To call out friend on 'body positivity' delusion?

[treesandflowers95]

My bestie (i'll call her 'J') and I have been friends since primary school. She's godmother to my DD and we almost see each other as sisters as friends.

J has always been a curvier girl but as we've gone through our 20s, she's steadily put on more and more weight. She's 5ft 2 and now a size 30. Over the last couple of years its been noticeable how much into the 'body positivity' movement shes got. Her socials are full of shared posts about it, and she'll often bring it up in conversation.

Its not something i've ever really made an issue of with her before as though it worries me for her, i've always been of the view that everybody's body is their own business.

However we were on a hen do a few weeks ago, and honestly it was a real eye opener to just how big she's got and the impact that's starting to have on her health. The first one for me was that she needed a seatbelt extender on the flight and she seemed to think it was hilarious. We stayed in a villa on the edge of a little area with a strip of bars and restaurants. It was 350yds (i put it into Google maps) and slightly downhill on the way there and uphill on the way back, but nothing major. J was struggling to keep up with us on the way there, and on the way back was having to stop at least once because she was so out of breath. Bear in mind this was a group of girls quite a few in heels etc so its not like we were sprinting, and shes sweating and bright red. Aside from that, even basic stuff round the villa like walking upstairs (it was over 3 floors) and she struggled climbing up and down the ladders in and out of the pool. I didnt say anything to her at the time but its played on my mind.

This weekend there were four of us (all close friends) who'd been on the hen do out for drinks in the pub. We were talking about the hen do and i can't remember how it came up, but she started talking about the walk back to the villa and how steep the hill was etc. I said to her something along the lines of 'Oh it wasn't that bad' to which she replied 'Are you joking, it was so steep!' and was basically trying to get the other girls to agree and I just left it.

A bit later in the conversation she was talking about some body positivity stuff and how its about how you look after yourself and not how much you weigh. I've bit my tongue at stuff like this loads of times, but this time i said 'I think that's true to an extent but there's a point where you can't argue that you're healthy'. She didn't look happy and said 'what are you saying?'. I basically said that the fact she thought that walk on holiday was so difficult that she should have struggled with it so much was worrying, and might suggest her health wasn't as good as she seems to think it is. The reality is (and I didn't say this to her) that she eats really badly and drinks quite a lot. She spends loads on hair, make up, nails, etc which she considers as looking after herself.

She got really frosty with me, and has been funny in texts since, not her usual self, so i know i've annoyed her.

Fully accept it may not have been the best way to bring it up especially in front of others (but it wasnt like it was strangers, we're all mates back to primary school) but i just felt like it wasn't a time where i could just say nothing in the moment.

So i guess question is AIBU to have brought this up with her, and any advice on how to handle things next.

She almost certainly does not believe she is healthy. You simply can't be at that height and size. But I honestly don't think anything you say will really help. If she wanted to lose weight it may well be really difficult for her. She's almost certainly suffering from an addiction.
I think you should basically just explain you're sorry if what you said was hurtful, but it comes from a place of love and concern for her health.
Then after that I'd say just leave the subject. If she's got any sense she'll stop going on about this 'body positivity' stuff in front of you as you clearly don't buy it. But I certainly wouldn't want to lose her friendship over it.

I think in this case it was fine to pull someone up about their health if they are claiming that something was hard to do because of their weight because she raised the issue in the first place.

But now you have done it you need to keep quiet. If she isn’t prepared to listen to the truth from an old friend then she isn’t ready to listen to the truth, let’s hope it’s not too long before the penny drops and she realises how dangerous her lifestyle is.

Now this is interesting. I agree, but wouldn´t you also agree that short shrift would not actually stop the person having Special Brew for breakfast? Why are they drinking it? Addiction? Drowning emotional issues? Because it makes them temporarily feel good? Same can be said for food and the benefits the person gains (however much harm is done at the same time) will nine times out of ten outweigh any concern someone else feels about the behaviour.

I think the problem here is that you’re doubling down because you think you’re “right” and therefore justified in your actions.

No one is advocating for being a size 30, and no one thinks being obese is preferable to being a more optimal weight for your height, but ultimately this is your friend, and you know you’ve hurt her feelings.

It’s not about who’s right, it’s about how the situation was handled. I would be really really surprised if your friend hasn’t spent years trying to lose weight, feels hopeless about it and unable to do so, and therefore feels that she has no option but to adopt body positivity to attempt to feel good about herself.

One of the most difficult parts of losing weight is finding the confidence and self-belief to do so. You have probably put her ten steps back by shaming her. If you want to be a friend, apologise and do what you can to support her - even if that is keeping your opinions to yourself!

Maybe the timing wasn't ideal but it sounds like it came up naturally rather than you choosing to bring it up in front of others for maximum hurt (which is what some PPs seem to be insinuating).

Maybe this will be the push she needs to realise that she can't keep explaining things away as being anything other than weight-related or maybe she's so entrenched in her thinking that it will make no difference. Or maybe she'll fall somewhere between the two and fade you out because you've pointed out the elephant in the room and she wants to get back to ignoring it.

Either way, you shouldn't have to play along with her delusions.

And YY to the "body positive" movement having a lot to answer for. Sure, make people realise that their body is worth looking after regardless of their starting point. But all this "I can be healthy at a size 30" is ridiculous.

I am a similar size to your friend, @treesandflowers95, and I would guess she does know that her weight is not healthy. She isn't deluding herself about it, she is trying to make herself feel better about it.

On the wider subject of body positivity - I think it is a complex issue. Speaking personally, I know that one of the biggest reasons that I struggle to look after myself (dieting to lose weight) is that I hate myself, and despise myself for my weakness, lack of will power, weight gain etc - and when you don't like someone even a little bit, it is very hard to care enough about them to look after them properly - if that makes sense.

So anything that makes me feel worse about myself, makes it harder for me to care for myself enough to take any of the steps that will help me. I used to have a friend who basically said it was absolutely fair that I didn't have a big range of nice clothes to choose from because of my weight - because that might spur me to lose some weight - but all it did was make me feel even more unattractive and unlovable, and less likely to look after myself.

But equally, blind acceptance that being very overweight is absolutely fine and to be celebrated isn't the best message either.

True, but like alcoholics overweight people have huge life changing long term, sometimes fatal health issues, affecting both them, their familes and eventually the wider population who end up funding their care, health conditions which by and large are avoidable.

Perhaps she’s a tad peeved that you said all this when you had an audience of fellow perfect figured women. If you’re gonna call people out you do it in private. If she’s happy with her size who is anyone to tell her otherwise, it’s her body and her health.

I feel that the body positivity movement can actually be really damaging in instances like this where people bury their heads in the sand and/or are made to feel like something is wrong with them if they don’t wholeheartedly love their bodies. But I don’t think calling her out in the group was the way to do it, it never ends well. Deep down she’ll know that she’s messing her body up but blind positivity and support is currently the only socially acceptable way to behave in many things at the moment, anyone who deviates is seen as shaming or phobic. Pick your battles, it’s probably not worth it sadly.

I personally would never have said it because its not my place to hurt someone or embarrass them. You're correct in your thoughts, but I wouldnt have vocalised them. Even worse in front of people. I'm sure she knows herself how much she struggles and how much she can't get around the place very well in comparison to the rest of you.

I don't think you were unreasonable at all.

She brought it up and you were honest with her. Part of loving a person is being concerned about them and being honest about something that's harming them. I also think you said it as kindly as possible.

Be patient with her now and support her efforts if she needs you to once she gets over the hurt and into action (probably).

If she mentions it again or brings up the fact you upset her, OP, I’d apologise for upsetting her and say you’re worried about her health and, although you understand it did upset her, you care about her too much to not say anything. Then say you’re happy to support her in improving her health and in finding the right support mechanisms for her as an individual.

Leave it at that and hopefully the thought will grow in her and she’ll seek help.

I think you were fine to say what you did. You didn’t bring it up out of blue she raised her difficulty with walking and looking after self.
I can see why holiday would have brought things to a head. I had similar on a weekend break. We usually socialise sitting in house. It wasn’t nice to see impact on them - couldn’t walk, needing painkillers, lots of sitting not exploring. Gave me a real jolt as I didn’t realise how restricted they were.

A size 30?!?!

I don’t ever think I’ve seen that? Where does she get her clothes?!??

Lots of health issues are unavoidable and cost money to treat.

@Cerealkiller4U Oh give over, you can buy size 30 clothes at loads of places.

Sometimes we need to hear certain things said out loud to us to give us the push to change.
OPs friend obviously knows she isn’t a healthy weight and it sounds like she is burying her head in the sand and using the body positivity movement to justify her weight.
Of course everyone should love themselves no matter what size they are but if we truly love ourselves it also means we work hard on self improvement, not ignoring the problem and letting it get out of hand.
I don’t believe OP has done anything wrong, her friend repeatedly brought it up and OP was honest with her. I understand it’s a tricky situation and I don’t think there is a right way to deal with it, if we sit by and say nothing in situations like this then we are just allowing our loved ones to self destruct, not everyone is able to find the will power to make healthy choices or see where they are going wrong by themselves.

I never said anything about "perfect figured women"! I'm a size 12-14 and the other girls is a 16. None of us are supermodels (and theres nothing wrong with that!)

I could never imagine bringing up such a sensitive matter in the confrontational way you did with my best friends for years.

There are so many ways you could have shown genuine concern and help.

Let's be honest, all these "body positivity!" girls who are massively overweight, are the exact people who AREN'T in love with their bodies, but are trying to justify it to themselves.

The thing is, EVERYONE knows it's not healthy to be a size 30. It just isn't.

I have a very similar friend (I wonder if she's the same one?) We've known her since Year 7 and she's always been a big girl. She did lose loads in her early 20s and was almost unrecognisable, but now she's a size 30 at least. And is no height, so she's almost spherical. But she does take real care of herself. Hair, skin, nails, make-up, clothes are always lovely and perfect. She's got a beautiful personality as well, and is the loveliest person.
But I've never ever mentioned her weight to her. Because she doesn't need me to tell her. Mirrors, scales and doctors can do that.

While you weren't wrong per se to express your worries about her weight, doing it in front of a group of others, albeit friends, was badly timed.

The general rule I stick to, is that unless someone asks for my opinion on their body size, clothes, hair, anything, then I won't say a word unless it's to compliment them.
So with my big friend, the only comments I make are "Oh, your nails are cute!" Or "Those shoes are fantastic!"

It shows you care about her that you are worrying about what said.
Maybe have a coffee 1-1 and explain you didn’t mean to upset her but you could see how much she struggled on holiday and are worried about her and take it from there.

I think that this is a good approach.

It’s a tricky one but on balance I’d like to think you were right to say something because she keeps bringing the topic up. And also because this isn’t just someone carrying a few extra stone, this is very extreme - she sounds over twice her recommended body weight if she’s heavier than 21 stone and the health risks are massive. I’m the same height and when I was her age I was about 9 stone.

I’d be really worried about her and would make clear to her I wasn’t going to go on about it but I just wanted to let her know I had my concerns and I’d be there for her if she needed any help. I suspect there’s some underlying issues.

If she knew she had an issue that’s different, I’d say nothing in that case unless she asked for advice.

But I think in this situation it’s especially worrying she’s increasingly deluding herself that she’s healthy and she keeps bringing this topic up of her version of “body positivity” to try and get everyone on board to validate her choices .I think when you constantly bring up a topic with your friends you are effectively opening up a topic up for debate.

As you’ve said yourself - it wasn’t the right time to do it though. One on one would’ve been much better. But I don’t think what you actually said was wrong.

I’m 5ft 2 and right now I’m a size 10/12 but a few years ago I was a size 16 which really shocked me. I was on holiday with some friends and found myself struggling badly walking up a hill while they both were fine. As someone who was a sporty kid and had been active most of my life going to the gym, walking lots (as I’ve never had a car) this was very worrying to me. It was during the pandemic and I’d just became so sedentary and coupled with my eating habits my weight rocketed. That was one of the incidents that actually triggered my weight loss journey.

I think that you framed it as being concerned for her health rather than trying to shame her, and why shouldn't you be concerned? If she was drinking heavily or taking drugs or had another eating disorder like bulimia or anorexia, or had obvious mental health issues, you wouldn't be told you should leave her to sort herself out.

A friend of mine told me I was overweight, not healthy and didn't look great. I lost two stone and was thankful they were honest.