Family member awarded enhanced pip - AIBU?

[Orangecrocs]

My family member has just been awarded enhanced pip in both living and mobility components.
Shes told me that she’s twisted the truth during the assessment and told the assessor that she has lots of pain and can’t really walk at all, but she walks all the time as I see her out and about - we live in a hilly area. I know people who are in a wheelchair and struggle to get enhanced rate - so I really don’t understand how she’s managed this.
I know people will say mind your own business but she’s told me she’s actually lied to them.

I don't mean to be confrontational, but I think it is unacceptable for you to share details of your client in this way. If she were on this site she would recognise herself. Really unprofessional.

Made even more unfair by the fact that those claiming PIP after retirement age by way of an ongoing claim, can’t claim any part of the mobility allowance if they didn’t claim it before age 66. DWP use pension age as the cut off point for new claims, and new awards of mobility component, because they consider new mobility issues after that as age related. That being the case it doesn’t make sense to award someone the mobility component for ten years when they’re already on the cusp of reaching retirement.

You should report her then. If it’s all over her social
media then it won’t be difficult for the investigators to catch her out surely ? It’s people like that that are causing all the horrible attitudes towards disabled claimants. Many people just see the fraudsters & make assumptions that everyone is ‘at it’!

What do you think about the content of the post otherwise?

It’s possible to fly to India or anywhere else with arthritis or any other disability that impacts mobility.

I think this is the whole crux of the matter. DWP routinely look at the social media accounts of claimants across most benefits, not just PIP. They use the content to disallow claims if SM activity contradicts the terms of their claim, and I’ve known claimants who have had their benefits stopped or reduced after this kind of evidence has come to light. Most benefit claimants are aware that their social media accounts can be used in this way - it’s well publicised in DWP literature. That being the case I don’t really understand why you would openly flaunt a fraudulent claim on social media if you know you have a good chance of being rumbled as a result. I simply don’t believe people are that stupid.

There was a case in one of the newspapers not so long ago about a lady who stated on her claim that she was a full time wheelchair user. The DWP saw photos of her standing up at a wedding. They stopped her benefit, but subsequently had to reinstate it after she successfully appealed. She hadn’t wanted the wheelchair in the photograph, and her family had gathered either side of her to support her to stand. She produced other photos as evidence which clearly showed she was being supported from all sides.

So, bearing in mind that she was a genuine claimant, I think that demonstrates how easy it is for anyone, even DWP to misinterpret. I understand that people can be angry about those they see as ‘not disabled enough’ but disability is complex, there are a lot of things factored into a successful claim for PIP and other benefits, and what’s on the surface is very rarely all there is.

You can't make a sweeping statement like that. Some are indeed the lowest of the low. Others are brilliant and make the effort to go the extra mile, like the one who assessed my DS. Like any person in a job, they come in all kinds.

I agree. The assessor who dealt with my DH's claim was actually very kind and he was awarded enhanced rate for both parts with a ten year award and light touch review. DWP do get it right for some people. But they need to get it right first time much more often.

It would be awesome if somebody could link to one of these 'social media' groups openly advocating and facilitating benefit fraud.

I'll wait.

I don’t think you meant yo quote my post?

If you look back through the thread you’ll see that this poster doesn’t have a very high opinion of anything that doesn’t cater to their own wants and needs - it seems that the hordes of fraudulent PIP claimants are stopping them from getting what they need, Motability is also shite apparently, because they won’t provide a wheelchair as well as a car using the mobility allowance, and because they won’t provide the thousands of pounds needed for more complex adaptations unless you undergo a means test - apparently the application process for the means test is a joke. Presumably because that poster doesn’t qualify. Confidently expecting this post to be deleted shortly.

@TomeTome Sincere apologies - misunderstood your post as saying you couldn’t fly to India with these disabilities. Either my eyesight is on the blink, or my blood pressure is through the roof at some of these replies. Sorry, I’ll get it deleted now and book an eye test !!

I totally agree, also the fact that she booked a holiday is no one's business either. Being disabled with mobility problems can make life harder, not impossible. It is not fair to basically pour scorn on the fact that she dared to go on holiday.

So will I. Waiting with bated breath as we speak !!

I m not sure there are groups that are actively advocating fraud ,but as I have said on previous threads of this nature ,I'm on various Facebook groups ,for DLA /PIP and I see posters on a regular basis putting in claims for very tenuous reasons, and I think some people probably do join the groups to Pick up tips ,
That said they are generally not successful.

Yeah and the benefit fraud investigators would have a field day - a self-compiled data base of fraudsters/would-be fraudsters to look into

I also think some assessors find that they aren’t suited to the job - sometimes because certain aspect of the nature of the work goes against their ethics as a health professional. I know a few people personally who were recruited and didn’t last long.

It’s also a fact that in the main DWP assessment providers don’t recruit doctors as assessors - they’re largely nurses, physios, paramedics etc, and as such won’t necessarily have any prior experience of the conditions they’re being asked to assess and are relying on the few days training they receive in disability analysis after being recruited.

And I think it’s also only fair to mention that assessment reports are regularly audited, and the auditor can direct the assessor to change any aspect of the report if they think they are being too generous with the points awarded. This is despite the auditor having never even seen the claimant. Are we all getting the picture as to how the system is actually designed to work against the claimant ? Does anyone see why those who work within the system, or have been at the pointy end of it are trying to make the point that defrauding the PIP system is not as ridiculously easy as posters suggest ?

@Rosscameasdoody IIRC the GMC had some 'misgivings' at the outset and even tho' some doctors were recruited initially they faded away after that

To be fair this poster sounds like a benefit adviser, and having worked in the same field I don’t think they were exactly pouring scorn on the claimant. I’ve provided a few, hopefully anonymous, examples of my own, but I can see where people are coming from with this one as it could be outing if the claimant is on MN.

As far as the holiday goes, I think the main point was that the claimant was using the backpay from the claim to pay for the holiday. I must admit I found this unusual because IME claimants usually saved any substantial backpay or put it towards a big purchase. Not that I consider booking a holiday with it unreasonable, but it depends on your opinion as to whether PIP should be used wholly for disability related expenditure, and whether a holiday could be considered that. I don’t have an opinion either way - there are no restrictions on how the benefit is spent, and nor do I think there should be.

The posters’ main point has been lost though. The claimant was on the point of reaching age 66 and was awarded the mobility component for ten years on the basis of a condition which can occur as a result of the aging process. This does seem a bit perverse when you think that AA claimants over retirement age don’t have a mobility component because any new mobility conditions after age 66 are deemed age related and not supported.

Yes, I remember seeing a statistic somewhere saying that at the start of the implementation of PIP, one of the largest assessment providers employed over two thousand assessors and only three were doctors. Most are general nurses, physios, OT’s and paramedics.

There were posters well upthread stating with confidence that there were FB and other social media sites set up to advise on how to claim PIP if you weren’t disabled. I think that’s what’s being referred to here. Like you, I’ve seen various websites and SM groups, including an excellent one called Benefits and Work, who offer advice on how make the best possible claim for PIP by properly describing how your condition affects you from day to day - thus having a better chance of a successful claim first time round and avoiding the stress of appeal. I think there’s a world of difference between that and actively assisting people in committing fraud. DWP are all over claimants’ social media posts these days, so I can’t see how that wouldn’t be picked up.

@TomeTome you asked re flying with arthritis. You could but I would think it really difficult if you couldn't elavate your legs. If you had a business class seat this is possible, economy I doubt a eight hour flight wouldn't leave you bent double and in severe pain.
I had to give up my job last December as I couldn't fly anymore. The tax payer lost my substantial tax receipts. I got enhanced pip and that was it. My education and experience has been wasted. Luckily I have a new drug and my health has improved a little. However both my GP and consultant wanted to medically retire me. I refused. I hope to get further improvements after my next treatment. However I will never walk again without aids.

I actually experienced the blue badge abuse yesterday (it hasn't happened for a while). I had my badge inspected from outside the car. I was on a stick ffs. I put it down to my youthful good looks! 😄

Be kind seems to have been forgotten.

I was a member of a few but got kicked out for speaking my mind ! i can't say these were groups where people advised how to claim fraudulently but there were certainly members encouraging others to exaggerate the truth "as it's the only way you'll get an award ". The other issue was posters telling others to "write every answer as if it's your very worst day ". When I pointed out that it's fine to describe a worst day but that you should also specify how often bad days happen as PIP is based on how you are on the majority of days, people would get abusive towards me so I gave up trying to help in the end.

Actually I didn't get kicked out just left of my own accord as people were just nasty.