Are French kids brought up differently to kids in England or were these just some super kids we met on holiday?

[XelaM]

Just returned from a boat day trip in Greece with my teen. There were a few other families there including a French family with two little kids aged five and six. Those kids were honestly some of the "toughest" (and most well-behaved) kids I have ever come across.

To start with, I have never seen kids that age swim so well. Those tiny kids were like fish - jumping from the side of the boat and swimming with zero aids in really really deep waters. We also visited some cliffs and some jumped from the cliffs into the sea (which was SO SCARY 😱) and those little kids did that as well! Even my adventurous teen said the jump from the cliffs was scary and she couldn't believe the two little kids did it.

We were also fed freshly caught sea urchin and sea potatoes (which were an acquired taste to say the least 🤣) and I was certain the kids wouldn't try them only to see those two taking one sea urchin after another with zero complaints.

They were up for anything and you never heard a single moan or complaint out of them (unlike my 14-year-old 😏). And it's not like their parents appeared strict or disinterested - they were having fun and engaged with the kids. The kids were super friendly and chatty (when spoken to by others) but otherwise completely did their own thing not bothering anyone at all.

At the end even my teen who usually has no time for little kids was impressed and commented that "those were some hard core kids" 😅 (her words).

So clearly I went wrong in my parenting somewhere 🤪 but it made me wonder - are French kids brought up differently - maybe more independent and resilient or were those some super-human robot kids? 😁

I have french in-laws and I feel the parenting is mostly the same, perhaps a little stricter, but the food is very different for kids, a lot less beige and the school meals seem a lot more about opening the kids up to “adult” foods vs kids meal type food( least in the school area the kids attend)

The most appallingly behaved child I ever met growing up was French 😂. The little cretin tried to kill my younger brother by walloping him round the head with a wooden plank (little brother was 3 at the time) and only stopped when our older cousin intervened and told her mother. His mother (who was staying with my aunt) was useless. Gave him a big bowl of ice cream while my mother sent us to hide out in my big cousin"s room until it was time to go home.

However, I'm sure he's not representative of French children, just like I'm not sure the two you came across are either. There probably are some differences, and I'm prepared to believe that French children have at least superficially better manners on a general level (I've met some tough French mamans who wouldn't put up with much!) but equally there are plenty of fairly no-nonsense English parents.

What does come to mind when you mention children like that - polite, confident, outgoing, with plenty of opportunities and skills, who have had lots of different experiences - is privilege. I think most children like the ones you describe - whether English, French, Italian, German - tend to come from very privileged, materially affluent, "together" families with relaxed, happy parents who can devote a lot of time to them.

In short, I'm not sure us normal folk should feel guilty for not being able to replicate this!

I live in France and the one thing I am always remarking on is how active the are . Where I am parents have classes for so many activities ( mainly sport ) and they are very reasonable. The ones I come across in my sport are lovely but obviously sure there are not so nice ones around as well.

I am French. I would say that yes French kids are raised differently to British kids (and the Spanish and the Italia and etc… as each country is culturally different) but I can absolutely confirm that many French kids are brats, rude, bullies and so forth.

I would say French parents are more old school than a lot of newer parenting styles that are popular currently in many other countries which means certain behaviors are still very heavily frowned upon and corrected (versus embraced).

But French parents are also less close to their children when in adulthood in comparison to other “warmer” countries. So. Horses for courses I guess.

Gizzards!

How more gallic can you get?

France is 3x bigger than the UK, with the same population, it just has more space & countryside, couple that with, generally speaking, far better weather.
It follows they have less grotty bits.

They have also spent more on public services for decades and never had Austerity last as long as it did in the UK.

Yeah, I've seen fathers wallop their kids in French ski resorts.

I think it depends on how you bring them up. We have a very “outdoorsy” lifestyle here in the UK, my husband and I do a lot of triathlon so both my dc have swum confidently outdoors from a young age as a result of this and are volunteer lifeguards. Both also eat well and adventurously (probably due to all the exercise!) but I think it’s so much harder here due to the weather so we can’t be too tough on ourselves.

Yes French kids are a lot better.

We've just come back from visiting family in France (we live in the UK) and my kids who seem pretty well behaved in England seemed pretty feral compared to their French cousins.

I've had an existential crisis on whether I'm failing as a mum. Their cousins are amazing. Sweet, caring, calm, happy and always well behaved. I just don't know how to fix it despite having grown up in France.

I also felt bad as it seemed I was constantly telling my kids off while we were there so they wouldn't stand out too much...

My DC would and did similar swimming stuff at that age but they had been for lessons since they were toddlers and also swam with DH in rivers/lochs etc. Food wise not so much.. DS1 would eat any seafood or meat but won't touch vegetables and DS2 was a fussy bugger. Pretty good behaviour but could also fight like cat and dog sometimes. Having holidayed in a lot of European countries I think kids are mostly kids and you get a mixture. Exception is probably The Netherlands where most kids we encountered there (and also when we were in other countries) have been singularly the worst behaved kids I've ever encountered. We might have been unlucky though.

Yes, absolutely this

I wonder what the impact is of slightly longer daylight in the winter in the afternoon is on children (and indeed adults). I have visited Paris and northern France in winter time and certainly notice the difference.

How many times have you been hit in the head in swimming pools?

I absolutely adore France, and I do think there are differences in how children are brought up (the biggest one being what/ how children are fed at school which I think is overall much better in France) but a child saying 'thank you' is not one of them.

Yes they patent differently but there is a big difference between a 6 and 14 year old. My then 6 year old devoured bowls of mussels. My now 14 year old refuses to look at them

Yet so many French adults I encounter are anything but sweet and caring 😂What happens ?????

No disrespect to the French, but I'd say its far more likely you happened upon la creme. Because if ALL French kids are like this, what could be happening over the next decade to change them from this level of all round excellence to a become part of an ordinary population of adults, much like our own? Would you not suppose the French would be world leaders in absolutely every single thing, from swimming to bravery, manners to conversational skills, world renowned for their cheerfulness and stoicism etc, if they were all raising such superior people?

I would imagine those kids have grown up somewhere in the south of France, swimming since they were tiny and eating seafood as the norm. We have a caravan in France and I can confirm that some of them are delightful, and some are not. The starkest difference to me is that they are parented more, and not left to run ferral.

How many times have you been hit in the head in swimming pools?

More times than I can remember! It seems to be an occupational hazard of family holidays in places with pools.

a child saying 'thank you' is not one of them.

My point was that the not-much-elder sister was reminding her little sister about manners.

I can only think of a train journey I once took. Long journey, in two close seats, a parent with an English child, another parent and French child. The English child was a little sod, misbehaving, loud, banging on seats of other passengers. Parent totally oblivious, hardly paying attention to child, huge sigh of relief in carriage when he got off. French child? Books to read with parent, spotting things out of windows, quiet, well behaved, extremely well parented.

I see research has got English children of 15 bottom of the list (again) in terms of happiness, anxiety, etc….No great surprise to be honest.

There’s lots to admire about French parenting, and the books do reflect that. French children series worth reading.

However, they are far stricter and smack more. There is a coldness and a distance in sone families that feels Victorian. The education system involves more rote learning and more discipline. Mealtimes are more old fashioned (seen and not heard). Peer pressure is huge and girls’ weight often commented on.

I’d say it’s like a 1950s childhood in some ways. But it depends on the family. A lefty left bank faniky less so.

My experience of French children on long distance trains is the same as yours.

I think there is:

• more social pressure in France on children behaving in public places. I think screaming kids running wild in restaurants, cafes, trains and in public in general while parents just look on is a very British thing...

• better discipline in most schools

• better diets which I think definitely has an impact on behaviour.

Let's remember as well that the French state tend to spend more money on health, social care and schools than the UK does.

After enduring my kids this summer, I'm all for stricter parents.

I could not believe how ungrateful and petulant (what I thought my usually well behaved DC) were when we were away. Whining about being bored, whining about visiting cities, whining about going to the beach. It was dreadful.

I came to the conclusion that what I thought were well behaved kids was in fact just my very obviously low measurement bar which more far more apparent when the kids are not in the their usual environment.

I think many of us are so used to our own kids and as parents are programmed to see their good sides, that we don't realise how poor their behaviour is at times.

I often thought there was a big difference between children who are brought up with full access to nature and a rural environment in comparison to kids who are brought up in suburbs and cities, but having seen my friend's kids in a rural environment, who behave very similarly to my own kids, I don't believe this anymore.

I think parenting styles are the main factor.

You must be very unfortunate because it has never happened to me!

Don't older siblings love to tell their younger ones what to do? I know my nieces and nephews are much more likely to remind their siblings to say please and thank you than they are to do it themselves. It's really not a French trait.

I don’t particularly want ‘tough’ kids to be honest. Or tough people in my life at all. Not for me.