AIBU to consider regular payments from DP (my kids dad) as child maintenance - even though we're still together?

[mummatoots]

DP and I are still together, but keep separate finances. (He is a financial mess.)

The house we live in is owned (and mortgaged) solely by me.

We have two young children together.

He pays me £500 per month - and with this I pay for everything related to housing, and also clothes, classes, haircuts, etc - anything else the kids need.

He tends to do supermarket shopping as well as this.

Would you class this as effectively child maintenance, albeit in an informal arrangement?

Or, in your view, can you only receive child maintenance if separated?

I ask because I'm looking at moving house, and if I do class this as informal child maintenance (easily evidenced with a few months payments on bank statements,) it is counted within affordability calculations, so helps my application. It's a real payment which I receive regularly from my kids dad towards their living costs, so I'm not making anything up and I think it should count - but I'm not sure if I'm correct in classing it as such, and suddenly have doubts re: mortgage fraud etc!

I've checked the CMS calculator, and if we were to separate and I were to have the kids full time, with his salary I'd be due £532 per month.

Interested in the mumsnet verdict.

It's all very well asking if you can use the money towards your mortgage..
But what happens if you split up and he can't pay as he needs the money for rent for himself
Or he gets in to more debt and hasn't got enough left to give u the same amount
In your shoes I would see that money from him as bonus not a given .
You don't want to end up in a mess because he doesn't pay you the money ,so you can't pay your bills

Thank you for this ♥️

I really appreciate it.

Feeling awful with some of the replies! I'm not trying to scam anyone, just do the best I can for my kids.

If I were to throw him out / whatever, I'd be no better off financially, with the added worry of him trying to house / feed / care for the kids on his time with limited resources. And I can't ask him to pay more because he doesn't have it.

@Viviennemary @ArrowOfAthena

I do agree he should be contributing equally and it should be household income / joint mortgage etc.

But he can't afford it, he's up to his eyeballs in debt. So there's no point in me asking for more as it doesn't exist. Which is why I'm trying to work things out based on my own salary, as effectively a single person financially.

@ClairDeLaLune That's what I was thinking to be honest.

My mortgage company at the moment don't know he's living here, as he moved in after I bought the house. I'd imagine most people who have their other half's move in don't necessarily alert their mortgage provider.

But yes, not sure how I'd tackle it if asked outright on a mortgage form, I don't want to lie. Have to say things have been rocky since finding out about his debt though so it's not exactly inconceivable!

@ClairDeLaLune it could be rent, but I think then I have to declare it to HMRC for tax purposes? Which is another can of worms with a potential big bill for me!

Based on your actual question, which has been getting lost in the weeds,

Yes - I would put it as CM

I would be wanting evidence that he's paying his debts,I wouldn't want debtors knocking at my door.So I feel you are entitled to ask for this.

If it was stated that informal child maintenance payments count, then go for it! Who cares what Mumenet posters say - if you know you won’t get into trouble then what’s the problem? Personally I’d do it in a heartbeat if I was told that informal payments could be added! And if I was told that they didn’t count, I’d just pretend to dump DP for a bit, and get the payments put through formally, I’m sure DP would be on board. And if not then I’d dump him for real 😂 but maybe i’m dishonest 😂😂

But he was up to his eyeballs in debt the first time around, and I assume that’s why you never asked anything of him. Then he had his money to himself, still got himself back into thousands of debt whilst also spending all his salary so now he is back to square one with no leftover money and again paying off debt so still isn’t contributing.

Why are you with him?

In my experience they ask directly. So you either lie, or don't lie.

Things sound really difficult and shit, but how much more stressful will it all become if you start lying on a mortgage application?

Talk to a broker, London and country are good and don't take money up front. There may be a legal way to achieve what you want to do

You have another issue, then, as he will have to sign a form declaring he has no interest in the property and will leave on completion so that whoever buys the house has vacant possession. You effectively have a tenant, rather than a partner, and he could refuse to leave the property when you sell, hence the need to get the declarations signed. Your mortgage company would certainly be interested in the fact that he lives there.

Maybe your relationship does actually need a break. He could move in with family for a set time, say 6 months? You make a CMS claim and take some time from him after his deceit and financial behaviour.

Then you don’t need to lie or skirt the edges of committing fraud, and you can get some time to think about his behaviour.

If this is the case I'd look more at how much you can afford to pay back on a bigger mortgage comfortably out of your own earnings, without including the £500.

If you do split and he becomes funny about paying CM until a court order for it is in place would you struggle to find the extra in repayments?

The mortgage lender will want to know about other adults in the house (including children) in case you default on the mortgage and they need to sell the house to recoup the money.
They'll also need to know where your income comes from, and would be unlikely to take DH's £500 into account as it's not guaranteed in the way that a salary is.
They will look at your bank account and will know it's not "maintenance".

@Ivehearditbothways I didn't ask anything of him first time because we weren't together. I asked him to move in to a house I already owned as a single person.

We've always kept separate finances, and he's intimated he's had credit issues pre-dating our relationship but I've never really pressed him. We'd always planned to move around now, and he said these issues would be long gone from his credit file and we could look to pool everything.

He's now confessed the full extent of his historic issues, and also that he's run up the same again. I have been floored about it.

But I have two very young children to think of.

Sadly a private arrangement can't be counted as income.

@mummatoots Has your OH used your current address for any of the debts he has wracked up?

I would strongly advise you to do a free credit check on yourself and see what comes up.

But that means you moved him in, he told you about his debts and so you didn’t ask for financial contributions. Then had kids with him and only asked for a pittance because he was meant to clear his debts. He did through an IVA, still didn’t contribute more to the household after that and just spent all his money and ran up more debt. So he still isn’t contributing. And you’ve stayed with him.

This will literally be your life. He won’t stop. Your focus on this £500 on the mortgage application is just to keep your mind off what’s actually going on and getting this guy out of your life.

CMS isn’t court mandated though, yet it’s still income.

He is registered at my address, but we have no joint accounts or financial associations.

My credit rating is fine.

He's now confessed the full extent of his historic issues, and also that he's run up the same again.

I was about to say that yes you should write it in as CM, but his ongoing accumulation of debts makes your whole application seem dishonest. He's your partner and has been overspending while he's living with you. What is he spending the money on? Cars/holidays for the family or gambling?

are you using a broker OP? Just ask them.

Honestly, I'm still trying to work it out. We've a lot to work out in our relationship aside from this, as is probably pretty clear.

I think it's been lots of ongoing consolidation of smaller things and then living beyond means month to month? He says furlough was a huge issue for him. I assume he's had a small disposable income through his IVA and it's not been enough, so he's gradually resorted back to credit.

He does have an older DC for whom he buys new phones, designer gear etc - I think he is a bit OTT for christmases / birthdays for him, but also it's his child so I can understand if he's being asked for things that's what he'd get - I'm sure I'll be the same with mine.

He hardly buys new clothes / things for himself at all.

We haven't been on holiday since 2018. He does have a car but it's an old Vauxhall, it's not like he's zooming about in a Range Rover or anything.

For what it's worth we did live separately for about a year and a half within the last three years - although maintained a relationship and he did continue to send the £500. That's a long story though and I don't want to derail the thread any more than it's already been derailed!

You don't seem to have any kind of curiosity about what on earth he's spending all this money on. He has £2k/month after paying you the paltry £500. He doesn't have rent or bills to pay. And yes he's still managed to get "up to his eyeballs" in debt. Something is not adding up, OP. There's something he hasn't told you. Does he have a gambling problem? I think that's the most likely. It could be drugs but as you live with him I think you'd see the signs.

I don't think it's derailing the thread. You want to pretend he doesn't live with you for the application so people are considering if that's fair and if your finances are actually separate.