To be angry that people don't grasp you can't stop adults ending their life

[Differentstarts]

I'm getting really annoyed about people's perceptions around mental health and suicide. And the news recently has highlighted it. All the people saying why didn't anyone stop it. Firstly you don't know what people's family and friends did. Secondly how do you suppose you can stop a grown adult making a choice.
My best friend ended her life I spent hours and hours over a period of months trying to convince her not to do this. I checked on her multiple times a day (think stalker level) after yet another overdose I begged the hospital to section her and they wouldn't. I took her to Dr appointments, to see her councillor and when she died I still got people asking me why I did nothing to stop it. So can someone please tell me how I was supposed to stop it as this is really pissing me off.
Yanbu You can't stop a grown adult doing what they want to do and only they can control that.
Yabu you should of done more (please tell me what?)

OP, I'm really sorry that you've been through this and have lost your dear friend. It sounds like you did your very best to help her in awful circumstances.

My experience is that a lot of people don't cope well when people are seriously ill or die, which sometimes leads to them lashing out at others. I'm sure it has been awful to experience and I can only recommend for you own sake to step back from these people and seek the support you need whilst you grieve.

So you blame his parents for allowing him to join the industry and die 17 years later or you realise at 16 he made that choice and then made another choice again at 31 as a grown man

No one has confirmed it was suicide. I think it was an accident.

I'm not specifically talking about liam Payne I'm talking about people's perceptions around suicide and how everyone jumps to the why did nobody stop it

@Differentstarts yes that's a terrible thing to go through, was it a family member? Who was blaming you?

You sound really angry OP. I suggest you look into some counselling for yourself with someone who specialises in grief.

I agree that if someone is determined to die by suicide they will.

I thought that was an accidental fall?

People need someone to blame for something that is too complicated to fully understand unless you’ve been there yourself. They blame you because you’re there and the person that they knew is gone. It’s hard to blame a dead person, very easy to blame the still living.

It hasn't been determined yet, maybe we will never know.

No, I think it's much more complex than that and the things he experienced when much too young to deal with them and later, will have brought him to where he ended up and the decisions he made in his last hours. Not just his parents, no.

I don't think he was born as someone who was always going to end their life and neither was your friend. It's absolutely tragic and you're completely right, no one was going to change it when it got to that point, but there will have been people and experiences that harmed her to bring her to that place.

I think what some people don't realise is that help just isn't there. The amount of times I've read on here "go get therapy" XYZ etc. What's available via your GP on the NHS is palpable, and private is inaccessible to many for financial reasons. My neighbour's young adult daughter has actively tried to kill herself so many times and the hospital still won't section her, and because she is an adult there are limited resources for alternative appropriate treatment. It's awful to witness her turmoil and can't imagine what her mum is going through.

Also another sad reality is that "reaching out to your friends and family if you feel depressed or suicidal" is often met with people distancing themselves, ridiculing or downplaying your feelings or just paying lip service. The stigma of being mentally unwell is still very much present.

You can't stop people from killing themselves and anyone who suggests that more could have been done, I would ask them WHAT? WHEN? BY WHOM?

Friends, coroner, family, The problem was not everyone knew she was suicidal and attempted multiple times as I stupidly kept her privacy so when it happened and it came up I knew how suicidal she was people was like and you didn't think to do anything about it. Then all the mental health professionals suddenly started acting oblivious and said they had no indication she was in imminent danger even though she had attempted 5 times in 3 months so it left me looking like the bad one as I was the only person who told the truth at the inquest.

I'm so sorry for your loss. My brother died of an intentional drug overdose many years ago. My parents had moved heaven and earth for many years to try to save him, to no avail. Sometimes all the help in the world isn't enough, and for people to insinuate otherwise is unnecessary and cruel.

Do we know that he decided to end his own life? As opposed to being under the influence of drugs and alcohol and fell off, or perhaps so out of it he decided he d try to get into the pool (that he d apparently been prevented from accessing downstairs because of being under the influence). People unfortunately fall off balconies while on holidays on a fairly regular basis sadly, the third floor (though I think the courtyard may have been lower than ground level) would be an unusual choice for killing yourself I think, there's always a chance you survive from that height albeit with life changing injuries.
I agree with you OP, my mam made a couple of attempts though they were more a cry for help than serious attempt to die. If she wanted to die there's nothing we could have done to stop her, and awful as it would have been for us, who was I to ask her to continue living in the torment she was existing in. Thankfully it was a temporary state and she came out the other side of it, but she ll say herself she lost a decade of her life between the gradual slide into the really horrific stage, that stage and then the medicated numbness than ended the attempts to die but she wasn't really living either.

I think people forget there are different types of suicidal people. It's so uncomfortable to talk about so people don't. There are those like your friend who was determined to end life and made a decision. Then there are those who have a sudden crisis and do really impulsive rash things, often younger people, and the chances of intervention at the exact right moment is low. Then there are those whose MH slowly spirals downward over months, these are the ones most likely to be saved with intervention. I should add this is based entirely on my own analysis and I have luckily never lost anyone to suicide.

I hope you can get some support to make peace with your experience OP. I am sure you did all you could. Mental health interventions and anti-suicide initiatives can have an impact though, even if we will never prevent 100% of suicides.

It's a complex issue and depends on context. There was a playwright called Sarah Kane. She suffered from psychosis and other mental health issues and took herself to A&E because she was experiencing an episode.

While in the hospital, she hanged herself. The fact that she was on suicide watch wasn't in her notes and she wasn't checked on.

She obviously wanted to live as she took herself to hospital but she was let down. The mental health service has been run down to nothing and people are needlessly suffering.

If we had earlier intervention and more support, many people would be able to be helped.

YANBU. You can't stop people if they're set on it. It would be like trying to stop an alcoholic from drinking - one who won't accept help. Also, please look after your own mental and physical health. This would have taken a toll on you. Your friend may have ended their life, but you're still alive to live your best life.

Yes, this is often true. I worked in mental health for over 10 years and have my own lived experience of saving a relative's life after an overdose and have had my own exhausting and draining battles with depression which I won't burden you with. I have been bereaved by suicide twice and while I do not pretend to know what you are going though, I understand how shocking it is. i am so deeply sorry for your loss of your friend and as others have already said, there was nothing else you could have done. You were there for her and a positive and caring presence in her life, to listen, to care and not to judge is all we can do . I was trained in suicide prevention, something we rightly had to repeat every few years and of course the trust I worked for had a target of zero suicides which is laudable but we cannot prevent every one. I also agree that there is very little support for people who have made an attempt on their life, they just get patched up and sent on their way. This country needs to invest in mental health support and also have useful and timely support for family and friends who support loved ones.

This it simply isn’t a straightforward answer to this because everyone is different, everybody situation is different and in some cases there is and in some there just simply isn’t.

But ultimately it doesn’t matter because it is a choice a choice of the person who made it and other people are not anyone else’s responsibility

See In my personal experience I don't agree. You ring the crisis team, you get told you have capacity so it's your choice if you want to end your life. You attempt end up in a&e you have a 10 minute chat with mhls and of you go on your merry way with maybe a promise of a follow up call that never happens. You text shout and they message you back 7 hrs later because they don't have enough staff. You ring samaritans you can be on hold for hours. Your gp can throw pills at you but that's as far as that goes. Months/years wait for talking therapies

Really, that sounds awful that they all blamed you. It must be so hard to deal with. But those people..ah!! They were not correct! You have to deal with this now and know you did the right thing. There was nothing else you could do.

OP, you are absolutely right. Suicide was decriminalised over 60 years ago. We all have the right to end our own lives at a time of our own choosing - but it's also a responsibility that begins and ends with that individual. Nobody else is responsible and it is nobody's job to "stop them".

Suicide is a complex issue, for everyone, and those who make fatuous remarks about it clearly have little understanding of the issues.

I am so sorry about your friend - they were clearly lucky to have you, but the choice that they made was theirs alone.

The outcome would have been the same. People just love blaming others. Sorry for your loss. 🌸

Agree. You often see comments like “someone should have helped them”. It’s such a fucking naive and frankly lazy view. If it was that simple nobody would ever die by suicide or as a result of addiction.