To hope that Donald Trump doesn’t win the election

[RosaMoline]

….it’s getting closer.
I was hoping that Kamala would be a shoo-in for the presidency, but looking at the betting odds, I’m feeling quite pessimistic.
It’s incomprehensible to me that a convicted felon, racist, rapist, liar and misogynist who spurred on an insurrection - after everything that’s happened - is running for office again and may very well win.
It’s comforting to read though that fellow Brits DON’T support him.
Apart from Reform. Obviously.
yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/50752-who-did-britons-want-to-win-the-2024-us-presidential-election

No - but the election of Donald Trump will empower Putin, and the far right across Europe, and that worries me immensely.

Yes, agreed, where democratic principles apply, but which continue to need to be defended, and sometimes by the Supreme Court.

Everyone thinks he means someone else.

He wants to deport all 11 million undocumented aliens plus some with legal status.

The US has a system of checks and balances and SCOTUS is an integral part of a system that has maintained the US democracy and it's democratic underpinnings for over 200 years.

Some people would throw that away in favour of a short term win on a hugely divisive issue, with no guarantee that women's rights are defended in the long term.

The US has a system of checks and balances and SCOTUS is an integral part of a system that has maintained the US democracy and it's democratic underpinnings for over 200 years

The US does not have a divine right to democracy. The history will count for nothing with a stacked Supreme Court and Trump determined to bend everything to his will.

For the first time, the US will have a president who only wants to serve himself and a GOP that is in thrall. The checks and balances are not going to be enough.

Lol, an unelected court dominated by Christian conservatives - in an overtly secular constitution - overturning a legal precedent supported by 62% of Americans.

You can cut it anyway you want.

You're trying to frame the move to restrict access to reproductive care as a lofty expression of the American democratic ideal. But it's disingenous bs and the fact that you're pontificating like this about an issue that's integral to women's safety and freedom is actually making you sound like a sociopath. Really, give over.

They'll have to build deportation camps and move hundreds of thousands into them.

It won't just be people who've recently arrived. The people Trump describes as 'garbage', 'poisoning the blood' of the USA'. Nope, it'll also be people who are easy to locate - like the half a million living in the US under DACA, many who've been living in the states since infancy or early childhood. Who have American children and spouses. :-(

Hint at a conspiracy?

Respectfully, anyone who doesn't believe there's corruption in govt, is beyond help.

This! It's just used as a stick to beat people with.

The fact is, millions of Americans do support him. And if we work on the basis that most people don't want to live a shit life, then they, in their mind, obviously have good reasons for voting for him.

That's how conspiracy theories work.

Take something with a grain of truth - ie, that there are corrupt politicians, and spin that into an enormous conspiracy that the government is intending to fix the election.

Yawn

But, see, it 'means something' to them.

How bizarre to think you can ask a question but only 'accept' a certain answer. Bit arrogant, no?

They have given you an answer, which is valid to THEM. Whether you agree with it or not is neither here nor there.

Some of the worst people in history have been adored by millions, in exactly the way Trump is idolised by his followers

Hitler

Mussolini

Berlusconi

Putin

And of course, most people don't want to live a shit life. But Trump supporters are fine with voting in a government that intends to ensure that other people will live fucking awful lives, if they think it'll get them lower taxes and put an end to socially progressive policies for women and minorities.

Agree @thepariscrimefiles Joe Biden has achieved more in one term than Obama did in two. His post Covid infrastructure Bill alone would secure his legacy. Twice as large as that passed by the EU. Admittedly his Middle East policy is useless. But how would that improve with the guy who banned Muslims from the US and moved the USA embassy to Jerusalem?

But if dementia Don wins it might have an upside. Europe will be forced to get its own Middle East and Russia policy sorted. And that will require closer integration. Britain can help. Or drift into irrelevance as a Trumpian strap.

Women's rights to abortion need to be defended in the political context in which we find them, and out of which they have come. Roe v Wade was never a solid foundation and proved to be a pyrrhic victory. We need to continue to build women's rights and access to legal and safe abortions on solid democratic foundations, which is to say, from the bottom up, not from the top down.

Well I think the administration has been pretty excellent overall and I don't think Harris has anything to apologies for. The Infrastructure Bill kicks ass and the Green New Deal is impressive. I don't love their Middle East policy, but for all that, I have literally yet to hear any politician in any country articulate a good solution to that, and Trump's would be worse. So your loaded question doesn't have an answer.

Vice Presidents sometimes advise presidents, i.e. Biden convinced Obama to come out in favour of gay marriage, but that's not their role. Overall, they're there to take over if the president is incapacitated or killed, support them and take on the tasks that the president tells them to.

But you're the one floating the 'powers that be won't let Trump win' absolute pile of steaming bullshit further down the thread, so have at it.

I hope he doesn't win.

But as my brother just said to me:

We all thought that he wouldn't win last time. And he did.

I live in the UK and really hope he doesn't win. It would be a disaster for the whole world.

And yet the question I have posed multiple times has not been answered.

Why didn’t the Democrats pass federal abortion rights laws on the many years they held the power and could have?

As also pointed out… similar was done for the equal opportunity laws… why not abortion?

4 short year ago with multiple challenges to Roe V. Wade in the works the democrats held both houses and the White House.

Why because the US won’t fund the rest of the world?

His isolationist policies and threat to pull out of NATO plus his aggressive international stance and ignorance as far as climate change and environmental issues are concerned.

I believe I've recommended this book to you before? If you're really interested in understanding, it's a good place to start. Blaming the Democrats for the fall of Roe involves some really impressive mental gymnastics.

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/06/13/books/review/the-fall-of-roe-elizabeth-dias-lisa-lerer.html

I have never blamed Democrats for the fall of R v. W. I’ve questioned why they didn’t do anything in the past 50 years to mitigate it.

It hadn't fallen 50 years ago 🤣

it was ruled on 50 years ago and was overturned 2 years ago. So more or less 50 years in between to pass a federal law that would hold up to Supreme Court challenge.

You’re not exactly keeping up with the discussion , are you?

You should worry more about the lot you got in government in the U.K.