to think you don't leave your kids in a shop unattended?

[Misthios]

You;d have thought it obvious but clearly not. DD has a summer job working in a shop in a large shopping mall. The name/brand of the shop is unimportant but it's the sort of place which primarily sells stock appealing to under 10s. Sort of like Claire's Accessories / Build A Bear but not - independent place. Anyway, DD has said that at least once a shift she comes across small children who have been left in the shop while the adult they are with goes to the loo, or into the clothes shop next door Or children who come in saying "mum says she'll be here in a minute" and 20 minutes later they are still there.

These are 5/6/7/8 year olds. DD was quite shocked and asked me if this was normal - whether I'd ever left her or her brother in a shop when I went to the loo or elsewhere. I said it wouldn't have ever occurred to me - if I needed the loo when I was out shopping, they would come too. The only time would be somewhere like soft play if there was someone I vaguely recognised from school who I'd ask to keep an eye open for 2 minutes while I grabbed a coffee or whatever.

Why do parents think this is OK? I'm not a paedophile lurking around every corner parent who worries about every scenario but DD's employer is not running a creche, and it would be so easy for a 6 year old to wander off, hurt themselves, or just get upset wondering why mum/dad wasn't back yet.

Madness. Don't imagine anyone will admit to dumping their child in a shop but would be really interested to hear the rationale if anyone will own up to having done it.

DD loves being left at the library to choose a book. I'd rather leave her a shop frankly - way too many dodgy looking old men in libraries I find. I worry less about her being snatched than I do about her being groped or having inappropriate things said to her.

Happens a lot unfortunately. Years ago I worked in a large mall in a busy shop. One Saturday afternoon the fire alarm went off and the mall was evacuated. We had a small big, probably about 6 years old, on his own, said Mum had bought him some Lego and told him to wait while she had her hair done. We handed him over to the police. When the mall reopened Mum went ballastic at us for not looking after him

Also I work in a library we wouldn't allow children under 10 unaccompanied

Children are encouraged are warmly welcomed to libraries where I live.

I still think that’s reasonable though. My kids don’t as we are rural and they need to be chauffeured everywhere but I spent entire summer holidays quietly reading in a corner of my library as a child. Libraries seem very welcoming nowadays lots of brightly coloured beanbags, more variety of reading materials (one of mine likes manga) 3d printing, lego building sessions. The library was always a safe space when I was a child growing up in a rough neighbourhood. I think it’s lovely to see them welcoming children in.

But if a kid of 8 or 9 went in by themselves, sat down quietly in a corner, found a book, and read it, would that be an issue? Obviously if the child is running around or behaving badly that is not an acceptable use of the library, but many children of that age are perfectly capable of identifying a suitable book and a quiet space to read it without their parents’ help. Why would having their library card with them make that a more acceptable use of the space?

Of course there's no problem with that!

But in our library it was kids that were as young as 5 and also children that did not really want to be at the library but were dropped off there regardless. So they were at the library without aim or means of escape. And of course they then get bored. Which is not the kids fault.

My sister used to work at a forecourt/convenience shop near a primary school.

They had a boy of around 7-8 years old who would regularly come in alone after school, hang round for a while, then get collected by a parent.

It was obvious that there was some sort of clash with school and work finishing, and the boy had been instructed to hang out in the shop so he wouldn't be alone while waiting for his parents.

The parents were basically relying on minimum wage shop workers to regularly keep an eye on their kid without ever saying a word to them about it.

I wouldn't leave an under 8 alone in a shop. I would let a 10year old but make sure I wasn't too far away.
I think I'm quite laid back but am taken aback by some of the responses on here

I completely disagree with this. They're not relying on anyone. They're doing what we all do which is tell our children they're safer in places with lots of people. It's a risk assessment, not an expectation that people will look after my child. It's a lot easier for some dodgy guy to pull over on a quiet road and bundle my 8 year old into a car than it is for the same dodgy guy to grab her while she's sitting in the middle of a foodcourt filled with people and families.

Spectacularly unfair and inappropriate. He was a toddler, not school age and his mum let go of his hand to pay, she did not leave him alone to entertain himself. Let's not victim blame here.

Same but they need to be with a carer

@Nadeed if parents bring children and go to leave we explain that our safeguarding policy is 10+ unaccompanied, if a child under 10 (obviously unless we know them this is only a estimate ) walked in alone we would ask where their parents were and safeguard if needed.

Libraries are amazing places we support the homeless community, the elderly , people who are lonely/have mh issues and of course children. But staff are not dbs checked, nor can they vouch for customers. Plus we are not a crèche, if I'm running a craft group or a story time for 15 kids I can't have parents leaving their children as I am not in a position to be responsible for them nor should I have to be.

And what makes the kid less likely to be grabbed in the shop? The staff being there to intervene, right? So the parents were indeed relying on them.

I have said YANBU op that in my vote. My now 11 year old daughter started being allowed to browse in a few shops at age 10 for a short amount of time and shops were carefully chosen. Maximum of 10/15 minutes. She is pretty sensible but I wouldn’t have felt comfortable before 10.

No, in fact, it's more likely to be other families/customers. But even if it is, no one is saying shop assistants have to actively look out for them.

But it's not about intervention. It's about the fact that they're less likely to be the need for intervention in the first place!

I tell DS, who is 13, that he can go to the skate park during the day when the playground next door has lots of families etc as that tends to somewhat deter the rougher types who come to the skatepark. But once it gets a bit later, and all those people have gone, that deterrent goes away.

I'm not relying on other families to look out for DS, but I am basing my decision making on an awareness that there's less likely to be trouble from slightly older teenagers when there are a bunch of adults in the area.

Just like, as a woman, when I'm on my way home during the day, I quite happily take the little pedestrian lane - it's full daylight, people are around etc. But when I come home late at night, i take the longer route so that I can stay on the main roads with proper lighting. This is risk assessment 101.

The comments re james.bulger are so inappropriate. He was younger, and the situation was completely different. And while I would not suggest risks have gone away, if your big argument for children not being safe is a case of a 2 year old from years ago, your argument is pretty weak.

Sensible children in a shop do not need to be "watched" by shop assistants. That's just your own paranoia. Obviously, young children who can't be trusted to behave or who are too young to know to wait or who can't communicate effectively would be a bad idea.

A child if 5 or 6 is nursery going to reception/ year 1 they definitely do not have capacity to look out for themselves many are still in nappies because nobody has trained them (not just ND).

5 is not far off of a 2 year old I know I've worked with them for years ...they are actually closer to 2 now than they were 10 years ago many unable to use a toilet or a knife and fork or understand concepts of ownership or sharing.

When I lived in Berlin you would see 5 year olds travelling to school alone.
And at one time you did not have children in nappies at school.

5 is more than DOUBLE the age of a 2 year old? They are completely different.

Having said that, I wouldn't leave a 5 year old in a shop either - very unlikely to be able to handle even the smallest issue - but to say that a 5 year old and a 2 year old are similar is ridiculous.

Er no, his mum was in the butchers shop in the Bootle shopping centre, she had hold his hand, let it go to get her purse out and pay, by the time she looked up he'd gone, he'd walked out of the shoo and gone left she panicked left the shop and went immediately right. She did not leave him unattended.

The boys were sciving off school and had already attempted to lure a little girl away from their mother. They lured Jamie away from his mother, left him away through a large shop that had 2 floors,the upper floor had an outdoor entrance/exit so Denise quickly lost sight of Jamie.

On another note, parents should look after and supervise their children...none of this leaving 5/6/7/8/9 year olds alone in shops ect..look after your children..if God forbid something happened, you saying you thought it was ok to leave them unsupervised won't be a good reason. There are dangerous people in the world, just waiting for an opportunity. Most sex offenders are not in prison, they are in society and only go to the police station weekly to sign the sex offenders register. Most aren't being managed. If you truly knew the scale, you wouldn't be so Blaise.

It's not the responsibility of retail staff to do your job of parenting.. remember a child can't be left home alone until 12, making their own way to school from 9/10.

I think 5 year olds in terms of independence today often are like 2 year olds in the past.

Then in the event their child is injured or worse can we assume they would accept responsibility or would it be a nice little earner and a 1/10 sad face picture in the papers?

Mine are early 20s now, but when they were 8 I would give them some money to go along the road to Woollies whilst I sat and had a coffee in a shop with my mum.

It does seem these days that you can't even think about doing stuff like that until they are about 14.

I'm not sure he was, wasn't he with his mother who was distracted by what she was doing when he was enticed away?