To think that the ADHD label is masking other things in society?

[comoatoupeira]

Disclaimer this is NOT about being skeptical ADHD is a thing, my brother is diagnosed with ADHD by a doctor as well as a close friend of mine.

Through my job I have been doing a lot of research about the impacts of tech and social media and so on on young people, and also on the elderly who are becoming the first generation of elderly people who are high technology users.

It has all been making me see so many parallels between behaviors associated with ADHD and behaviors that are becoming more and more difficult to control because of the attention-stealing environment we are in, and other aspects of society today like consumerism always available in your pocket, long working hours and both parents working, the difficulty of taking those restorative breaks that are what helps us focus and take a step back.

I'm just feeling like we are looking at some milder cases of ADHD too much as an isolated medical thing rather than a wider societal ill.

I feel like the same thing has happened with depression, framing it as some sort of imbalance that can be fixed by drugs, when it's so much about the societies we live in.

I feel uncomfortable about all of these labels being used especially by young people with mild cases of things, it seems to imprison them in a fixed identity or frame them as having something wrong with them, when none of us a perfect and we all have strengths and weaknesses, and life is about living with them and being open to change.

What do you think?

But if you can put a name to something it makes it far easier to accommodate. If someone is experiencing trauma then the support/interventions they need is different to the those needed for someone who is autistic or ADHD so it is very useful to diagnose them accurately if at all possible. And remove or change those diagnoses as more is learned about the individual. It is no different to any other condition.

If you have a blood test that shows cancer is the most likely issue you don't stop there, you do more tests to confirm and then pinpoint where the cancer is so you can treat it more effectively.

I disagree completely

Ds was diagnosed at 8 which is around the norm for ADHD. Prior to 6/7 developed absolutely normally. There was some trauma/bereavements in the family around this time.

Our consultant pysch and mdt were aware but still diagnosed ADHD. He was severely impacted and medicated.They said trauma can trigger it. They also said a not insignificant proportion of kids can grow out of it. Which studies evidence. Years later and indeed he has pretty much grown out of it.

We are only at the beginnings of our understanding of trauma and how it can influence not only neurological disorders but also physical illness.

That’s an incredibly quick diagnosis from showing supposedly no adhd traits what so ever at 6/7 to being on a waiting list, assessed and diagnosed by 8. My eldest seemed like the most laid back person in the world before Year 1 of school, but from my own experience he was obviously an introvert ADHD type. Most of the ‘hyperactivity’ is internal and affects girls/women more hence why they’re far more undiagnosed. Undiagnosed ADHD does tend to become more ‘obvious’ in children past reception age, they’re not making the same emotional/regulation developments as their peers and the far more rigid environment post ‘play based’ reception can absolutely heighten traits of a child who can’t transition between free time and structured timetable well.

I’m not saying a coincidental trauma event helped but it’s absolutely typical with or without difficult times for adhd to seem to ‘appear out of nowhere’ in young children if you don’t notice the traits beforehand.

Ds was diagnosed at 8 which is around the norm for ADHD. Prior to 6/7 developed absolutely normally

Its normal for boys who may externalise it. However my daughter who internalises didn’t get diagnosed until 17 after 18 months of school refusal.

You can run a brain scan for ASHD. It was developed in the 90’s

8 isn’t the norm for ADHD if the massive adult diagnosis waiting list is anything to go by. Also many many get diagnosed as teens.

I don’t understand why you’re getting defensive. You obviously know that yours and your daughter’s cases don’t fall in to what I am suggesting.

I am suggesting that there could be some meaningful link between too much screen time and the rise in these diagnoses. By meaningful, I don’t necessarily mean they directly caused it. But I wouldn’t mind betting that they exacerbate it. We should be able to have these discussions without people getting defensive.

I'd say that whilst ADHD is a medical sometimes genetic condition, the severity and therefore incidences of it are hugely exacerbated by modern life mainly screens.

Plus I see that ADHD behaviours are often 'regulated' poorly by parents who don't understand the condition by shoving a screen at very young children even when that might not be the best approach.

Then kids become completely dependent on screens, can't listen, can't function and the school is convinced to include screens for them as 'accommodations' and the downward spiral is complete.

The screens are possible interacting completely 'normally' with their developing brains but because they are used more often and younger it has a markedly worse effect.

I fucking hate screens and I'm very much including myself in that as Im currently stuck in procrastination screen mode when I should be working.

We know a lot more about neuro plasticity these days. How much our brains can change, even in adult hood. Young people’s brains are far more plastic than adults are. It seems entirely logical to me that babies/toddlers and young people being so often in front of a screen when their brains are developing could potentially cause some kind of developmental issues later on down the line. I am not suggesting that these issues are ADHD or ASD - quite the opposite, actually. I am saying they could mimic some of the symptoms of both of those conditions. Or perhaps, in some cases, trigger or exacerbate these conditions (I know work on the interplay of environment vs genes is a lot more advanced these days also)

As a thought experiment, what if they came up with an entirely separate disorder “overuse of screen time disorder” that had its own set of symptoms and diagnostic criteria. It could be a differential diagnosis. Mental health professionals could be trained to tell the difference and you’d get far less of the support that is desperately needed for actual ADHD or ASD directed where it isn’t needed.

I agree with this.
Especially your last paragraph!
These things are addictive for grown adults, what the hell are they doing to young people’s brains?
Even if they aren’t inherently causing harm in and of themselves, the child not experiencing what the screen replaces can cause harm.
See my examples up thread… social and attention regulation starts at a very young age and kids need to be able to interact with the world around them and watch other social situations and learn from them. You can’t do that if you’ve your face in an iPad.
I see it in myself, when I am in a better place mentally and stricter with myself - put the phone down and read instead for example, my ability to think, focus, problem solve etc etc improves dramatically.
It is unfortunate that screens are so addictive. But they are made that way by the tech companies on purpose. It’s them I blame, not parents who choose to put screens in front of their kids on a regular basis.

So why use diagnosis?

There is a lot of ADHD in my family, my dad, my brother and me all have it.
I absolutely believe that our current lifestyles and most importantly screens, and particularly smart phones are a HUGE problem for ADHD sufferers.
My concentration has got so bad now that I can't sit through a film like Zog with my kids and follow the story. Having watched Zog about 5 times I still couldn't tell you what happens.
I can't watch an adult film, the thought of it makes me nervous as I know it will shine a light on how bad my concentration is, and it feels literally torturous to sit for so long concentrating on something.
This was not the case when I was a child, or a teen. I showed a lot of ADHD symptoms when young (procrastinating, disorganised, handing things in late, not going to lectures, daydreaming) so the foundations were all there, but my concentration has never been so bad.
I watch my brother glued to his phone, the second he isn't occupied, his hand reaches for it and he's on some game. He spends his evenings on computer games.
I have tried to quit my phone many times but it lures me back, it's an addiction like any other addiction. Quick dopamine hits, it's what the ADHD brain craves.
A simple unplugged life would suit me, if I lived a simple life, my ADHD wouldn't be such an issue, I crave simplicity but it's so hard to achieve in the modern world.

So yes I absolutely believe the extent of ADHD is a product of the times, exacerbated by our lifestyles.
I seriously believe we have got to a stage where we are medicalising normal human variation. If your square peg doesn't fit in this round hole, you must need a diagnosis.
Some of the aspects of ADHD are beneficial. My dad would have made an incredible caveman! Always on the hunt for somewhere new, something exciting, thrives off risk and pressure and fear. The ability to hyperfocus when something is of interest. We always say about my dad...when life is calm, he is in crisis, when there is a crisis, he is at peace.

This is a really interesting and very honest post. I think you’ve articulated what I have been trying to say.
I don’t have ADHD (that I know of!!) but I can relate so much to what you’re saying. I can barely concentrate. I think it’s down to stress and anxiety for me and I reach for my phone to make me feel better and escape from my life. The thought of sitting down and working on a deadline for my job feels absolutely overwhelming at the minute. It’ll only be a matter of time before that starts to cause me real problems.

That last paragraph on how some ADHD traits would have served us when we had simpler lives is really interesting as well.

But the OP has some very valid points, how do we know for sure the extreme use of technology, constant estimulation etc doesn't cause ADHD? Kind of like how you have 2 types of diabetes, one is caused by eating habits.

I agree - schools - and they do vary a lot - do often seem to have less tolerance for difference now and discipline can be inflexible and draconian.

However the kids behavior also gotten much worse - noise levels impact my kids hugely - general disruption not helped by teacher shortages lots of supply is worse - toilets are locked and hard to access due to huge level of vandalism.

It's not a great experience for anyone.

I agree the "mild" description is problematic, but it's extremely difficult to find a way of describing different levels of functioning in different areas. I say this as someone who would be considered "mildly" autistic (diagnosed in 30s, big impact on life ... but still). The patchwork nature of abilities in autism especially makes it difficult to conceptualise or describe.

However, for autism at least, there is the Broader Autism Phenotype (BAP). That is, close relatives of someone diagnosed with autism often have some similar traits, but not enough to meet the threshold for diagnosis. For myself, compared to my functioning and successful siblings who I share these traits with, I sometimes think actually I'm BAP, but life events (esp. trauma) made the autistic side more apparent. Even when I was being diagnosed they puzzled over me for ages (they commented on this! I seemed to be so on the borderline, even for a woman).

So in terms of having a significant impact on your life to be diagnosed - this could vary depending on life experiences and the environment you develop in. So someone like me but with different experiences (and I am friends with people like this) may not meet the threshold for diagnosis, and have found their niche in which to be happy and successful. I think this is what the OP was getting at. The environment can make someone's autistic/ADHD traits come to the fore, or alternatively be more suitable for them so they thrive.

Where you draw the line between diagnosis or not is kind of an academic question - what is a "significant" impact, for example? (I realise that even by looking at it in this imprecise way I am displaying the non-autistic parts of my thinking! Or is it autistic because I am compelled to reply to this small detail?!)

I’m not following the connection you’ve made. The biopsychosocial model isn’t about removing diagnostic labels.

There is nothing wrong with using the term 'mild' or 'severe' to describe ADHD. Even doctors use it. Depending on the number of symptoms present and the level with which they interfere with every day life. It's not a case of 'you have the disorder or you don't' A diagnosis is based on self reported answers to a series of questions alongside reports from schools or parents from childhood. For some people their symptoms are extreme and a diagnosis is obvious, they might be considered 'severe'. For others they are borderline, and one psychiatrist might diagnose and another wouldn't, they would be considered mild, it's subjective.

You cannot grow out of ADHD. It is rooted in the neurological make up of the brain. In is innate and you cannot grow out of it - to say this utterly disgusting and misrepresents what it is. It is absolutely and indefatigably NOT triggered BY trauma, although childhood trauma can be especially difficult to deal with if you have ADHD and the ability to manage one’s ADHD can be exacerbated by experiencing trauma. I have a degree in psychology and specialised in this, I am also the parent and sister of five ASD/ADHD family members as well one myself. Whoever told you this was either wrong, or you misunderstood.

The research shows that in the wake of childhood trauma behaviours that map onto ADHD are often observed - ie children can be misdiagnosed with ADHD. Those children may ‘grow out of’ the behaviours as they mature and respond to therapy. You do not grow out of ADHD.

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/adhd-and-trauma#:~:text=Studies%20have%20found%20that%20trauma,well%20into%20adulthood%20as%20well.

It probably accounts for the leap in numbers of children with SN starting school though.

There have been many threads about why lots of small children are starting school without being able to talk, not potty trained, very poor social skills.

This is a recent change and not the same as the smaller number of children starting school with the same issues that are autistic.

Modern parenting is far more stressful and judged than it used to be which surely contributes to declining mental health, which contributes to poor parenting. Life is screwing us in so many ways.

My presentation of autism is less severe than someone who is non verbal and needs constant care.

I can manage my own difficulties for the most part, so whilst mild autism may not technically be a diagnosis in reality it’s obvious to everyone involved that my autism is not the same as someone severely affected.

Those who are severely affected throughout their lives and need constant care usually have GDD, aphasia or a learning disability alongside autism. That’s not autism itself which is not on a scale of mild to severe.

@hellenbach Please tell me you fed this back to the school/teacher that you were shocked by the lack of interaction? If nobody says anything then they won’t change

The referral to diagnosis was actually only 4 months. It was a very comprehensive process though.

There were definitely no signs as far as I was concerned but also health professionals who would/should have picked up on it if any had been apparent.

My dd is verbal and under several services and needs a huge amount of MH support. Her autism isn’t mild because she can speak thanks. It’s severe.