To not go on the residential?

[Youthiswastedontheyoung]

I've just started a new p/t teaching role. Towards the end of the academic year the whole year group go on a residential which is about 3.5 hours away, for a full school week.
I have a just-turned 4 yo and other academic commitments outside of school.
AIBU to say I can't attend the residential?
As an aside, my mum (love her) thought teachers got paid for any additional hours regarding this. She was surprised to learn I'd just be getting my standard pay!

In your ”professional role” does your pay reflect this additional commitment because I don’t think teaching generally does?

I attended one residential, when I was an NQT and felt I had to. Never again!!! 😂
it’s been over 10 years and I just say no if I’m asked, it’s never a problem.

As a kid at school, you always knew the teachers who did the minimum. Took weeks to mark anything, hadn’t prepped the lesson, never did trips away. In sixth form at my grammar school, your heart sunk if you were allocated to their class.

I have a very close friend who elected all through lockdown to go into school because they were worried about the kids with problematic home lives who had to be sent in. They wanted to emotionally support those kids, instead of staying home on zoom.

I remember my parent taking underprivileged kids on residentials to France, the only foreign holiday they’d had. Arranging sports events, where non academic kids could shine. Endless rehearsals for end of term plays, where everyone got a part. Dining table constantly covered in books being marked. (Happily enjoying a financially comfortable retirement now thank goodness.)

I guess my experience skews my view but I do think teaching is by its nature merged with some kind of social work, I just think it’s a shame that the admin levels now are so high they cripple teachers mentally and time wise.

Speaking for myself, my teaching friend earned a lot more than me and has a hugely better pension. And good luck to them too.

I wouldn't get travel expenses for a very long trip, a daily living allowance (never heard of that) or any time off in lieu.
And as for socialising with anyone, not much of a chance of that!
So not at all sure it is entirely comparable.

My husband is nearly 80, disabled, retired and never was a teacher never mind a head teacher. I think you are quoting the wrong person, I was actually saying how unreasonable that husband was.

I mean yes? I've had to work at some overnight conferences in my time- I'm salaried, I don't get paid any differently.

And you’re posting on mumsnet. Not exactly full on, is it?

So you don't agree with wanting teachers who are good at teaching? Teachers who did the minimum and didn't mark work etc wouldn't come under "good" in my book. I'm quite sure there are lots of good and excellent teachers who don't want to do residentials.

I have not RTFT. Staff across our academy group are paid extra hours for residentials as part of our retention strategy.

As a parent I would never EXPECT that any teacher had to attend residentials but I'd hope some don't mind taking their turn as is a known part of the job that it could be a potential.

With regards to the other complaints, why are you even in teaching? I have 2 teachers in my family and it is abundantly clear it's a vocational job. One particularly is just an outstanding teacher, so creative, so invested and is very well loved by parents and SLT alike. She doesn't complain about parents evenings as she knows its part of the job, she works so many extra hours which would drive me crazy, but again she said it's part of the job she is choosing to stay in and has been for over 20 years, and yes she has kids.

I just think there's a stark difference between someone seeing it as a job or seeing it as a vocation.

@Iwasafool Apologies - must have typed in wrong! But yes, you're right.

I didn't say a teacher gets to chose. I asked did she make it clear that she wouldn't be able to attend, then the school should have assigned her to a year group which doesn't do residentials.

Our school does take into consideration when assigning classes and year groups. Some teachers are very happy to attend, some cannot due to their own health issues, being a single parent, caring for an elderly relative etc. Some can do the year 2 one which is local, vut not the longer ones further away. For some children it will be their first time away, so it's important the staff with them are ones who know them well, know the dynamics of who shouldn't be with who, who has anxious parents who will project anxiety onto their child, who needs extra support etc. Forward planning saves last minute panics around having enough staff and provides a better experience for the children.

Teachers need to have firm boundaries like any other profession in order to look after their well-being. Part of the teacher recruitment and retention crisis in education is down to the demanding workload and this is a good example of it. Others in the school may volunteer because they enjoy it, however if you have commitments and don't want to, absolutely fine and it cannot be an 'expectation.'

My friend loves the residentials, raves about them in fact.

I think it just takes all sorts honestly.

This! My husband is in a senior role for a SME. He is contracted 9-5 but rarely does just that. He is often fielding calls in the evening, working on documents etc. Plus travelling around the country, attending evening events.

It always makes me laugh when I see teachers making out that they are somehow special because they work all these extra hours. You can tell which ones have never worked outside of the public sector.

I work for social services. You never hear us moaning about having to do welfare checks in the evening because someone has gone missing. Or coming in on our days off to attend urgent safeguarding meetings. We just get on with it!

Now social workers really are unsung heroes! How you cope with the level of stress I do not know. Hats off to you for sure.

@Demonhunter I'm not complaining. I was making the point that another poster was saying to "do my bit" by going on the residential. I already do "my bit" every day.
I once used a family law solicitor. Every time she called me or wrote a letter/sent an email it cost a huge amount. She itemised literally every minute she worked. We can but dream, eh?!

I think there’s a misunderstanding - I wasn’t commenting on your working pattern… I was answering a question you asked about other jobs?

Easy mistake but I just didn't want anyone to think I was suggesting that. That Head also needs to be careful with his dim view and how that translates to his attitude to that teacher. He sounds like a bit of a bully to me.

@rhubard My husband is a SW.
Do you get time off in lieu? If he works over he does which is fantastic as it means he can sometimes do school runs etc and he loves that 😀

This. But also while people continue to do it, it will continue to happen.

My job is like a solicitor. I record and bill time to the 15 minutes. I get paid my salary, which is fixed, if I bill 0 minutes or if I bill 24 hours every day. I expect your family solicitor was similar.

Your job is by far the one that I just wouldn't have the mental or emotional energy to do. I know SWs can get a bad rap, because like any other job, there's a couple of bad apples, but a friend of my parents was a children's SW for over 30 years and I just couldn't cope with the stress, the hours, the exhaustion.

I've heard social workers moaning on many an occasion. Try being the person with LPA for a relative with advanced dementia and trying to get support and see how far a social worker will go to help you. The idea of them going off on holiday with a group of their clients is hilarious. I can just imagine the screaming if they were actually asked to be responsible for them 24 hrs a day for several days.

Teachers I know take calls in the evening and attend safeguarding meetings, it is so insignificant they don't even comment on it.