To call out friend on 'body positivity' delusion?

[treesandflowers95]

My bestie (i'll call her 'J') and I have been friends since primary school. She's godmother to my DD and we almost see each other as sisters as friends.

J has always been a curvier girl but as we've gone through our 20s, she's steadily put on more and more weight. She's 5ft 2 and now a size 30. Over the last couple of years its been noticeable how much into the 'body positivity' movement shes got. Her socials are full of shared posts about it, and she'll often bring it up in conversation.

Its not something i've ever really made an issue of with her before as though it worries me for her, i've always been of the view that everybody's body is their own business.

However we were on a hen do a few weeks ago, and honestly it was a real eye opener to just how big she's got and the impact that's starting to have on her health. The first one for me was that she needed a seatbelt extender on the flight and she seemed to think it was hilarious. We stayed in a villa on the edge of a little area with a strip of bars and restaurants. It was 350yds (i put it into Google maps) and slightly downhill on the way there and uphill on the way back, but nothing major. J was struggling to keep up with us on the way there, and on the way back was having to stop at least once because she was so out of breath. Bear in mind this was a group of girls quite a few in heels etc so its not like we were sprinting, and shes sweating and bright red. Aside from that, even basic stuff round the villa like walking upstairs (it was over 3 floors) and she struggled climbing up and down the ladders in and out of the pool. I didnt say anything to her at the time but its played on my mind.

This weekend there were four of us (all close friends) who'd been on the hen do out for drinks in the pub. We were talking about the hen do and i can't remember how it came up, but she started talking about the walk back to the villa and how steep the hill was etc. I said to her something along the lines of 'Oh it wasn't that bad' to which she replied 'Are you joking, it was so steep!' and was basically trying to get the other girls to agree and I just left it.

A bit later in the conversation she was talking about some body positivity stuff and how its about how you look after yourself and not how much you weigh. I've bit my tongue at stuff like this loads of times, but this time i said 'I think that's true to an extent but there's a point where you can't argue that you're healthy'. She didn't look happy and said 'what are you saying?'. I basically said that the fact she thought that walk on holiday was so difficult that she should have struggled with it so much was worrying, and might suggest her health wasn't as good as she seems to think it is. The reality is (and I didn't say this to her) that she eats really badly and drinks quite a lot. She spends loads on hair, make up, nails, etc which she considers as looking after herself.

She got really frosty with me, and has been funny in texts since, not her usual self, so i know i've annoyed her.

Fully accept it may not have been the best way to bring it up especially in front of others (but it wasnt like it was strangers, we're all mates back to primary school) but i just felt like it wasn't a time where i could just say nothing in the moment.

So i guess question is AIBU to have brought this up with her, and any advice on how to handle things next.

For many people anorexia absolutely does carry the same stigma as being overweight. In a professional capacity I knew one family who were so ashamed of their child's AN they told people that the DC had cancer.

In diagnosed cases, of diseases we are aware of. There seems to be zero mention of mental health illnesses at play from what I can see, or how many (I'm willing to bet rather a lot) go undiagnosed, either, precisely due to society's, and the medical professions attitudes to obesity.

Then again, I'd not be using Mayo Clinic as a proper research resource, myself.

Very true, nor you see many older people of that size, they die before going really old

@HRCsMumma
There’s more than physiological medical factors, mental health and psychological issues, reduced mobility, career induced sedentary living, deprivation, access to fresh foods, isolation and other geographical factors.

Also not mentioned there is endocrine conditions affecting hunger regulation. That’s the reason semiglutide injectables are so effectivr for people who are obese. Obviously not choosing to be, but have bodies made differently - and hungrier!

as @GedEye has mentions genetic predisposition and there’s also epigenetic markers.

So 5% attributed medical conditions doesn’t mean the rest are just choosing obesity. Reductive.

I suspect most friends and loved ones would be keen to help them access support and help, would people really be saying- but you look great, nothing to worry about here you can be anorexic and healthy xoxo

For someone who is morbidly obese accepting they are overweight and have a problem is the first hurdle, burying head in the sand and believing fantasy about being healthy at a size 30 is not good. Of course many need support and formal help.

Okay but regardless, someone who is 5ft and a size 30 needs professional help, whether it's genetic or not who cares? If someone keeps bringing stuff up in conversation for reassurance that they're fine ie about the hill it's not nice for others to lie to feed into their false narrative and delusion.

@SpeakfromExperience The Mayo Clinic is ranked the #1 hospital in the world. Full disclosure that I’ve been there, it’s amazing.

As a patient or are you a researcher/clinician?

I care. The blaming assertion that obesity is a conscious choice made by 95% of people who are obese is simply not true.

They only ‘need’ professional help when they opt for it. Same as chronic smoker, drinker, or loner. That’s it.

No one has to lie. They can stay silent or disagree without making it personal, unlike what the OP did. She could have just said ‘No, the hill was fine for me’.

Neither, I have relatives who’ve been treated there and know a doctor who works there. I’ve only visited.

I'm not pretending to be an expert, I simply meant that it’s an extremely reputable resource. People come from all over the globe to be treated there. I can understand why @HRCsMumma quoted from their website.

It’s not a journal, though.

And it’s choosing but one statistic to suit narrative, and not telling you the parameters by which it’s judged the 5% which is why people have mentioned other factors which may contribute to obesity.

@Thatcat Agreed.

It’s been a while, but there’s always another fat bashing thread! And here it is. (Obviously not all posters of course).

Definitely not unreasonable. All this body positivity stuff has gone too far and I say that as someone overweight. I’m not a size 30, nowhere near but cholesterol is sky high. It was a real wake up call for me . My daughter is 18 and I’ve noticed most of her friends are very overweight but don’t seem to care.

And if people have psychological/emotional issues which have led to a complex relationship with food (i.e an eating disorder), is that just an excuse?

People who are putting their body under immense strain because their addiction to food is out of control do need help, whether they chose to try and access it is down to them, but it doesnt mean others shouldnt dare be honest when asked. This isn't being a bit overweight, this isn't about how someone looks, or whether it matters why- but OP wasn't unreasonable to be honest. Someone carrying out that much weight will find walking a struggle, it wasn't the fact the hill was challenging, it was down to the fact her organs are working substantially harder to keep her alive, her muscles & joints are being put under constant pressure even when not being exerted much.

It’s their choice to seek help if they feel they need it. In the meantime, it’s no one else’s business.

OP wasn’t asked to comment on the person’s health and weight.

This is a weird way to argue.

It's not that people choose to be obese as such. People choose - for all kinds of complicated reasons, to do the things that cause obesity. And the only way out is to choose differently.

There are a ton of psychological tricks we can play on ourselves to allow us to avoid making that kind of choice, or even facing making that kind of choice: Oh, one more drink won't hurt, it's not a hard drug, being fat isn't the same as being unhealthy.

No one here would affirm that kind of delusion in a close friend who was an addict.

No, but there are way way more obese people than there were even 50 years ago. It seems very unlikely genetics is the cause of that. To some extent other illnesses which have increased might be a factor, but lifestyle seems much more likely (and the cause of some of those other illnesses too.)

Genetics would be the cause for some, but I agree with you re: generational changes with food, technology and activity etc.

Her friend was harping on about weight not dictating health, it doesn't sound like OP brought it up out of the blue, but was instead honouring her decisions with the truth.

It's all fine if you're a bit overweight but being morbidly obese and doing no exercise is not

How about somebody who was previously 3 stone overweight, but has now lost 1.5 stone? Are they allowed to feel positive about the weight that they have lost so far? Or should they still feel shame about being overweight?
When should they stop wearing baggy t shirts to exercise and start wearing proper exercise gear, even if it is in plus sizes that "normalise" obesity? When should they graduate from home exercise videos to exercising in public? When should they graduate from black baggy tops to attractive clothes?

Best post in the thread IMO.

Not when it comes to morbid obesity. It is not possible to be morbidly obese and be in good health. You can certainly be healthy and be overweight, but if you keep gaining there is a point where health problems are inevitable.