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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

"Hanged" vs "Hung"

121 replies

HornungTheHelpful · 22/10/2024 17:09

I've noticed recently that it appears to be increasingly common to refer to a person as having been "hung" rather than "hanged". I find it really jarring. OED Online confirms that "hung" is not the past tense of "hang" where it refers to the punishment of hanging.

Presumably at some point the OED will embrace it so I may as well get used to it now. But AIBU to ask if anyone else finds it a jarring form of speech? (please take as read all of the necessary caveats about how it's a nice problem to have, if it bothers me I should just ignore it, why am I such a snob about language, I've started a sentence with a conjunction so can I really criticise etc, etc).

OP posts:
AcceptAllChanges · 24/10/2024 20:31

You are absolutely correct, but I still voted YABU for the simple reason that language is not static. There is a constant flood of new words into the English language, and the way we use "old" words evolves too. It's only natural that common usage will eventually prevail over what was once considered correct. Otherwise, we'd all still be talking like the Wife of Bath.

HornungTheHelpful · 25/10/2024 05:10

AcceptAllChanges · 24/10/2024 20:31

You are absolutely correct, but I still voted YABU for the simple reason that language is not static. There is a constant flood of new words into the English language, and the way we use "old" words evolves too. It's only natural that common usage will eventually prevail over what was once considered correct. Otherwise, we'd all still be talking like the Wife of Bath.

Thank you for that little homily 🤣

OP posts:
HornungTheHelpful · 25/10/2024 05:18

katie20202 · 24/10/2024 20:24

What is this thread!!!
I have lost an extremely close family member to suicide or as you all put it hanged or hung himself! I find this thread triggering!

I am sorry for your loss, but if you find it upsetting don’t read it. It is clear from my OP what the thread is about (which is correct use of language). People are allowed to talk about things that upset you - you can choose to engage and be upset or not engage. You can’t dictate what they discuss.

OP posts:
ReadWithScepticism · 25/10/2024 07:35

Completely agree, @HornungTheHelpful. I'm glad you found a way to express the unreasonableness of that post so courteously, as I found it quite a troubling overreach.

Moulook31 · 25/10/2024 07:37

MasterBeth · 22/10/2024 17:19

How often are you talking about people being hanged, in order for it to be a matter of concern?

😄😄😄

Catsmere · 25/10/2024 07:45

ReadWithScepticism · 25/10/2024 07:35

Completely agree, @HornungTheHelpful. I'm glad you found a way to express the unreasonableness of that post so courteously, as I found it quite a troubling overreach.

I also agree.

HundredAcreOwl · 25/10/2024 07:48

Catsmere · 25/10/2024 07:45

I also agree.

As do I.

Sharptonguedwoman · 25/10/2024 08:01

KnopkaPixie · 22/10/2024 17:20

Another one which never seems quite right to me is the past tense of 'to dive' is 'dove' but not dived.
He dove into the river?
He dived into the river?

I'm doubting myself now.

Pretty sure it's dived. Checking now.....apparently can use both but 'dived' is UK and 'dove' US.

Sharptonguedwoman · 25/10/2024 08:02

HornungTheHelpful · 22/10/2024 19:23

Twice in the last week. I’m not saying it’s always that frequent but that’s what prompted the thread.

I think it came up a lot on the Yorkshire Ripper thread.

Sharptonguedwoman · 25/10/2024 08:08

EggnogAnd · 23/10/2024 14:57

This is a hill on which I will absolutely die. Grin

Joining you on that hill.
Adding 'Hens lay, people lie' to my hill as well.

Catsmere · 25/10/2024 08:44

Sharptonguedwoman · 25/10/2024 08:08

Joining you on that hill.
Adding 'Hens lay, people lie' to my hill as well.

Lay misused for lie is the one that annoys me most of all, even more than "should of" for "should have", probably because I hardly ever hear, let alone read, the correct version!

Time was "lay" misused was a real class marker here in Australia.

GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER · 25/10/2024 08:53

Not a new thing - for as long as I can remember people have always said ‘hung’ when strictly speaking it should be ‘hanged’.

GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER · 25/10/2024 08:59

newnamethanks · 22/10/2024 22:12

Very annoying ad on radio at the moment, someone says 'the bell rung'. No. It rang because the bell was rung.

The ad for Waitrose says ‘The phone rung’! 😱
One simply doesn’t expect it from Waitrose, does one?

schmeler · 25/10/2024 09:13

Hung means to be suspended....an object can be hung (pictures,washing etc).

Hanged means to die by hanging.

Hung, drawn and quartered means they suspended someone but made sure they were not dead before they carried out the rest of the punishment.

Catsmere · 25/10/2024 09:45

schmeler · 25/10/2024 09:13

Hung means to be suspended....an object can be hung (pictures,washing etc).

Hanged means to die by hanging.

Hung, drawn and quartered means they suspended someone but made sure they were not dead before they carried out the rest of the punishment.

There's an interesting discussion further back in the thread about the uncertainty of the usage and meanings regarding that punishment.

HornungTheHelpful · 25/10/2024 18:10

GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER · 25/10/2024 08:59

The ad for Waitrose says ‘The phone rung’! 😱
One simply doesn’t expect it from Waitrose, does one?

The local Waitrose has a sign periodically displayed that says “we politely ask you to refrain children from standing in the trolleys”. I complain every time. It is beyond illiterate.

OP posts:
GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER · 25/10/2024 18:25

HornungTheHelpful · 25/10/2024 18:10

The local Waitrose has a sign periodically displayed that says “we politely ask you to refrain children from standing in the trolleys”. I complain every time. It is beyond illiterate.

Edited

When even Waitrose is at it, and don’t care, no wonder the country’s standards of literacy are going to the 🐶🐶.

Londonmummy66 · 25/10/2024 18:48

SmileyHappyPeopleInTheSun · 24/10/2024 12:14

I was under impression the drawn bit referred to the disemboweling while still alive part ie after being hung till nearly dead - rather than the taken in pillory to the executions site as "normal" hanging had that as well and the hung drawn and quarters sentence were an especially nasty measure usually for high treason in middle ages.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanged,_drawn_and_quartered

The use of the word "drawn", as in "to draw", has caused a degree of confusion. One of the Oxford English Dictionary's definitions of draw is "to draw out the viscera or intestines of; to disembowel (a fowl, etc. before cooking, a traitor or other criminal after hanging)", but this is followed by "in many cases of executions it is uncertain whether this, or [to drag (a criminal) at a horse's tail, or on a hurdle or the like, to the place of execution; formerly a legal punishment of high treason], is meant. The presumption is that where drawn is mentioned after hanged, the sense is as here."[37] Historian Ram Sharan Sharma arrived at the same conclusion: "Where, as in the popular hung, drawn and quartered [use] (meaning facetiously, of a person, completely disposed of), drawn follows hanged or hung, it is to be referred to as the disembowelling of the traitor."[38] Sharma is not the only historian to support this viewpoint as the phrase, "hanged until dead before being drawn and quartered", occurs in a number of relevant secondary publications.[39][40] The historian and author Ian Mortimer disagrees. In an essay published on his website, he writes that the separate mention of evisceration is a relatively modern device, and that while it certainly took place on many occasions, the presumption that drawing means to disembowel is spurious. Instead, drawing (as a method of transportation) may be mentioned after hanging because it was a supplementary part of the execution.[41]

However seems even that is under dispute.

I don't agree - the drawing was to be drawn on a hurdle (and later a sled) rather than just transported in a (more comfortable) tumbril. There were instances where criminals were drawn to execution but then not hanged. For example women accused of petty treason (murdering their husbands or for coining usually) were drawn and then burned - this is mentioned in Blackstone's commentaries "to be drawn to the gallows, and there to be burned alive", was equally awful to being hanged drawn and quartered. Subsequently the disembowelment of men was dropped in favour of hanging until dead and then removing the head but they were still sentenced to be hanged drawn and beheaded. Later when they started to execute people by their prisons rather than in execution places like Tyburn there were a number of cases where people had to be ritually drawn on sleds around the prison yard first.

itsmabeline · 25/10/2024 18:50

Do you really read about hanging that often? What are you reading???

I am hoping it is history books!

AcceptAllChanges · 25/10/2024 19:05

HornungTheHelpful · 25/10/2024 05:10

Thank you for that little homily 🤣

My pleasure 😂

It is in fact my job to impose pedantry on language. So I know where you're coming from. In my free time, I am much more liberal!

HornungTheHelpful · 26/10/2024 15:42

AcceptAllChanges · 25/10/2024 19:05

My pleasure 😂

It is in fact my job to impose pedantry on language. So I know where you're coming from. In my free time, I am much more liberal!

Me too - but I keep going in my free time 🤣

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