To think the system’s set up so the rich get richer and the poor get screwed?

[ThatGreenBear]

I’ve been thinking a lot lately about how society is structured, and it feels like no matter how hard some people work, they’re always struggling, while others just seem to get wealthier with minimal effort. Whether it’s the tax system, housing market, or even access to education and opportunities, everything seems stacked in favor of those who already have money and power.

AIBU to think that the system is rigged to keep the wealthy at the top while making it incredibly hard for the rest of us to get ahead? Or is this just how life works and we should all just accept it? I’d love to hear others’ thoughts on whether the playing field is as unfair as it seems, or if it’s possible for anyone to get ahead with enough hard work.

100%!
My exdh left me and while waiting for UC to come through I ended up with some small debts. My electric meter was changed to payg which is a lot more money that paying it via direct debt, struggled with council tax so it went to magistrates and I ended up nearly owing double

I had no money, no idea what they wanted me to do at the time. Luckily I'm in a better situation now

Agree to an extent. The Internet would have been life changing for me but it didn't exist when I was making important decisions. Not so sure about peers. Had I gone down the same path as my peers I would have been pregnant before I left school or leaving to work in a supermarket. My sons peers are a shambles and I wish I could have sent him to private school for exactly that reason.

Some people on this thread need to read this and gain some understanding about what it is like to have a truly disadvantaged childhood. Many poorer people work just as hard as rich people. What about cleaners or bin men? Factory workers doing night shifts? Childcare workers? Care workers. All these people work hard and do some of the most essential roles in society.

I'm only somewhere in the middle but I don't kid myself that our comfortable life wasn't massively helped along by being warm, fed, loved, had a home with books, got grinds in a subject I struggled in, had parents valued education and I had the confidence and a sense of belonging within university and my career.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Poor-courage-life-changing-value-self-belief-ebook/dp/B0BT4PVYMH/ref=mpssa111?crid=PG2J66NNBVCB&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.1d4p0nXcSGSsdcmWHQ1Mu4mKjQ3h7RP3oipOvdWvBRPGjHj071QN20LucGBJIEps.VnI0lmON4bxdCckV5Cab8mUSk9xu2IoD1bAU2g-ELw&dibb_tag=se&keywords=poor+katriona+o%27sullivan&nsdOptOutParam=true&qid=1729898007&sprefix=poor%2Caps%2C169&sr=8-1

There’s a difference though between those born into wealth, who might have an easy ride, against those who choose to work hard, to get ahead in life, then reap the rewards of their hard work. You make your own luck in life, make your choices, choose your own path. I don’t get why people expect a level playing field whilst not wanting to do the work. You’re never going to to get a situation whereby someone who does a vocation or goes to Uni to raise their earning potential is going to have the same wealth as someone who chooses to do a job or take a role which doesn’t have the same income. Otherwise, why would people even bother to study?

Money doesn’t just land on peoples laps, active decisions are made to get it

it has for plenty of people who bought property at the right time.

It's not just capitalism but specifically late stage capitalism, which is where western economies are now, coupled with the remnants of feudalism that we have in the UK. That's what's tying up all the wealth and assets.

This, things aren’t getting better anytime soon…

@violentovulation , that is the very opposite of Capitalism which gives opportunity to all.

Every single person I know that is wealthy had privilege.

One or all of the following
• inherited money
•2 parent family
•no disability
• born In an area that wasn't socially deprived
• born to parents that were themselves educated and or/entreprenurial

The hardest working person I've ever met is my cleaner. Works far far far harder than me.

Money goes to money.

'If you work hard, you'll get there' is only really true for a few career paths. If I work really hard as a nurse, I'll not become rich. Yet we all can't choice the same paths. If we all become financiers, who does everything else?
I've been lucky to work with some elderly people who had done very well for themselves financially. One thing that struck me was how much luck came into it, parents leaving them houses in areas which became fashionable, being the first person to study a particular subject that ended up being very important (computer science) or investing well. Like PP said, many people could have made other choices which wouldn't have led to wealth.
But many end up in a position where someone like me cares for them. Someone on very little. And all the things they wish for then, at that stage, cannot be bought. That's the tragic irony of life. Essentially our lives are only as rich as our health allows.

I think people are mixing up the 1% with an average comfortable and stable family.
Yes more of the wealth is pooling at the top but the middle classes don’t always have it easy. Work very hard for increasingly poorer quality of life.
Anyone in the North can move to the South East if they want. It’s very hard work to earn enough to live though. Most who will inherit won’t do so until middle age. I live in a tiny 3 bed with 3 adult DC near London. There are downsides to every situation and upsides too.
Hard work doesn’t make enough of a difference these days. Those times seem to be gone.

Socialism is alive & well in the uk but it's totally bastardised.
We reward & protect the people who fuck up
And denounce the people who work hard.

Bankers who brought the country to brink of ruin. Bonus protected.

Nurses shafted

Yes and now it's creeping into the middle class too.

Everyone gets 13 years of free education. Though I admit private schools give a huge advantage.

Really?

Every rich person I know started rich.

They had a house/flat bought, fully paid, and fully furnished when starting uni. Not necessarily a grandiose one, but one, nevertheless. So already, light years ahead of most others in terms of saving, investments etc.

They had their education fully paid for so no debt.

They had good contacts, so started immediately with good internships, and very good starter jobs.

They had various inheritances at various stages - grand parents, parents, bachelor uncle etc. Most of those went back into investments/ property etc.

Most had parents who started saving for their children's (the parents grandchildren) education as soon as they were born, so the wealth stays generational, the cycle continues.

And ALL really respect money. I see very few of them in a high turnover designer clothes, cars etc. In spite of very well to do circumstances, I see frugality, not too much extravagance, and well thought out indulgences.

They live well, but don't flash the cash.

OP - you are correct. Some people break through, but most are on a cycle.

@beachcitygirl

Very well said.

Excellent summary on a new book called "how to get rich." :)

Yes absolutely.

it used to be called "The Landlord's Game" it was invented by a woman and a man stole the idea and the IP... go figure

everyone starts out with exactly the same, and over time through a combination of good investment decisions and luck (both of which are exactly what this thread is ultimately all about) someone comes out on top and others end up bankrupt.

the obvious flaw of course is that in real life, everyone doesn't start out with exactly the same, and that's down to which family you are born into, your health circumstances and whether you get a good start in life or not. But though life, those who had a terrible start in life, may use that as their driver to become successful. Think, Bruce Oldfield the famous fashion icon who was raised in the Bernardo's Home for boys. Compare him to the life the Beckhams could give their children, they've never wanted for anything since the day they were born.

There is no rule book that says "Life must be fair"

The only rich people I know have built businesses from nothing
a d made enormous sacrifices I wouldn’t if been prepared to do

I live in Scotland & although I don't know her personally- there was a wonderful young woman a few years ago from a deprived area who achieved incredible advanced higher results (5A*) and applied to do medicine. Her mum a single mum who worked in the bingo, she didn't know a single doctor and so she hadn't done the necessary practical part.
Those places went to kids whose parents t knew doctors (albeit smart kids ) but not as smart as her.
Life is not equal.
Even in a comprehensive school some kids have warm coats, good breakfasts, a bedroom to themselves, a place to study. Some are working befor & after school or helping to raise siblings.

Privilege has many faces.

Opportunity to all .... but "all" are most certainly not on the same level playing field.

I certainly feel we are now in a position where it is very hard to get on through hard work alone. I cannot see, at least in the SE, how the majority of young people will be able to buy houses without inheritance or help with a deposit. If your parents can't help, then what do you do??

I think it is very worrying to be in a position where work doesn't necessarily pay. Or that wealth has to be inherited. Not a good message to send to people starting out in life.

Christ OP, you need to calm down. There was nothing sarcastic or condescending about this comment. This person was agreeing with you.

@yesmen , perhaps you mix in more elevated circles than me. I don’t know what you define as rich but I know a lot of people who left school at 16 with a smattering of O levels. We’ve worked like Trojans for years, not for us 9 to 5 or 4 weeks holiday a year. Our days were long and our time with our children limited. During this time we earned well and payed LOTS of tax. We could have lived the high life but instead we lived a relatively frugal lifestyle carefully investing for our future. We gave employment to many along the way. I retired when I was 59. I live in a very nice house and am comfortable, all my hard work was directed at not being a burden in my old age to my children or the state. There are many like me who took what they did have and looked to the future, took risks, worked harder than most would ever contemplate and have become Wealthy and successful. It’s positively wicked to tell people it can’t be done when it absolutely can.

FWIW, I did English Lit and if I worked FT would earn well over 100k. I just prefer a work life balance which is heavily weighted on the 'life' side. You don't have to avoid subjects you love at uni - you have to know which careers they can lead to that would potentially create wealth.

But if you are 59 you surely began in an era when a shitty ex council flat in a dodgy area didn't cost the best part of half a million.

The inequality in our current capitalist set up is that the primary necessity of life - shelter - costs so much.It's far harder foryoung people without handouts from wealthy families to get started these days.

@daisychain01 , are you in favour of Communism because that’s the only supposedly level playing field I’m aware of?
Of course we all have different advantages and privileges along with disadvantages but it’s what we do with what we do have that determines how successful we are. I really hate the mindset that there are certain people who because of an accident of birth are bound to either succeed or fail. It simply is not true and it stops too many from ever trying to get on.