To Think This is Too Low a Sentance - 12 year olds knife killing

[LuckysDadsHat]

https://news.sky.com/story/two-boys-believed-to-be-uks-youngest-knife-murderers-detained-for-minimum-of-eight-years-and-six-months-13221221

8.5 years minimum is nothing when these children are still only 13. They could be out at the same age of the man they killed. Why are sentences getting so lenient? I know some will say they are just children, but they are not so naive to not know what they were doing, and after the murder one of them was on social media saying "I don't really care" about the murder. It's just horrific and we need to have higher mandatory sentencing for all knife crimes including just carrying a knife.

Actually in a way that shows the system is working - once you’ve served your minimum tariff you’re not off scot free - if you commit a crime (any crime) or breach your parole conditions, you’re immediately back in prison. That’s how the life sentence works - the threat of going back for the rest of your life if you don’t behave. Obviously ideally they’d not reoffend or breach their conditions, but the fact that when they do they’re recalled to prison shows that the life sentence is working.

So we don't believe in what war child try to do, as in rehabilitate child soldiers? They've raped and murdered, included in their victims are other children, yet we accept them if they claim asylum. We accepted former Isis fighters. We don't imprison people like Huw Edwards. We release adult offenders. Apparently these boys had already made good progress while in custody, which guided the sentence.

Good Lord they are 13!!!! And you want to put them away for life? 8 years is a huge sentence for a 13 yr old 🙁

They. Are . 13. Children.

What are the 'high re-offending rates' for this age then? You seem to know...

You're aggressive. Have I offended you?

I'm not a reformed violent murderer... but I'm extremely different to when I was 12. I did not have a good childhood.
I understand how it can effect you. I did many things im not proud of in my teens. I also understand that as your brain develops and you have more of a frame of reference you could potentially really change yourself.
I think children are where we have to really give this chance. What type of society are we if we don't?
Justice shouldn't be based on vengeance. It should be based on what is the most positive outcome for society.
These kids were let down and in turn have caused horror. This is just really tragic.

If the best thing new prisons bring is construction jobs with public protection some way down the list of benefits it clearly doesn't work.

What if prison doesn't result in the least inconvenience to society? What if all it does is sate the desire some immediate retribution? What if the long term effect of more severe sentences costs the tax payer more and increases reoffending?

Well, at least I’d know who they were and what they’d done, unlike the majority of paedophiles and violent men who beat up their wives behind closed doors.

What makes a crime "adult"?

Seriously? Long sentences don't work so the answer must be more long sentences,,? When you're in a hole stop digging.

@Dweetfidilove
Well you posted with such confidence I'd love to see the stats on this...

Do you know the reoffending rates?

And still none of the “treat children like adults” mob have conceded that 12 year olds should be able to drive. Or that having sex with a 12 year old is ok. Why not?

It's on this basis, which is fair enough. "Children should receive lower sentences than adults, they should be considered less culpable than adults because they act impulsively and lack maturity so they are unlikely to understand the impact of their offending."
This makes sense AS LONG As they receive appropriate rehabilitation, they will be very different people, hopefully, at 20 when they were at 12. I do believe "show me the boy and I'll show you the man", but I hope I'm wrong.

Perhaps because we clearly share more in common culturally with the USA than Japan & Singapore and the small difference in murder rates between us and Japan or Singapore can't be attributed to harsher sentences.

How do you know that there isn't a link between low crime and harsh sentences? We used to have much harsher sentences in this country up until the 1960s and crime was far lower and anecdotally my mum used to say how she would walk home late at night in London in the fifties and feel perfectly safe. To me it is just common sense that if someone is in prison they can't commit further crimes and will also put off miscreants. It should be a feminist issue to want harsh sentences for violent men.

And the fact that these boys are 12 is irrelevant if they are capable of such heinous crimes. And their parents should also be in the Dock as they have full responsibility for these minors in their care and have failed.

Maybe the parents tried to access help and support?

Is it readily available to struggling parents?

Then all people have to do is not get sent there!

For a start I would feel safer with them behind bars for longer and my 'human rights', as a law abiding citizen, should trump those of a murderer, whatever their age.

They don't tend to if they've got cash and are white.

Why is all the concern for the murderers and not for the young man they murdered and for his family having to serve a whole life sentence of not having their son?

That’s not how human rights work unfortunately - they’re universal so even people who probably don’t deserve said rights get them. Otherwise you end up in a potentially tricky situation with governments who can decide who should benefit from the right not to be tortured etc - and we all know where that ends..!