to think these people in Sunderland are not "protesting".

[Misthios]

They are not protestors. They are not protesting. They are common or garden thugs and criminals who are causing criminal damage, setting police offices on fire and attacking police officers.

Total scumbags.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cnl0lkrxgvxo

In a democracy when are people given the opportunity to express those views?

True.

DELIBERATELY causing all the conflict

Whereas the last Labour government were just hapless;

19 July 2006

The 450,000 failed asylum seekers still in Britain

Home Secretary John Reid was plunged into another crisis as it emerged official figures have vastly underestimated the number still in the UK despite having their cases turned down.

Home Office officials had previously vigorously disputed National Audit Office estimates of 285,000 failed asylum seekers living in the UK. They put the figure at 235,000.

But a trawl through the mountain of boxes piled up in the IND yesterday revealed as many as 450,000 cases.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-396443/The-450-000-failed-asylum-seekers-Britain.html

(Most of the cases were from the early 2000s and they were 'set aside' so they wouldn't count in the stats).

There is plenty of injustice and inequality in this country, there is poverty and disadvantage and it affects all poor communities, whatever their ethnic makeup and regardless of immigration. Those wishing to paint the rioters this week as some sort of heroic successors to the Jarrow Lads are disingenuous in the extreme. During the Battle of Cable Street the non Jewish population of the East End rose in support of their Jewish neighbours, because they knew that those people were just as poor as them and not the cause of their plight and also that the Blackshirts were not the answer.

The answer is a united voice of black, brown, white people of whatever background pulling together and making their voices heard for change. This concept is absolutely not what those rioting this week want, and if Suella Braverman and Kemi Badenoch actually think they are seen by them any more favourably than the last Syrian to cross the Channel, they are deluded.

We know these riots have nothing to do with the murders of those poor little girls in Southport, they are being used, unforgivably, as an excuse. I don't find it a coincidence that Tommy Ten Names fled the country and his bail a few days ago and now look who is one of the biggest agitators in stirring up the situation this week?

Wycombe used to be quite a hotbed of skinheads, BNP recruiters were quite active in some of the pubs. It's also had it's own mini riots over the years due to racial tensions, although that was mainly between the Pakistani and Caribbean communities.

Starmer is using a trafficking policy that looks likely to fail

If he cannot do as he pledged this rioting will increase. He’s at risk of losing control of the situation

Reminds me of the 2011 riots across the UK.

Mindless thuggery achieving nothing.

She should be done for incitement

Someone on FB

"It's to help the little girls this happened to, what else can we do"

Me "give blood if you wanted to do something"

Response "????? WTF will that do?!"

probably more than smashing a vape shop window but you know, carry on

In fact I assume this story is a warning; we can find you and charge you. Which is good.

Labour have been in government for less than a month, so when will you decide he has delivered his pledge?

I’m mixed race and rarely mention as it seems irrelevant but I’m writing this to show I have a very invested interest and despise racism as have endured it.

The actual outcome of the election under PR would have had around 90 reform MP and around 30 Green MP. Now this genuinely terrifies me. It’s counter productive to be very gleeful that the Labour Party got in because if you really analyse the data it’s clear they are not as popular as people think it’s just that we have a first past the post system so yes they did win but it’s not all it seems.

So while everyone was self congratulatory when Labour got in beneath the surface and as much as we can despise the EDL and all right wing thuggery we have a perfect storm currently brewing. Because immigration issues were not sensibly debated and any mention has people shouted down as racist civil unrest was always going to happen.

Many people are guilty of all political hues of living in their own echo chambers, they often mix with people like them. I’m not talking race here though that can be an element I’m talking educational, political and socio economic categories. It’s why the world is a mess and because of social media extremists of all flavours can find each other more easily. I really cannot stand the extreme right but the extreme left who have shut down debate are really unhelpful.

Trust Clav to come in with a link dating back 18 years...

Absolutely, the extreme left are incredibly damaging too, it's a much needed point to make.

They have contributed to this idea that people haven't got a voice by imposing their own rules about language and expressing opinion on everyone else. They shut down anyone who offers even moderate, middle of the road views and are why many 'traditional' Labour voters no longer feel they have a true political voice.

Who are the extreme left and how have they shut down debate?

Thanks Pointythings, you beat me to it. clavinova suggesting that Labour in 2006 could have magically unraveled previous decades of Tory mis management which was either deliberate or 'accidental' because an incoming government like Labour NOW needs to examine the 'books' before it can really get to work and as it has always been the Tory way to 'privatise' or sell off UK assets with very poor terms for the taxpayer who simply loses assets that were at least reasonable beforehand. Labour has discovered it is looking at a 22 or 35 Billion 'black hole' in UK finances THEN will STILL be wrestling with other aspects the Tories have lied and covered up including the DETAILS of the Australia and Japanese trade deals that are still secret.

There's a lot of folk should be in trouble for incitement - I've seen Katie Hopkins tweet 'well done and carry on' with a list of planned 'events', Laurence Fox tweet we need to remove Islam from the U.K. and Farage being disingenuous with 'questions' on videos. I particularly think that MPs should be in trouble as it must be against some code of conduct. I have seen Lee Anderson attempting to stir up problems re a hotel possibly full of asylum seekers, though he had to backtrack as turns out it was an international nurse convention.
Notable these folk are not attending 'events' personally and even a well known agitator, who might be expected around, is on a sunbed in Spain.
Reasons why the rank and file of the protestors do this will be varied, but most won't even know a specific reason particularly - I saw one disaffected teen ramble on about Iraqi law that's actually ok in Iraq but not here, it might be here, but might not, but he doesn't want it here anyway. Two tier policing is the latest excuse I see - apparently stamping on folks' heads is letting 'them' get away with stuff. I also think some must be paid, at least expenses, as they are travelling in.
I feel I'm seeing some 80s football hooligans reliving youth, but yes a lot will often have difficult lives, and then choose to believe the lies of the agitators, who just live for such stuff. No excuses though for this behaviour at all.
I read once that nature dictates a country needs a big war every century at least (might have been half century) to burn off aggression- male aggression. I sometimes think that's true and we are not that 'civilised' really - though we should learn to be.
I am obviously appalled by the riots, and angry, but overwhelmingly very, very, very saddened that people behave like this to other people- I can't understand the hate despite having lived in both 'deprived very white areas' and 'deprived diverse areas' - as well as that there is a lot doesn't make much sense to me such as complaining immigration ruins places, but then literally trashing the place, not sure why they swastikas are worn by folk who love England at all.

It won’t really need a decision as we’ll see the outcome across the media covering riots and violence.

He is seeing that this summer but if he cannot do as planned and numbers increase next summer he’ll face mounting pressure ie tension and disorder

Are you saying the rioters are migrants?

Its just like old times. Happy days.

Agree sensible debate is never a bad thing if it reaches some sort of compromise/happy resolution. But frankly I don't think anyone can "debate sensibly" with thugs with the best will in the world.

Even with people who aren't thugs, you can't debate with them as we saw on here when the brexit ref came about. People close their eyes and ears if something doesn't fit the narrative. What do you suggest?

Next summer, 1 year then.

No one is more likely to laugh at Labour’s pathetic ‘announcements’ and ‘policies’ than me. And I have every confidence that this government will fail on immigration just as the last one did. But this is a bit silly.

Syrian and Afghan young men coming ashore at Dover do not create social problems that deserve any response of social disorder. The EDL would use any excuse for a punch up and a stolen pair of Nikes.

Enough time I’d say to work out if he can get rid of trafficking networks

He’s also responsible for now although will get more grace from some

Good luck then. You’ll see increasing disorder