Time for a new PM and Chancellor?

[Whenwillitgetwarm]

I wrote this on another thread but feel it should have its own thread.

Although I voted Labour (the current Tory’s are too insane), I think it may be time to swap out Starmer and Reeves. If this is done early, there’s enough parliament time left to bed a new PM and Chancellor in.

They both lack ideas, seem confused, no vision etc. They had 14 years to think up workable plans. Coming in and throwing their hands up saying there’s no money so they can’t do anything is very poor. They want to continue austerity on the sly. They indulge in stupid culture wars like VAT to rob Peter to pay Paul (and Paul won’t see a penny anyway). They have bad advisors and are arrogant. It looks like they are just excited to have the job titles and don’t know what to do.

Get a top two who will come up with a bold plan. We’re in the gutter so there’s opportunities to deliver quick wins. They don’t always need funding, simple policy changes can make big and quick differences. If they gave each department a target to deliver one quick legislative win by Christmas, we’d start 2025 differently.

Unfortunately we’re stuck with two people who can’t believe their luck, and who are afraid of the Daily Mail, Murdoch, some loud Redwall types and bots on X who wish our country economic harm. They are weak.

If Labour were a football team, there would be fans screaming for Starmer to be sacked now.

This is not about getting rid of Labour. I believe there is talent in the wider party, much more than in the Conservatives who hollowed out their party under Johnson. Nevertheless I just don’t think Starmer and Reeves should have their roles.

Sigh

I mean why? You can talk to each other you know you don’t have to quote my post if you find this topic of discussion dull

I was fine with having a discussion with one pp and every one of you will join in and then complain, it’s odd

i take it you can avoid if you want?

@EasternStandard why thank you 😂

For what?

I gave you very friendly advice, not to talk about religion the way you have. You had that removed, but the fact is if you were to say to someone of that religion similar to what you said to me, you would be in deep trouble.

Have you actually had any personal involvement with Islamic extremism? I have, and not very pleasant, either.

That is not what I said at all. It was a warning not to disrespect the faith of anyone. It can have dire consequences.

There is no blasphemy in the Christian faith, but there is in Islam. They have killed people they consider have blasphemed their belief. Remember the Churches they burned down? If a rumour goes out that someone has burned a page of the Quran, those people have been killed without even ascertaining if it was fact or not.

I was not the one who reported you.

Your post implied that you couldn't challenge any Muslim on their religion without getting killed. That post was rightly removed - it was horrific. I know many Muslims - when you work in the organisation where I work, it does tend to be quite multicultural. We have robust discussions about faith.

I am sorry you have experienced extremism, but your deleted post implied that all Muslims are extremists and likely to turn violent and therefore it was not allowed to stand.

And I did not perceive it as friendly - I perceived it as deeply Islamophobic.

You don't know who reported your appalling comment so I wouldn't start the accusation of "you had that removed" if I were you.

It was me you gave the "advice," to, not pointythings

It was not friendly, it was hate speech. Which is why I reported it and why MN removed it.

Time will tell. Labour are trying to go too far with employees rights and as The Independent says, ‘will be the death knell of small businesses’.

In what way are they "trying to go too far with workers' rights"?

Er... Northern Ireland still has blasphemy laws on the statute books. There are other countries - not just Muslim ones - that have them. And in many European countries, blasphemy laws were not abolished until the 21st century.

How many Churches have been burned down in the UK by Muslims?

I don't visit the Middle East - I don't want them to have my tourist money because they tend to have deeply repressive laws where it concerns women. However, I would also not ever visit those states in the US which have abortion bans, nor would I visit the likes of El Salvador, Nicaragua and other Catholic countries where women are still oppressed.

But I have had those debates with people of all faiths, face to face, here in the UK, and I'm not dead yet. Not everyone is an extremist.

If you can't provide your staff with basic rights, your business is not viable.

Do you know what's been the biggest death knell of small businesses over the last few years?

Brexit.

@llizzie posts like yours aren't removed because they are reported - they will only be taken down if they break Mumsnet's T&C which you probably need to review

I do not have a low opinion of Muslims. I do, however, have a very low opinion of Islamic extremists. If you cannot see the difference, I am sorry for you.

I feel very sorry for the women of Afghanistan and Iran. I feel very sorry for the women and children in Gaza who are being used as shields by the Hamas terrorist fighters, and in Lebanon by the Hezbollah terrorists too. If you do not believe this, I am sorry for you, because unless you do, you will not be able to recognise terrorism when you meet it.

These Islamic terrorists have their own interpretation of the Quran. Muslims whose faith has been in their DNA for centuries are being ruled by an Islam they neither understand or want. Their lives are controlled in a way that their ancestors' lives were not. When you consider that the Taliban hold public executions in open air arenas, and kill for the slightest thing, and whip women in the streets if an inch of skin shows, and are denied education, you must surely see that they do not have the same religion as we have in the west.

Extremists exist in all religions.

I'm fully aware of the difference between people of faith and extremists.
Your post got deleted, as mentioned above, because it broke MN rules. Perhaps you would do wisely to think about that.

Small businesses, with their lower profit margins and smaller scale, will find it challenging to comply with the additional red tape and everyone will pay the price. New rights to paternity, parental and bereavement leave from day one will impose significant costs on businesses that will have to be passed along somehow.
The access to unfair dismissal protection from day one could have dire consequences. With this change, many businesses could choose not to hire new staff, fearing the potential for employment tribunals and all the expense if things do not work out. It all places a much bigger burden on small businesses which are already struggling.

I do not have a low opinion of Muslims. I do, however, have a very low opinion of Islamic extremists. If you cannot see the difference, I am sorry for you

Your deleted post vilified Muslims, not Islamic extremists (you did not mention the latter). You are backpeddling madly.

It remains to be seen how it will unfold but Labour’s messaging so far has meant

Consumer Confidence Index fell sharply to -20 in September. All measures were down in comparison to last month's announcement.

Whether it’ll turn around we’ll see

Labour have made a poor start with taking WFA from pensioners, taking £100k worth of freebies that are not really work related, Starmer been caught out in a lie as his sons GCSE's were over months before he moved out of the penthouse. Lammy gifting overseas territory away without even a debate in parliament, Sue Grey debacle too, all in first 100 days. We will see what RR does on Halloween.

Fair enough, but what about a single pensioner who only has state pension of £11,500 to live on and can't get PC as about £50 pa above the limit for claiming? It's not all about you.

I’m also a part owner of a small business. Have never actually taken a single penny out of it. It contributes to our local community and employs about 10 people along with being part of other supply chains.

We barely break even. Some months we don’t. Any additional costs will kill us. We cannot function without some zero hour contracts.

My impression is that Labour views ‘business’ as if we are all Amazon’s earning billions whilst exploiting workers rather than understanding the UK’s economy is based on hundreds of thousands of SMEs just getting by. I wish there was nuance in Labour’s messaging and approach.

If they can't accommodate basic rights they aren't viable. If they are struggling to be decent employers that's their problem.

You know the 100k was since 2019, not since the election? (And entirely within the rules, and less than many tories).

I agree the WFA decision is unwise. But I have to ask, were you complaining about all the freebies that MPs from all parties were receiving before 4th July 2024?

Eta the Tory party leadership result will also be announced on Halloween 🎃 It will be an interesting day all round!