It’s becoming unfashionable to have kids

[Housebuyingfamily]

Birth rates are on the floor which people frame as, people would have more kids were it not for the cost of them or climate change, etc etc. But I feel like it’s now more than this. As if we have a global child-free culture that’s growing every day and it’s becoming increasingly “unfashionable” to have kids, even looked down upon.

Er no, the vast majority of people procreate. Sadly.

@TempsPerdu I really disagree. Our parks all have large playgrounds and space for ball games, but no flower planting for adults. They are very geared towards children. Libraries have all been resigned to make them more welcoming for children. Maternity leave far longer than it used to be. Spaces on buses for buggies. Most community events are family days with lots for children. Flexi time working. Our society is more child friendly than it was in the past.

What has really changed is that adults now have the choice whether to have children or not. And some are choosing not to. The estimates are that 80% will still have children.

😂Savage

There are more bloody dogs than kids here on the Isle of Wight.
I like dogs but there are way too many.

Well, I see plenty of kids and babies around so, no, it's not like people have given up.

I don't have kids. If I'd been this age 30 years ago, I'm sure I would – because it seemed so much easier then.

Parent life today looks bloody miserable to me. The cost, the ever-increasing levels of mental health issues, social media, shit schools, other people's crap parenting, social media, the expectation that you need to either amuse them constantly or give them screens to keep them busy... no. No thanks.

I’m imagining myself as a gummy, screaming thing in my old age, feels apt.

It defies logic that anyone would think women had children for financial gain, other than your examples. Weird mentality, and the figures don’t add up, if you’re struggling financially having a baby won’t solve that and part of the premise of this thread.

My pets are more subjectively more important to me than someone else’s kids. Same way my husband is, the same way my parents are.

I agree, @Nadeed, the global population does need to fall and it’s really important that today’s under-40’s focus on developing the technology to perform some of today’s human tasks.

A couple of weeks ago, there was a thread about the difficulties of finding an NHS dentist. Although this is mainly down to money, which the current government hopes to alleviate, a dentist on the thread also pointed out that large numbers of dentists are close to retirement age. So even with more money available, finding a practicing dentist won’t be particularly easy.

I think there’s a rocky few years ahead until tech can perform certain functions.

@Usercyzabc

You would have to be unbelievably intellectually challenged to think having a baby would enhance your finances. I don’t believe anyone does it for this reason alone. To bump up their position in a housing queue maybe but for extra benefits? No. Particularly not nowadays.

I think when women with poor financial circumstances choose to have babies it’s probably more to do with the sorts of career and educational choices which are presented to them (ie none) and the role models in their family.

If you can’t see it you can’t be it etc. if young women don’t see options open to them other than motherhood and no one supports them in doing anything better than having loads of kids young it’s hardly surprising that they can’t imagine much more.

I think parenting has been made to be harder, by placing more emphasis on creating perfect childhoods.

Motherhood was fetishised by middle class Victorians with all that angel at the hearth bollocks, designed to keep us in our rightful place. Most women had kids because they couldn't really not, then just had to find a way of keeping them alive.

My grandmothers' lives were hard because they were having to work, whilst having children. They didn't have careers, but every penny counted. Neighbours, mil and older children were enlisted to help. I suspect neither of them would have had so many children I'd they could have avoided it.

My mum was able to be more hands on, at the expense of a decent job. I suspect she had children because it was expected, then just had to make the most of it. But it was 80s parenting, so we were still left to our own devices a lot.

Ignoring the financials for a minute, I think a lot of people are put off parenting because they think it has to be very hands on. I want fully sure with dc1, but I very I unexpectedly felt a massive urge to have a dc2. Like, all consuming need to get pregnant which i didn't expect.

I've adopted a more 80s and 90s style with my own, mainly because I've worked ft throughout, so I've been unable to put my life on hold for them.

Perhaps, but I think once their 30s hit and the old biological clock starts ticking, most women will start yearning for children, and will have them if circumstances allow, fashion or not. The desire to procreate is to deeply entrenched in our beings to be influenced by fashion.

This has made me think quite a bit about the move towards people treating pets almost as though they are children. I have pets myself and they are a part of the family but I do not treat them as children. I have however noticed a trend towards this in my local community. I mentioned earlier that I live in a newly affluent part of a city and the number of people with dogs (and those who fawn over dogs) is enormous. I have also seen a fair few friends and family (who are either past or nearly past the age of having biological children - and who I therefore presume are not going to have children) become very pet-centric and it seems they are clearly driven to care deeply for another soul (which was not the case for those people in their younger years). I also hear them refer to themselves as Mummy or Daddy in relation to their pets. I don't think my parent's generation did this (and definitely not my grandparent's generation). I'm not saying there is anything inherently wrong with this but it's an interesting development!

I'm mid 30's and I've always known I didn't want children, I've never had this "urge" people talk about I don't dislike kids but I don't want to raise one. If I don't feel the urge or like my life would be enriched by one why would I have one? Hardly fair to raise a child if I didn't really want one in the first place and I just did it because it was the "normal" thing to do.

With the world the way it is at the moment I'm bloody glad I've never wanted kids.

I also find it bizarre how people always believe they are doing the world a favour by raising upstanding members of society that will contribute to the tax system and wipe my arse when I'm old and unable to. In the real world somebody will be raising the next generation of criminals, thugs, sex offenders and murderers too, nobody knows what their child will grow into. You had a child because you wanted one, not for the greater good.

Your thoughts on the subject are not borne out by the facts. The facts are that birth rates have been falling for some time, they are below replacement level and are continuing to fall.
This will result in population collapse.

Not in all of us, I've never felt a biological clock ticking or felt the slightest urge to procreate. It's much more complex than that.

Exacty, they have been falling since women were able to make a choice (in a more reliable way) about whether they want to become parents (ie the 60s)

That is no coincidence.

I also find it bizarre how people always believe they are doing the world a favour by raising upstanding members of society that will contribute to the tax system and wipe my arse when I'm old and unable to.

@BeansOnToast32 You’re not wrong, although the great thing about women having the choice whether or not to have children or not nowadays makes it far more likely that any child born today is wanted, doesn’t it?

My assumption would be that parents of a wanted child are more likely to try and bring them up as well as they can.

i know that if I’d been born in the “Call the Midwife” era and had six or seven children due to lack of contraception, I’d probably be too worn out to put much effort in!

These are probably the same people who think Kanye West is fashionable and sane.

If not for social media- People would do what they want without the pressure of the entire world's opinion screaming at them from whatever piece of technology they use. People need to break away and do what they want.

However, I haven't really noticed this. There have always been people who do not want children.

The whole premise of the thread.

I think this is why a lot of people are not bothering to have kids.

The pressure for parents, mainly women to constantly interact with their child these days is intense. People used to be more relaxed with their parenting, now anxiety is promoted, people are freaking out if their kid eats a chicken nugget, sits in front of a screen for an hour, isn’t being constantly ‘enriched’, kid can’t just chill, has to be taken to different activities every day.

Lots of youngsters see this and decide it’s not for them.

The current birth rate in England and Wales is 1.49 children per woman.

Actually my parents (who obviously had children, being my parents) have had dogs for fifty years, and always used to have large rescue dogs, which they trained properly and treated as dogs (and loved arguably more than their grandchildren... but still they trained them and mostly expected good, mostly dog appropriate behaviour).

A few years ago, following the death of their elderly, well behaved sheepdog type mixed breed they bought a small purebred dog from a breeder and slipped into the furbaby mentality - calling themselves mummy and daddy and not training the dog at all, and tolerating endless barking, jumping up, chewing furniture and possessions (including those of visitors) and even making excuses for nipping.

I think it is a social phenomenon but I'm not sure it's about childlessness as it seems common in their social circle of elderly people who are parents and grandparents and in some cases great grandparents... Their lives do revolve around the dogs, so they are definitely filling a void although they have adult children and grandchildren popping in every single day...

The term fur baby is awful!

Yes I agree with all of this. I think a lot of people are desperate to nurture and care for something. There is a huge trend now for treating pets like children. Near me, a local cafe has a meet Santa event for dogs...