If you own a second home how do you get treated by locals?

[Poiul]

Aware of the feelings towards second home owners on mumsnet. Does that contempt translate into real life is my question.

Banning and high taxing is always the "solution" given by many - it isn't. As you will see from my posts I am from a very popular tourist area. I could have the mindset many have shown on this thread or the numerous others there are of the "bash second home owners/holiday lets" that frequently appear but I am not, I am realistic as to how areas survive. If tourism did not exist here, there only other main income generation is hill farming - it is not enough to sustain the area.

Too many of friends and family will happily sell a property at high prices to non-local folk, then complain there are not enough houses for locals to purchase or the prices are too high.

For many rural tourist areas irrespective of tourism there are not enough jobs for locals, so for the younger generation it will mean, if they do not wish to farm or work in tourism they will have to move to other areas, where property is normally cheaper.

As for those complaining about the grants given during covid went to a % of people who didn't live in the UK but had a second home here, it was how the rules worked - we did not receive any grants as we own a company and therefore were deemed we somehow fiddled the tax system using dividends, so like others we struggled to pay the mortgage. Was it annoying to see plenty of others receive money, yes but in life you just get on with things and do your best to protect ones own family.

People are allowed to spend their money on whatever they want, others are allowed to sell their property to whomever they want (unless a s106 or restriction is in place) I certainly do not want to live in a society where an over reaching government thinks it can tell people where they should and should not live - if someone wants more than 1 home and can afford it then fine, someone else would have benefitted from selling it to them at a higher price if in a desirable area.

It's always been very convenient to present figures for Cornwall as a whole, it masks the problems nicely. You muddle up figures for empty homes/tourism reliance using densely populated areas like Bodmin, Redruth etc with the tiny villages along the coast & it's like 'there's no problem here 🤷🏼‍♀️'. Well there is, there really really is.

@sHREDDIES19

"We have two in a very popular tourist spot. One is long term rental the other is a holiday let. We use it as much as we can. I am well aware of the general unease some people have around this subject and I do understand. For me, that's why I don't have it empty for large chunks of time. If it's being used, it's helping us out and contributing to the local economy."

I have no issue with the long term rental especially in a tourist spot as you are providing housing for someone that lives and works in the local economy all year round.

But let's look at the holiday let. Now if you wished to change its use from a residential home to let's say a B&B or even a hotel then you would need planning permission. So why should you be able to change the use from residential to a holiday let without planning permission.

For me the simplest solution is to require planning permission for any change from a permanently occupied residential home (owned or rented). Local authorities can then decide how many holiday lets are permitted in each area in order to keep them as viable communities rather than becoming theme parks.

Your friends may well judge you for having a second home

I judge my friends who do, but wouldn't tell them that as they've never asked my view

Alas even if not sold to second home owners, honestly in desirable holiday areas won't sell to locals. They are too expensive.
They will be sold to rich retirees from elsewhere or rich yummys Looking for the good life.

Which is fine, except that they tend to move in, go on committees to tell the locals how they have been doing everything wrong and then try to turn the place onto whatever suburbia they have moved from. That really pisses people off

I spoke to an elderly lady last year who lives in a terraced cottage in a coastal area.

She said there used to be a good community but there's nobody around in the winter anymore, due to most of the houses in her street being holiday homes/air bnbs, and she feels really lonely and vulnerable now. That made me feel very sad for her.

People are allowed to retire or seek a better life wherever they wish, some areas will be more desirable than others which mean higher priced houses. Locals can also choose whether to sell property to those wanting to move to a particular area - thankfully we live in a country where we are all allowed to pick and choose.

I agree with your second paragraph, this is probably the major issue which tends to annoy the locals.

I don't own a second home and have never owned a second home.

However, it seems likely that the councils/government have/are introducing measures to make holiday home ownership much more difficult/expensive. With second home owners being vilified in the media/by the council/government, you will definitely find that this emboldens random people to express negativity to you in real life.

Well yes they are allowed to move where they like.
They are also allowed to buy second homes.
It doesn't mean that it doesn't create a serious issue.

Rich retirees drive the prices up. Do you seriously expect locals selling their homes to sell below market value? They already probably work in a low wage tourist service job.
Does any other house seller do that?
Would you?
And I am talking half the market value. Where I live, the property is going around double the surrounding area.

We are a rural remote area, with a huge population of retirees. More than half the population.We do not have medical or care facilities to service them. We do not have staff to work in the hospitals or care services, because there is no affordable housing for them and most rentals are holiday let's. Long term rentals are not affordable and very rare.

Our school roles are falling because young families have nowhere to live.
Probably just as well the numbers are down because our schools cannot recruit teachers because they have nowhere to live either. ( We are not an area you can easily commute to).

It's a very serious issue which will lead to depopulation of these areas. And they won't be so attractive to move into with no locals to work in the amenities and local services. But by then the community will have been destroyed.

One of our neighbours is a second home owner and they stay, roughly I would say one week a month on average. They are not treated any differently to anyone else, we chat and help each other out. It is a village in Dorset - but there are a lot of 'non locals' here. It is very friendly village to everyone really, those who have family who have lived here for generations to those who have second homes and live in London. I find Dorset to be generally very friendly though.

Sounds exactly where I am. My home is 'worth' far far more than it actually is, were we to sell it would have to be around a 3rd of the market value for it to be affordable to an ordinary working family on local wages.

And the idea that increases in council tax will put off cash buyers of half million pound houses is just laughable @Whenim63 . Pretty sure most ppl just don't understand the level of wealth we are talking about here.

@Caerulea I never said that increases in council tax would put people off? I said ours was doubling but we are staying. I simply pointed out that many people in the "wooden chalets" suggested pay no council tax at all.

We have an apartment in Spain where traditionally there haven't been many Brits (although there are more now than when we bought it)
I speak reasonable Spanish and always use local non English speaking services etc and I find I generally get better treatment than people who don't
I suppose its about integrating and treating people with respect, which is universal

High council taxes won’t put off the people who own the properties anyway.

We have a friend who has a farm in a hamlet just outside a very popular north yorks market town. The house opposite is a second home, it is probably worth a few million. Over the last few years it’s just the older children who use it with their school chums for a few weeks.
They clearly have the money to spare and don’t care. It’s not a home a local will buy but our friend hates that her view is an empty house. She also says over the last 50 years their town has become very popular and all the shops are there to cater for tourists, not residents. So yes it appears booming but not useable for locals.

But like someone mentioned, high numbers of retired incomers can cause issues too, but there is no way to police that.

@Cosycardiganandteaandtoast my grandmother-in law owned numerous properties in north wales. Cannot believe how much she gloated once about winning a cottage at auction in Llangollen.
Her grandson said when she won locals jeered in anger but gm was oblivious.

That was her holiday home but she purchased many others to rent out as holiday lets. She had a large portfolio. Awful! She's passed now but her daughters now own the properties

"But by then the community will have been destroyed" - I am from and live in a popular tourist area, we have a strong sense of community and that is made up of locals and non-locals. The non-locals, whether they have moved here to retire, to work or have a second home, are part of the community if they make an effort not to come in all guns blazing telling locals what they should and should not do. Looking at the non-local who has moved here, joined the parish council and says only vegan food should be served at the meetings - the majority of the rest of the council being hill farmers.

We welcome a new teacher who because they sold a house in a part of the country which is far more expensive than here, purchased a chocolate box cottage in a very desirable village and her job means the local school can continue to be open following the retirement of the 2 other part-time teachers.

We welcome the second home owner, who has offered to help the parish council (for free) in a project which requires a surveyor to be on board.

If we had not welcomed or alienated those non-locals the local community would be worse off.

It is not a black and white situation, you cannot stop people buying houses or selling them at a price both parties agree to.

We have s106 housing which does not sell, why? The younger locals do not wish to work in farming or tourism, so they move to areas close by to work in their chosen professions.

@schloss

There's a big difference between ppl moving to an area, living there full time etc & ppl buying up property only for it to be left empty most of the year. I don't believe I've seen anyone (here or IRL) moaning about ppl moving & living here - that's needed as the older population die off or move into sheltered living & homes (3 houses on my small street currently for sale due to exactly those reasons).

This is specifically about homes sitting empty when the local population & their children need places to live.

It isn't though - the person who buys a second home may eventually decide to live there as their main home. The surveyor who is currently helping with a local project at no cost owns a second home which does sit there empty for parts of the year.

There are homes here which locals would not buy no matter how much they cost - well if they can afford them they will rent them out to tourists. Very remote, run down properties need the people with money and will to renovate them.

I would rather have a second home owner look after their property, contribute to the local community and businesses when they are here, than someone who books a holiday cottage, brings all their food with them, never supports local events, then goes back home.

Some locals do not help themselves, some second home owners do not either but that does not mean everyone is the same.

The teacher who is now working in one of the local schools, came here on holiday with their family many times, when waiting for the purchase of their new home here to exchange and complete, a second home owner allowed the teacher to live there to enable them to be at the school for the start of the new school year.

You make some valid points about retirees. In fact they're more of a problem than tourism.

They pop up on FB asking where's the NHS dentist, where's the best GP surgery, how long is the waiting list for hip/knee surgeries.

They creep onto committees, volunteer for charities, then set about trying to reorganize it all.

They're impatient, pushy, rude, write letters of objection to the council, especially if there are any plans to improve leisure activities for children.

It tends to be city/urban dwellers who retire here who are the rudest, especially in shops.

I used to live in a small block of flats where some were holiday lets or second homes. An elderly lady who lived there and had early stage dementia used to say how unsafe it made her feel - empty flats and different people she didn't know coming in and out past her door.

I live in west Cornwall and second home owners are universally hated here. Typically they can’t cope with the narrow lanes, complain about things that are standard in the countryside and assume everyone who lives here depends upon the tourist industry (when only 14% of our economy is generated by tourism). We all know which houses are second homes as it’s a very rural area.

@justasking111 and @Smallsalt wow. I could have written this.

We have had the most ridiculous blow up, last year, over our community council, Scotland, and new members, seeking to turn it into a parish council. England.

It caused the most serious upset and damage the community has seen. I don't say that lightly. I'm actually reluctant to talk about how vicious and nasty it got.

Anyway. It's done. But when you see old ladies who were born here and who would give you their last pound crying it's not fun.

And actually people like that do such much harm for the lovely people who come and do want to fit in and help. Change is wonderful and absolutely needs to happen but in a positive, often sensitive way.

Totally agree with this. I live in an area awash with second homes, they are absolutely destroying our communities locally. Some villages have almost no residents any more.
Most owners tell themselves that their single second home is just one home, for them, and therefore doesn’t make much difference…. Or they know how damaging they are but don’t care. Either way , yes it is a totally selfish thing to do. If you like an area and a community why would you want to destroy it ?

Exactly this. Where I live it’s very hard to feel warmth towards second home owners when people born here can’t buy a house.

Same here.