To say the Olympics hates women

[ArabellaScott]

A child rapist performing for the Netherlands.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/olympics/article-13674293/Convicted-child-rapist-Steven-van-Velde-Netherlands-booed-volleyball-olympics.html

Males punching women in the face as sport.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/olympics/articles/cnd0drjr4jdo

Offensive caricatures of women everywhere.

https://glaad.org/french-drag-artists-made-history-as-first-in-drag-to-carry-the-olympic-torch/

For any reader who believes that any female person can have testosterone in the 'male range' please look at the charts in the linked tweet.

Plus

This is from a PCOS advocate on twitter.

PCOS raises female testosterone to up to 5.5 nmol/L (and above 4 can cause serious issues).
5-ARD raised Caster's testosterone to 21 nmol/L.

twitter.com/NathanielHart72/status/1550916276490477568?s=20&t=E8muLvV5kUEpbPeemz8zwQ

and

twitter.com/seaningle/status/1537480540068225031?s=20&t=E8muLvV5kUEpbPeemz8zwQ

Sean Ingle (Guardian sports journalist) mentioned this

The latest scientific publications clearly demonstrate that the return of markers of endurance capacity to "female level" occurs within six to eight months under low blood testosterone, while the awaited adaptations in muscle mass and muscle strength/power take much longer (two years minimum according to a recent study). Given the important role played by muscle strength and power in cycling performance, the UCI has decided to increase the transition period on low testosterone from 12 to 24 months. In addition, the UCI has decided to lower the maximum permitted plasma testosterone level (currently 5 mol/L) to 2.5 mol/L. This value corresponds to the maximum testosterone level found in 99.99% of the female population.

Plus

^https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1111/sms.14581^

The International Olympic Committee framework on fairness, inclusion and nondiscrimination on the basis of gender identity and sex variations does not protect fairness for female athletes

“In adulthood, circulating testosterone concentrations do not come close to overlapping between females (0.1–1.7 nmol/L) and males (7.7–29.4 nmol/L).”

plus with handy charts in the tweet

https://x.com/hoovlet/status/1819017510005407984

“Confirmed. No overlap in T levels between healthy men and women, and rarely in people with atypical levels”.

“Below I'll include some info from my book on T and sex diffs. First is an illustration of the combined data from a meta-analysis of studies on a healthy population (by David Handelsman), and another on T levels in ppl with medical conditions/DSDs (by Richard Clark). I've also included my text description of the data. The original illustration is from Doriane Coleman's excellent Sex in Sport article (link is in the graphic). She let me adapt it for my book but hers is clearer!”

If you are using the term 'woman with high testosterone', plus check your sources and don't spread misinformation. Female people with PCOS, women, DO NOT HAVE male levels of testosterone!

@Cookiecoop insults are. It allowed on MN. Reported.

Do some reading re DSD. This isn't about genitalia - many are not diagnosed until puberty.

I could read about DSD but it wouldn't necessarily tell me everything about AK. We have not been given an official diagnosis or explanation of any test results. It's all just speculation on here.

So how do you know AK has a vulva then?

But posting a picture of someone’s supposed genitals is? Gross.

On reflection you’re right. Shouldn’t have called you a that. Apologies.
It’s very close to home for me and it terrifies me how people who are just following their dreams can be bullied so much that it becomes acceptable to post pictures of them with an edited ‘bulge’ in their shorts. I really worry about the suicide rates for people who don’t fit in a neat male/female gender box.
Genuinely out of interest would you be okay with them calling themselves a woman outside of sport?

I think that YABU

The Dutch rapist - horrifying but that's on the Netherlands selection committee

The Boxing debacle - awful but it's two individuals in one sport (that doesn't really deserve the name sport, it's sanctioned violence) and one the Olympics are trying to get rid of anyway, aren't they?

The caricatures - not sure. Most people, including most women, seem to have no problem with drag and even celebrate it. I don't like it personally but most people, in my experience, would not define it as misogynistic. Though I think probably most of mumsnet would.

On the other side, this is the first year that participation has reached 50/50 male female participation in the games. Women's events are given equal air time, equal reporting and qual hype. BBC has called the 'flagship events' as the Women's All Around Artistic Gymnastics Final and the Women's 100m. Not the men's finals. There are inspirational women all over the TV doing exceptional things and I think that's something to celebrate. I don't see hate.

How can it be 50/50 when biological males are boxing in the female category?

Eh? That's 2 athletes out of 10,000. There aren't exactly the same numbers of men and women in each sport! There are no male rhythmic gymnastics or artistic swimmers and no female greco-roman wrestlers (if that's still a thing). But the overall total participation is 50/50 for the first time in history.

https://www.change.org/p/disqualify-convicted-child-rapist-steven-van-de-velde-from-the-olympics

But the overall total participation is 50/50 for the first time in history.

But we know that some males are being counted as females and none the other way round so it can't possibly in reality be 50/50 despite their claims. It's a disgrace.

EpicGem · Yesterday 11:52

The IBA could easily tell everyone what tests they did that the 2 boxers failed. They have consistently refused stating privacy concerns.

That's correct, it's confidential medical information, which cannot be released, without the consent of the protagonists.

These privacy concerns extend to the 2 boxers who haven't even been informed of the specifics of these "gender tests".

I'm not sure where you go that that from. Of course they know the basis and the results of the tests, which were carried out by a properly verified, independent laboratory. Khelife appealed to the CAS, but dropped it. Lin didn't even bother. Neither man had any hope of winning; the only logical deduction is that they showed up unambiguously and unarguably as male.

I think the world has gone bonkers in the last five years

To keep it safer for all involved.....can organisations like IOC, sporting bodies etc make it clear that all athletes need to undergo chromosomal testing ie cheek swab to compete?

If you're XX you go in the the female squad

If you have a Y chromosome then you go on the male /other squad

Takes all the histrionics out of the arena so to speak. The answer would be there in black and white

This would obviously be extremely difficult for those with DSD
.....but I'm not sure what else is a safer solution

For people saying that the boxer’s genetic make up makes the fight unfair, what about Michael Phelps with his webbed toes and joint hyper extension? Did his genetic make up cause his medals to be unfair?

I’m not trying to be a ‘what I reckon-er’, just adding to the debate.

In reality we know nothing about these boxers. It’s all supposition based on dodgy Russian testing.

There is female Greco Roman wrestling!

There is at least two on the Zambian football team as well. Both may well be expected to be excluded in the future if FIFA ever change their policy to exclude male athletes who have gone through male
puberty.

This is almost the only sensible response on the thread for me.
‘The Olympics’ doesn’t hate anyone as it’s not sentient. It’s made up of all sorts of sports governing bodies and participation is decided in each of the countries involved. Many, many inspirational women are showing how strong and capable women are.
Are there some very, very dodgy discussions here and there? Yes, but you’ve cited 2 sports out of everything involved, and a judgement on part of what was presented in the opening ceremony (what about the women involved in that? Celine? Lady GaGa? The woman riding the horse? The women carrying the torch?)
To say ‘The Olympics’ hates women is just a bit daft and dramatic.

@Cookiecoop
But posting a picture of someone’s supposed genitals is? Gross.

LMFAO. What I think is gross is that you prioritise male hurty feels over female safety.

Here's him rearranging his "vagina" like all women do.

x.com/clownworld_/status/1819362202127679740?s=46&t=AjtjSItRj-kgZwRzL-pdyQ

Yawn.

x.com/FondOfBeetles/status/1374331296143581186

The World/Society hates women. The Olympics is just a spectacular demonstration of that fact.

Which sex do you think Khelif is?

🎯

Sadly this is the case. It's just a reflection of how things are.