the Surrey/Sutton exam. Everyone else I know has sat at least 4/5 11 plus exams and then additional private schools exams just in case 😫

I could go on and on about how we have ruined the system with over tutoring. I wish I had the courage to take a stand and not put my child through the system, but then I would be holding them back...

He's done really well
However, I am pretty sure that grammar schools have catchment areas. I know that the Tiffin schools in Kingston have " designated areas" and you are unlikely to get a place if you live outside of them. So even if he passed the exams he wouldn't get a place if he lived in the Isle of Wight.

I remember reading about this family in the IoW. I know that a few people have said that it’s poor of the parents to have him sit exams for schools that he isn’t in catch ment for. If there was a grammar school on the IoW, this family wouldn’t have felt as though they had to do this. Rightly or wrongly, they really want him to go to a grammar school - something that is available in Kent and Bucks but not in the IoW.

It’s peculiar that this is a form of schooling available to children in some counties but not in others.

The IoW is a beautiful place but is really quite poorly served for schools. As a result, families often hesitate before moving there permanently. It sounds as though these parents have skills that benefit the island - but they are planning on moving because the island doesn’t offer them the sort of school they want.

Is that legal now? Because after the Greenwich Ruling, introduced in between the dates when dds sat the 11+, out of borough children were allowed to compete for places.

As a result, dd1 passed outright, whereas dd2 got a place via the waiting list, and in her case we were informed that before the Greenwich Ruling, she’d have got a place first off.

Still completely pointless taking the Bucks test @CruCru as you have to live in catchment to access those schools.

Some parts of Kent have super-selectives so that is a different matter.

I've heard of children taking the exams for selective state schools (which are often in early September) as a practice for entrance exams to independent schools (which are later in the school year). It may be that the family were treating the Bucks exam in the same way.

Yes, that's quite possible. And also as practice for other 11+ exams for schools where they could win a place. I do get it.

But it's incredibly selfish because it has a direct impact on children who are eligible for those Bucks grammar school places. There are other ways to practise which don't adversely affect other children.

I found my 11+ a breeze and would have loved it. My parents never made a big thing of any exam I ever had to take with the result I was never worried or anxious about any of them.

Some kids, I agree would have found this torture.

All depends on the child and the parents' attitude.

My eldest would have loved this. She's always loved taking exams and went into school with a big grim on her face every day of the GCSEs.

My first thought was it was because the kid loved taking exams and so it was like a day out for him. I have a kid like that.

I've not read the article. I do think 9 is excessive, no matter how academic the child is. I don't believe they can all be state grammars, as they usually have strict catchment areas - which loads of people seem to think shouldn't apply to them, then moan when they are enforced.

We lived in a county with no grammars, and schools with major behaviour issues in our town eg another of my DC had concussion during their GCSEs. One of my DC asked if they could take entrance exams to indie schools. When I asked how in the hell I was going to find the money (skint single parent), they said they wanted to try, and then see if they might be able to get a scholarship or bursary. I blame Robin Stevens & Enid Blyton 😉.

They tried for 3 (2 different counties). A small amount of prep outside what they were doing for SATS (was already top in their year in almost every subject), largely to get used to the question format, although students already at the school also took the exam. Got a really good pass, was offered a place at their first choice and due to my low income were given a partial bursary (not guaranteed, I have to reapply each year).

We now also live very close to DC school. For unrelated reasons we had to move house anyway, so it was easy to move nearby.

@NCembarassed they may have catchment for admission but anyone can sit the exams (by law) & then move, if they can time it right.

I hadn't realised that, so thanks for the note.

However, one of the state grammars I know of says that you apply using your county's application form. Surely that means you can only apply for a max 3 state grammars?

I hadn't realised there are 163 state grammars in England (according to Google), but these are spread across 5 counties.

Different areas have different numbers of schools on their form (weird, I know!). I think ours has 6.
Gives you a choice depending on which they pass, I suppose. Mad, I know, but people do do it.

Just to say, in Bucks you have to be living in catchment before you take the test. In some cases, a long time before.

So it's totally pointless taking the Bucks 11+ if you do not already live in Bucks.

For most schools that is very recent. They can't stop them sitting the tests as a mock, even so. Or people don't know the criteria & sit it anyway.

Yes, sorry I wasn’t very clear. You are absolutely correct that the right to sit the test is enshrined in law, no matter where you live.

however you won’t gain a place due to catchment area criteria. To meet those you have to already be living in the catchment area.

and yes you’re right, a lot of people don’t check the catchment area rules before sitting the test, which adversely affects DCs who are in the catchment area. It’s pretty poor behaviour tbh.

Since when is this the rule? When myDD took it we were out of catchment but not impossibly far. That was 2017 though so looks like rules have changed.