What's happened to young people? Can parents give me insight.

[EveningSpread]

I work in Higher Education, and I'm increasingly worried about young people.

So far this year, I've encountered more students than usual who:

• say they are unable to attend classes due to anxiety
• who are afraid of being in classes
• who won't speak when spoken to by staff or other students
• who say they find getting on a bus and getting to class to overwhelming
• who find the thought of doing their work so stressful that they can't cope
• who don't come to classes due to family parties / their hamster dying / waking up late (to name the reasons I've had just this morning) and expect you to fix what they've missed - in other words, who seem totally immature and unprepared for life (a different problem to the other things above, perhaps)

Obviously we express sympathy, reassure, and explain that they need to access the help that will enable them to function - to enjoy life, succeed on their degree, and get a job afterwards. (So the wellbeing services, and their GP.) Often the reassurance really helps. But equally a lot of these students don't cope at University. I'm sure this problem is exacerbated by the fact that I work in an institution that attracts students from postcodes with multiple indices of deprivation.

Part of me hopes that mental health issues are sometimes exaggerated or even an excuse, as an increasingly large percentage of my students seem essentially afraid to leave the house -- which would be much worse than them just trying it on/being a bit lazy! It's great that we have a language to talk about mental health now, but it's hard to know how/when to tell people that (a) they are responsible for improving their own mental health so they can function in the world, and (b) experiencing some mild discomfort and difficulty, such as being nervous around new people, is normal and crucial to development.

But I'm left wondering: how are parents coping with their young people if these are the miserable lives they're living? If they're not going to classes, are scared to leave the house, and can't function?

So AIBU, or is this problem getting worse? What can parents of roughly 16-20 year olds tell me? Are we still dealing with the legacies of COVID? What's the word on the street among young people about mental health these days?

You said:
School every day might be the most important three words of that post. What you describe here is all very communal. Bet she knew the neighbours well too.

Your implication was that the only thing preventing my mum and young people of her generation from becoming anxious wrecks was going to school every day. You wrote off the years of stress and deprivation and daily worry, let alone the imminent threat of death. Please don't seek to minimise what many people went through and what other victims of war are going through now. And don't make yourself look like a patronising twat by calling me, or any other woman on MN, silly.

I worked in HE for 30 years. The problems started with reliance on the mobile phone and the rise of social media, then the financial crisis in 2007 which still has its aftereffects. COVID, climate change and the cost of living crisis exacerbated the problems. Students work long hours to afford university, so their attention is scattered. I used to assign several chapters of reading for seminar, and over time, that amount went down, because the students could not cope. We literally had to show them how to comprehend their reading, concentrate, take notes in class.

I worked with students extensively to help them get the confidence to make a 3 minute presentation with a partner in front of the class. The students were 20 years old. Same with exam preparation, same with working with groups in seminars. Some university students came with the emotional maturity of a 14-year old. Classes for first years after a while seemed less about the material then about personal development...catching up on emotional maturity. It was really difficult. Not all students were like this...some came prepared academically and emotionally, but the number that had some significant MH problems just exploded in numbers.

I recently retired as my university had massive financial problems and took a buy out. My stress levels plummetted, but I still think of those students and my heart breaks.

I am going to be curious about the effects of some schools banning mobile phones from campus. I also frankly think some mindfulness training when children are small could help a lot with anxiety and emotional regulation.

As ever, with these complex societal problems, there isn't a single cause. Unfortunately, social media has a tendancy to bring out people who want to reduce everything to a single cause because it fits with their own agenda. With regard to Covid you get this with knobs on and a group of people feel very strongly about it, speak emotively about it and bring it into every discussion as a the 'main' or the 'only' or conversely don't think it was a factor at all.

Let's accept that the pandemic has now become an influence in every societal issue. However, we have no evidence on whether this has 1% or 100% causality. Let's accept it is now part of a cocktail of factors all of which need tackling. For some people and in some situations it was a big factor, for others and in other situations it wasn't. All people and situations are different.

In this situation you also have different groups whose pet theory is parenting, or baby boomers, or schools, or funding, or social media, or 'in my day we just got on with it', or... etc. It isn't particularly helpful (although I know I threw my two pennyworth in as a factor). They are all factors so how do we go about addressing them?

The difficulty we have is when one or two of these groups get louder than the others and we end up with kneejerk legislation which is helpful to no-one. All these issues are far more nuanced and need a multi-prong, cross-political, consistent and long-term approach to improvement.

Excellent post.

In my experience it is secondary school that ruins kids in this country.. they leave lovi g primary schools to go to enormous secondary schools of 1000 plus people, wear outdated uniform, get their personal liberty removed if they dare make a mistake (forget a pen, a timetable, miss the bus etc..), made to stand in lines, eat lunch in 15 minutes standing up, and at our school I kid you not are hosed down withn cold water after swimming lessons because the showets are broken.. its worse than jail - it would break my mental healrh too.wheres the joy of the teenage years!

I agree with this.

At the moment, secondary school is hell for a lot of children. They go in from the more caring and safe environment of primary school into the rigid, confidence-killing secondary one. That has been increasingly for years now.

Now add two years of lockdown and bingo!

I don't bear any responsibility for things you've made up. Any offence felt here is a consequence of your own stupidity alone.

And it's really quite morally revolting to try and co-opt victims of war now into your attempt to cover for your poor comprehension skills. One thing for you just not to be very sensible, but this is disgusting as well.

Yes, this is what I am seeing too. It's really serious stuff and for us it is triggered by food reactions.

Good topic. Sad. But should be discussed
Children need challenge. To learn to cope. Parents are there to be of support, to provide care, to protect. This age group should be more than able to function 80 percent or more in society. Children need to take advantage of every option in order to challenge their capabilities. Getting up, getting to school, eating, providing their food, choices. Otherwise you are spoon feeding and that usually ends at weaning unless there are disabilities. Which highlights some using choices to decline options based on not wanting rather than unable. This age group were more capable 80 years ago. We want a capable generation not a reluctant one

I think years ago there was more of a “this is the way it is, get on with it” attitude. If we’d had lockdowns when I was a child, we’d have just been expected to get on with it and get over the fact that we maybe missed a few months socialising. We’d have been given the “there’s children in this world dealing with far worse than you ever will, so pull yourself together”. And we would have done, because there was no other option. We do children a huge disservice by not being tougher with them.

The reality is, kids had more opportunity to stay in touch with friends during covid than we would have years ago.

I remember my mum trying to hide her crying while dropping me off at school when I was sobbing and retching in fear at going back after my illness. She told me years later that she hated seeing the state I was in, and she cried all the way to work every day, but she knew that I was going to have to get on with it, or I’d spend my life a slave to my anxiety. And she knew that to be a fully functioning adult, I needed to learn to deal with these things to survive.

I am so grateful for that. At the time it felt like I was in hell, but I grew into the most resilient teenager you could ever meet. Even now as an adult, nothing phases me, and I believe it was tough love that saved me. But god it must have been hard for my mum, especially after everything I’d been through with my health and the fears I wouldn’t make it.

Come on children. You are almost adult and of an age to vote and influence. Use what you have
Head for thinking, feet for moving

This. Very similar to my experience. Particularly the ice on the windows in winter. And this was what made you, and me, resilient.

I had a generalised anxiety disorder, my psychologist basically helped me pinpoint part of it then gave me a checklist of social interactions and told me tough shit get on with it. It really helped tbh. It was hard, I spent a lot of time sweating and hyperventilating but it turned everything around.

A particular anxious kid I know (ill missed a lot of school so fell away from friendship groups) was given the tough shit ultimatum after covid. He’s really thrived.

I’m not convinced COVID has the same impact as war psychologically.

The boomer generation did not live in peace.

Threat of cold war
Nuclear war expected, public told to go into their cupboards under the stairs or under a table if there was a nuclear attack.
Falklands war.
Miners strikes.
Staggered Power cuts.
Dustmen strikes, rats in the street.
Absolute misogyny, could hardly go out without comments, bum pinching, groping.
Less advanced medical treatments. If you had cancer you just died.
Yes, lower housing prices but no home comforts like today.
No central heating, no washer dryers, ice on the insides of windows.
Needed to wear coats, hats, gloves in bed in winter.
Outside toilets.
Most didn't have showers.
No telephones, land line if you were lucky.
Food was still rationed until 8 years after the war.
Mods and rockers fighting on the beaches.
Only gas & air or pethidine for births.
No baby scans.
No epidurals.
No heart, kidney transplants etc.
No antibiotics until penicillin in the 60's and then it was only available in hospital.
Thalidomide.
Less vaccinations.

And much much more.....
I wouldn't call it living in peace.
It would have been hell except people were much nicer and they all looked after each other.

This. So many older people do not realise just how toxic our schools have become. It’s nothing like it was. I’m an ex teacher and I home educate mine for this reason. There is unprecedented pressures to excel academically, professionally and socially too.

I would also like to add other things that have affected young people today other than the terrible education system:

lockdowns- the effects of social isolation and death fear on children and young people were disastrous.

poverty/cost of living/economic insecurity - much higher cost of living in general/high inflation plus house prices are nearly 9 times higher in relation to wages than in the 1970s when it was just 4 times a wage. The future is far bleaker for them with many having to live at home until their 30s. Combine this with their own parents both having to work and struggle.

Constant news and social media feeds breeding fear and an unrealistic standards of beauty, success and happiness.

Agreed.

See also : Anxiety

You come out with either of these "on trend" conditions to an employer, and you can pretty much dictate the terms of your employment.

My DH is a Police Officer. One of his colleagues won't do night shifts, because "Anxiety". This has been accommodated, but of course, someone else now has to do extra night nights shifts. How about this dickhead didn't apply to be a Police Officer, and applied for something more appropriate, instead of pulling the "special" card and fucking other people over in the process?

I believe it’s multiple factors. And it’s affecting adults too.

1.	Lack of community humans are meant to live in tribes (covid has made this worse) 
2.	Lack of green space -where are the parks. Freedoms kids used to enjoy in the 70/80s are gone. 
3.	Food.  Our food is too processed.  We don’t get the nutrients we need in our food anymore.  Too much sugar/ to much corn and soya and plant oil
4.	We are all suffering from some level of depression from high cost of living and stress from our way of life. 
5.	Aspiration. To get a good job and home seems unavailable now.  Uni costs are too high and good jobs are not available/or going abroad. 
6.	School. Too strict. Too academic. Too set on grades and attendance   Too one size must fit all. 
7.	No provision for kids that are not academic 
8.	No provision for kids that have ASD ADHD except mainstream or very specialised schools. No middle ground for those that don’t fit either. 
9.	Social Media   =No rest when is the last time you were really really Bored? 
10.	Social Media = expectations. On life /on looks/ on relationships. They are not real but display peacock style lives. 
11.	Porn. To young too accessible to hardcore robbing our kids innocence 
12.	Climate change and war 
13.	Covid   Lockdowns during formative years.  Arresting people for having a coffee on a walk    Telling us we will Granny should we break a rule.  Of course that will mess up a young persons brain 
14.	Instability. Jobs are insecure. Conditions are worse. 

In my opinion we need to stop chasing the quick
Fix. We need to eat like we used to. We need to let
Our kids out. We need to help each other. We need
To get bored. We have changed too quickly we need to slow
Down and catch up.
And social
Media needs to be taken seriously for the damage is causes and cleaned up and fast.

As a society, I think we are giving our kids way too much digital autonomy and not nearly enough physical autonomy.

I think that having time to be bored is very important tbh. Kids these days have so many entertainment options, they never get time to think and just experiment in the world.

I’ve made my DD do things despite crying and screaming. In some cases it took months to get her in a room doing an activity without me. She started a new activity that requires parents leave the site, kissed me goodbye and didn’t look back at the first session. She’s 5. It took a while to get there and we had some horrendous reactions to other things, screaming and crying hysterically. But it sunk in that she’ll be fine and she can cope. She’s so much more open to trying new things now and very confident.

I think you have to sometimes be extremely uncomfortable to progress, we need to teach our kids that too.

It’s pathetic that these threads ALWAYS turn into ‘who had it worse’. I don’t agree that boomers all had it easy (but many did) as I don’t agree that today young people have it easy (they don’t but of course some do).

Why can’t we have this conversation without resorting to comparisons and blame.

Maybe I just needed to reminisce.....

I going to sound like a complete dinosaur here but I think everything being done by app or at least the ability to bypass human interaction means my kids have had less practise of "soft skills" and talking with people than the previous generation.

I totally agree with you @Fizbosshoes

My 72 "thanks" suggests your sarcasm is misplaced.

@capstix no doubt from the younsgters on here who weren't actually alive back then, and have no idea what life was life during the power cuts of the 1970s, bomb scares, the IRA, strike action after strike action, high interest rates etc etc.

However, it was a more innocent time back then, so it wasn't all bad.

Interesting.

Covid here went on really long time wales - but one thing it did do was stop many additional opportunities.

Some groups - guide/scouts never came back free holiday swim stiff aged out of- others like trips aboard never came back for their year - DS - others like summer school were on-line so not as good as going to uni campus. Plus as we don't live near family there was 18 months they didn't see GP they'd seen once a month most of their lives. So a lot of outside confidence boosting things never happened.

Then cost of living hit us and we never did start going out as much as we once did.

Eldest two have done volunteering and taken advance of any new opportunities so I think impact been minimal on them but I think it's often something overlooked and no idea how you'd measure impact for it.