Aibu to think confident children are from very middle class backgrounds?

[Potnoodleslover]

In my childrens school the children who get chosen foe everything are very confident & are from very middle class backgrounds (state school).

I can see why these kids are picked, they do a wonderful job but what makes them so much more confident then mine? They are attending the same school so therefore getting the same education..

This is a discussion board, I am perfectly entitled to ask a question on whatever topic I choose!

Why are the Brits so obsessed with class ?

I'd like to read the thread about the strict woman and husband in blazer. Just for research you understand.

Back to confidence. I found amongst my kids' class/schools etc., the most confident kids were the ones told that they never had to answer for anything, and neither did their parents. The DCs were only shouted at/punished if they inconvenienced their parents. At school events etc they always expected to come first and would kick up merry hell if they weren't. It's that sort of "me first and always" attitude. That's my take on it.

Premier Inns are amazing for families, we love them!

Very interesting especially the sentence

had every decision in their lives made for them

🤣🤣 I’ll give you the link as soon as I finish the thread ..🤣

Those with parents in minimum wage roles said 'hairdresser' and 'nail person'. All the girls are similar level academically, but the 2nd set were not aspirational.

I'm sure many, maybe most?, posters on MN (and people offline) would be sorry if suddenly almost nobody wanted to be a hairdresser or other similar roles. People would soon regret deeming a creative aspiration as being of lesser value or deserving less respect, if nobody pursued those careers.

If your point is these jobs should be better paid, I agree, although definitely with hairstylists that can already be the case - and some of the top ones earn a lot more than minimum wage.

That said, perhaps I've experienced a more diverse bunch of children and adults than you.

I know several with parents whose jobs are considered middle class - but who want to or have already, pursued a stereotypical "working class" career. And their parents have been supportive.

Likewise I know people with working class parents - and those parents were very encouraging and supportive of their children pursuing a stereotypical "middle class" career.

The important thing is having supportive parents - who don't pressure their children.

I don't think it's class necessarily and there are different types of confidence. Maybe I'm talking about arrogance presented as confidence?

This notion - being middle class seems to confer the advantage of an attitude of 'I can acheive anything'

Whilst being supportive - and encouraging a child to pursue their interests and career aspirations is a positive thing, I've known families (both middle class, and working class), where the parents have put heavy pressure on their children - under the guise of "you can achieve anything".

I know a few adults who had parents like that - and it's ended badly. They ended up either underachieving due to pressure, or going into a career they didn't really want (because the one they did want was perceived by their parents as "not good enough").

And they're now very unhappy and have struggled in their lives - sometimes professionally, but especially in their personal lives.

YABU. My kids are middle class, in the sense that both parents have professional jobs, we have a nice home and the kids do extracurricular activities etc.

My kids are still reserved and shy when it comes to performing and wouldn't get picked.

I suspect being middle class helps though for those who are also outgoing.

I grew up on a council estate and am now quite well off.

One thing I noticed about people from council estates who are "confident" is that more often than not they are sort of acting out, hiding behind a big persona or are a certain type of anxious loud.

Children and adults I know from middle class backgrounds tends to be calm collected and more unflappable. Which is a different type of confidence, it's more self assured and sort internalised. It doesn't feel the need to dominate the conversation or make sure everybody else knows about it.

I’m a teacher. Totally disagree, having money or not having money seems to have no influence or who is confident or not in the classroom or outside, it’s how your parents bring you up from my experience

Yes, mine could do this as well. At 7, DS2 sat through quite formal dinners for a whole week on a Cunard cruise - admittedly playing top trumps quietly between courses. He ordered his food. I’ve brought mine up to know their manners and to speak clearly and politely. It must be a combination of personality and parenting - but as I could speak to anyone - and know when to be quiet - from a young age, and all my grandparents were working class - I don’t think class is the deciding factor.

I think it's down to the parents modelling confidence and encouraging children to engage with others.

It's basic things like conversations around the dinner table, getting them to order their own food at restaurants or to ask a shop assistant where something is, etc etc.

That’s great your kids are - and I’m not being snarky at all in saying that. But I don’t feel this reflects a general trend.

When interviewing for sought after junior posts it tends to be the private school educated people who are more confident and come across well and end up with the jobs. Obviously there are exceptions.
I’ve been thinking a lot about this recently as there is often talk and attempts to increase diversity. But from a class perspective it just isn’t happening.

I think it’s in part also because people from wealthier backgrounds are more likely to have a financial cushion to gain relevant (often unpaid or v low paid, positions) experience too.

I say this as someone who has a very working class background.

Op why do you think your DC seem less confident? Do you do extras with them at home? Do you talk about the importance of confident communication and model it yourself? I’m not saying you don’t, but in my experience that’s what confident DC are getting at home regardless of wealth/class

I know enough exceptions both ways - very working class kids who are very confident and middle class kids who aren't.

However generally I do see the same trend - and I think it's easier for middle class kids to be confident less worry about not fitting in ie not affording right stuff and clubs - and extra outside school experiences.

Though IL very working class can and do talk to anyone and for our kids and hell even me as an adult that's been a good example to have where as my parents were always worried about not being in right place/fitting in.

DD1 wanted to do school play kept auditioning and being rejected she was quiet more so in her younger years - so started with her class teacher - asking for reading/acting arts in class projects assemblies did it well kept getting chosen for longer parts and also started with school choir so got on stage. When we changed schools she went for school play again and got a main part. She didn't let the no stop her but found alternative ways.

DS messed up booking for uni open day - my parents would have treated it as a disaster - we helped him get in touch book what we could and then on day DH said we'll try and get into rest of talks - me I'd have worried about imposing - DH just went and sat and as not everyone turned up it was fine.

Being middle class can give you confidence. Middle class kids have the opportunity to have lots of hobbies and might well have found something they are talented at to make them feel good about themselves. They don't have to worry about wearing tatty clothes and getting teased for not being able to afford the things that make them fit in. They can have birthday parties and know that they are turning up to friend's birthday parties with a nicely wrapped present and card. They're not distracted in class by worrying about whether there will be food on the table tonight. Their parents are and socialise with other doctors, lawyers, CEOs, so they don't feel intimidated by anyone of perceived high status.

However, children from stable, happy, working class families can also be very confident- they just might not have all the advantages a middle class child has.

The biggest predictor in my experience of a confident, popular kid seems to be if they are sporty. I've never met a kid who was a high-achiever in a sport and wasn't confident.

My children are very confident, and do tend to get chosen for a lot of things. It’s a bit alien to me as I certainly wasn’t confident at school. We are middle class (I think, anyway, it’s a minefield) but I mainly put their confidence down to the Performing Arts classes they do. I guess you have to have a certain level of affluence to pay for classes like that, but it’s always said on here that money doesn’t relate to class so I don’t know 🤷🏻‍♀️.
They’re also both very academic and are competent in most things (sport, music etc) so I think that plays a large part in why they’re chosen for things.

Not in my school or my DCs. The confident children were without exception the best looking and coolest. Pretty girls in fashionable interpretations of the uniform and good looking mouthy bad boys. Being good at sport could be a plus, but getting picked for things by teachers was not. The children the staff chose for things tended to be the more nerdy kids who were often very lacking in confidence socially. These children were more typically MC, with the more confident 'in' crowd being WC. MC kids would put on fake regional accents to be more accepted.

It's not about education so going to the same school has nothing to do with it, it's not even really about money although that helps pay for extra activities. It's all to do with homelife.

Are education and arts valued at home? Do they get to go to museums, theatres and science festivals. Do they play board games or are they Infront of the TV or a console. Do they go to drama or another activity they know they are skilled at and have seen progression so have faith in their own abilities.

Number of siblings they have to share with, both time and resources, if there are many siblings then parental attention is stretched.

How they are communicated with, do they have proper conversations, are they shouted and sworn at, are parents calm or aggressive, ate they walking on eggshells worried to get things wrong, how stable is their overall home life, if they are spoken to about current affairs or things outside their immediate locality, if they are given opportunities to try different things and build up resilience. Is there opinion valued at home so they are happy to give it at school too.

My kids certainly aren’t the coolest and they’re not in the ‘in’ crowd (DD1 is an absolute geek!) but they’re pretty confident. DD1 knows she’s a geek and embraces it!

I wonder if its more about traits children may inherit from parents.

Eg. Middle class child. Both parents are successful lawyers. Factors in how they got to that position include academic ability/enthusiasm for education, resilience, ability to take risks appropriately, good communication skills.
They are likely to pass on some of these traits, both via genetics but also parenting/atmosphere in the home. Throw in plenty of money and that child can afford activities that help them feel "good at things" and confident.

• better nutrition can also lead to a healthier appearance which boosts your confidence.

More vulnerable child:
single parents overrepresented, more likely to have an absent/less involved father
No money for enriching, resilience building hobbies.
Parents may be in careers requiring less skills/education (or unemployed), may not have enjoyed school and may present negative views of education in the home
Poorer nutrition and health, overcrowding etc reduce attainment.

Speaking for myself, I was very middle class, but painfully shy and lacking self-confidence. I'm not sure why this is; sometimes I put it down to being the oldest child, so my parents might have been more anxious with me than with my younger sibling. Perhaps my parents did too much for me, and I often convinced myself that I "couldn't" do things. I hadn't learned to add "yet" to the end of that phrase. Some things I couldn't do as a teenager were swim, make a phone call, catch a ball, and take small teases. This was a big one for me: I simply couldn't tell the difference between bullying and light hearted teasing, so I tended to isolate myself from everybody else, and cling to adult company instead. I did crack most of those in my twenties, though. However, a weakness I have is that it takes me a lot of time to learn a new skill, probably more than average.

I was often chosen to read out loud at school, but always the last to be chosen for sport.

I agree.

Experiences - across the board. Stay in a 5* hotel, stay in a Travelodge, go camping, stay in a hostel
Navigate your way around London on the Tube.
Take them to concerts, let them do extra curricular activities.
Talk to them. Mainly talk to them. Let them watch the news, read The Week Junior, have the radio on.

They will be INTERESTED AND INTERESTING. Practice from a young age will make them more confident as they get older.

If you baby children and wrap them in cotton wool and say things like "Oooohhh they don't like the city" because YOU don't like the City, you aren't doing them any favours. If you don't teach them to use the kettle, they can't welcome someone comfortably into their home and offer them a cup of tea.

It's not about class or income. It's about parenting. 100%