To not want blasphemy laws in the UK?

[Blueybanditbingochilli]

https://www.yourlocalguardian.co.uk/news/24516089.sutton-man-61-chanted-who-f-allah-jailed/

Thug sentenced for violent disorder and threatening police, all good.

But the chanting? Maybe I’ve got the wrong end of the stick but I thought criticising religion, even crudely, is permitted in the UK and not a crime so long as it doesn’t stray into harassment or incitement of another crime.

Labour are allegedly considering new legislation around the extent to which people can criticise Islam.

AIBU to think people should have the right to criticise religion (even crudely), and that we should not revert to having blasphemy laws in the UK? I apply this to all religions, including my own, and not just Islam.

This.

Indeed.

OP, chanting something like this in public is aggressive and hateful.

It's not about "blashphemy", it's about hate and intolerance.

He was charged and convicted of violent disorder because he was acting in a threatening manner towards the police officers. Nothing to do with blasphemy laws.

No religion should be treated as special. All religious beliefs should be capable of being criticized without penalty. No one should be subject to discrimination due to a belief in a religion. But, I don't feel that I should have to be deferential to anyone because they hold a particular belief.
We strove long and hard to get away from according a particular belief system a special place in our society and I don't want that to be reinstated by the back door.
And sometimes criticising may appear offensive, that goes with the territory.

There are no blasphemy laws.

He was convicted of violent disorder, not criticising Islam.

Labour are not proposing laws to prevent criticism of Islam - that’s a far-right conspiracy.

Comforting them?

What in your eyes would be an example of blasphemy?

Not sure, again, where you are getting this information. Here is a house of commons document which clearly stated that there is no government endorsed definition of islamophobia and no legislation which outlaws it. https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CDP-2021-0140/CDP-2021-0140.pdf

Islam is not a race so I can't see how islamophobia can be equated to racism.

@MrsSkylerWhite

‘This. All religions are worthy of mockery.’

Absolutely !

Not sure if this is what is being referred

https://www.restorationbulletin.com/p/labours-backdoor-british-blasphemy

Well true but what if he was saying "F Jesus" or "Who tf is Jesus" instead? I bet it wouldn't be taken as seriously because people insult christians and their beliefs all the time. So it's about not treating one religion as more special than the other. If it's wrong, then it should be wrong for all. It's genuine fairness and equality.

(I'm not religious, by the way).

Well precisely. You know that. I know that. But we are talking about a government worried about antagonising a large part of its voter base. It's the All Party Parliamentary Group definition of Islamophobia being "rooted in racism and is a type of racism that targets expressions of Muslimness" Voila!..they now have the reason to clamp down on any negative comments about Islam under the cover of being anti racist (which as we all know is the current zeitgeist) hence being a back door blasphemy law.

If such a person was chanting that outside a church together with a mob, I am sure something would be done.

I think the reason people in the UK are disparaging of Christianity is because they are more familiar with it and may have had some negative experiences of being forced to sit through sermons, being proselytised to by door knockers or perhaps a bad experience in Sunday School growing up. People can get very annoyed if the Christian is very evangelical.

It's all a bit speculative at the moment, isn't it. And posts such as OP's are not helping with the debate. You see how quickly everyone assumed that the man was charged for chanting which quite clearly wasn't the case at all.
I'd like to reserve my judgement until we hear on official government position and, at the moment, there doesn't appear to be anything suggesting the legislation is underway.

Could you please quote or highlight where in the article it mentions blasphemy laws or that one of this offences were his insults about Islam?

I don't agree with blasphemy laws. I'm an atheist and I highly dislike the concept of faith. I believe people should be allowed to criticise religion (or anything else).

However, the things he chanted show that his other offences were racially motivated and of course that changes rhe sentencing. It is relevant and should be mentioned in court.

I can also tell you that when someone is being racist to you it feels very different to someone just being generally nasty or rude. I'm from India originally but have been called a paki, terrorist, etc and the racist element always makes mere rudeness or insults more intimidating and also more upsetting.

I also worry that since brexit racists seem to feel that they have found their tribe and that being racist is perfectly normal and socially acceptable now. I fear it will get worse. Do you want to live in a society where people think it's ok to shout Allah is a c*?

(Please note that I'm fully aware that Islam is not a race but I don't think thr word islamophobe is sufficient to describe people like this. He's obviously racist.)

Yes of course. Let's see how Two Tier pans out. They have got 5 years after all and not many Parliamentary constraints so they can enact whatever laws they like to limit free speech.

Thug sentenced for violent disorder and threatening police, all good.

But the chanting? Maybe I’ve got the wrong end of the stick but I thought criticising religion, even crudely, is permitted in the UK and not a crime so long as it doesn’t stray into harassment or incitement of another crime.

But he was convicted of violent disorder - as you say, all good.
He wasn't convicted for the shouting. That's just something the article has mentioned. I don't see the issue.

I think you've hit the nail on the head. It has to be assessed on an individual basis as to whether someone is being racist or not.

Brexit was about European migration so probably xenophobic if anything, rather than racist I would suggest. So half the voting block are probably not a tribe of racists.

Yes and also Christianity is the majority and the state religion. I suppose making fun of it is seen as punching up rather than down.

In India, e.g. where Christianity is not the majority religion you wouldn't think that it is more acceptable to criticise Christianity than Hinduism but India has a populist right wing government as well so things are changing. Also because the government and their supporters like to tell everyone that Hindus have been a soft touch that others like to take advantage of. Sound familiar?

What do you suggest we do instead? Engage in whaaboutry on MN so the government can take notice and amend a wholly hypothetical legislation?
You have an MP in your area, you could write to them for clarification and to express your views.

It's going to get harder and harder for people to keep their heads in the sand as we have been doing.

I don't see your point. The OP was asking about blasphemy laws originally and I was just trying to assist as to where the idea may have come from. I have no idea what to do about this Labour government's intention as to whether or not they introduce such a law. They are pretty unfettered and can do what they want. I have no faith they will do the right thing of course but not much I can do about it. Let's just wait and see what happens.

Why don't you consider Christianity to be a relgion?

I don't really recognise blasphemy at all. I am not religious and feel that people can say what they want about religion.

It is the manner in which it is said, and reading the article, this man is obviously bigoted, intolerant and full of hate.

It is not OK to stand on the street insulting people about what they believe. And standing there chanting "who the F* is Allah/ Jesus/ insert other religious figure here" is hateful and intolerant.

Hateful, intolerant but not illegal. People have no right not to be offended. We don't need any new laws to control speech.