To say vanity sizes should be rolled back?

[amoreoamicizia]

I bought some vintage St. Michael shorts this weekend in a size 12 which fitted me perfectly. In current sizes I'm an 8 or sometimes- incredibly- a 6 (looking at you, Boden).

As flattering as it is to think of myself as a size 8, it's simply not the truth or a reflection of reality. A small size 12 does seem about right, as that was my size as a slim-ish teenager in the 90s.

Who is this vanity sizing really helping? Who does it serve? Isn't it about time clothing manufacturers were held to account and forced to roll back sizes to what they were in the early 00s, at least?

I don't really get why people get their (teeny tiny) knickers in a twist over this to be honest. This is a regular thread on Mumsnet.

How big a problem is it really? Do we really think people who are overweight are so stupid they can't see it as long as the label on their clothes says an acceptable size?

I can't say I've seen much change in the last 20-30 years either. I was a size 10 as a slim youngster in the 90s and I'm a size 14 as an overweight middle aged woman who's about 2 stone heavier. That seems about right to me.

If I fit into a size 10 tomorrow I wouldn't suddenly believe I was thinner because I have eyeballs and a functioning brain.

Exactly! I’ve shrunk by four stone over tne past 18 months and nothing will take away my pleasure in being able to fit into (and zip up) a size 12/M jacket, vs struggling to lever myself into an XL! I’m proud of the weight I’ve lost and feeling the benefits on all levels. Comments like the one on here about size 12s are just plain nasty - even based on modern sizing a size 12 is in no way ‘large’.

Of course. How else will all the fatties who don't read the 21738 daily Mumsnet posts know how fat they are?

"Make stores use waist and leg length measurements for bottoms, perhaps waist and bust for tops, and do so accurately. Simple."

That would be impossible for stores like ASOS that add hundreds of new garments a day. And as someone with a large bust, the fabric and shaping means that two different garments with the same measurement in theory can fit very differently.

I always took two age sizes bigger in clothing as a child because I was taller than average, it didn't mean that I was pretending to be two years older, it was just the size that fitted. I love the idea that fat people don't know they're fat because they fit a specific size.

These are likely not at all accurate though, I tend to buy expensive jeans (AG, 7 for all mankind etc) and have for about 20 years (since I was 18). I am the same weight and my waist is in fact 28 inches and have since had a kid so unlikely to be thinner round the waist! In 2003 I was buying a size 28. Recently bought a pair. Size 25. Size 26s I could literally take off without unbuttoning.

i think vanity sizing isn’t great because people DO judge their health/weight by what size they wear and it’s easy to convince yourself that you’re still a size 12 so you can’t really be much different when in fact you’re tipped into an unhealthy weight range (realize plenty of people could be normal BMI as a 12, it puts me well into overweight).

Of course many shops have vanity mirrors too which must be effective in persuading us to buy.

Sizes from decades ago don’t mean anything to young women who weren’t around then though.
If shoe sizes had changed (which is also just an arbitrary number) would you think they should change them back because people might not realise that they have small/big feet by 20 years ago’s standards?

Sizes are bigger now just to reflect that every generation is bigger than the last. Not necessarily fatter but taller, broader stronger. There will always be outliers but this is mostly true. My grandmother was thought of as a giant in school. She always said how she hated being tall. She was 5ft 6. Fast forward to my daughter and she was called titch in school as at 5ft 8 she was the smallest of all her friends. None of my dds friends are overweight but they are definitely taller and broader than I or my friends were when we were at school. Sizing needs to reflect that. They work on averages. I do agree though that it's annoying when the sizes vary so much, they should be standardised. I've given up on Hush, their sizing is all over the place and you never know whether it will be too tight or big enough to fit 3 of you in!

Yes you are skinny in my book

I agree. Although I don't care so much about vanity sizing as such it's just that it should be consistent across the board. Couldn't give a shit if I'm an 8 or an 18 just be consistent. During lockdown I bought 3 pairs of New Look jeans, all the same style just in 3 different shades all allegedly size 10 yet they were all different sizes despite being labelled Size 10!

"i think vanity sizing isn’t great because people DO judge their health/weight by what size they wear and it’s easy to convince yourself that you’re still a size 12 so you can’t really be much different when in fact you’re tipped into an unhealthy weight range (realize plenty of people could be normal BMI as a 12, it puts me well into overweight)."

The reverse of this - people thinking they are incredibly overweight because they don't fit into a specific size. Like me as a teenager thinking I was horribly fat because I didn't know that clothes patterns/manufacturers assume you are a B-cup regardless of how many sizes you go up, and thinking the problem was my body and not the button-up shirt. Or me as an adult being underweight and not noticing because my actual pelvis didn't fit into anything smaller than a 14.

I'm 5'11 and 95kg. Size 16 normally.

I bought a cardigan in Uniqlo the other day, its quite boxy, on the loose size. It's a size S. Thought about getting a more fitted one in XS.

Not sure what the bloody hell slim women are supposed to do here! I think they have a right to be concerned, without all the clearly jealousy-fuelled venom directed at them on here.

In the 1970s a size 10 waist was 24 inches which was generous on teenage me and my friends. Now a 10 starts at 30.5 inches up to 32 inches. And that’s before shops start adding their own vanity premium.

This is one area where I think it would be really helpful to have a standard that all manufacturers had to keep to. Vanity sizing does people no good in helping them kid themselves they’re smaller/thinner than they are.

Perhaps they should dispense with numbers altogether and just have a range with labels that go from "Wow! You're so slim and gorgeous, everyone is sooo jealous" to "Don't delude yourself fatty" so everyone would know exactly where they stood.

It matters if you're buying online and end up with something far too big or small

A lot of it now is because fashions have changed, millennial fashion was very tight fitting, skinny jeans etc whereas now everything is supposed to look super loose, baggy, wide. So you're supposed to buy a 12 and it look huge on you, not buy a 12 and it looks tighter than it should because you're a 16.

In old money would this model be a size 12?

This vintage clothing size chart shows 28 inch which today is 10, is a 12

https://www.allaboutaudrey.co.uk/pages/size-guide-conversion-chart

I hate all the 'teeny tiny' sneering on here. People are all different shapes and and sizes so of course there are going to be people who are small and slim.

Nobody can do anything about their height or natural weight.

We’re not just broader/fatter, we’re also taller. Sizes are pretty much meaningless now, so just pick 2-3 sizes in the clothes you like and try them on. If you want everything to be the same size then they all need to be made in the same factories in the UK, and it’s too expensive to do that here now.

I'm also a size 16 but shorter than you. I haven't worn a small anything since I was pre-teen.

If a size small Uniqlo cardigan was too big for you, that would mean that it was supposed to be a loose fit, it's not proof that all women's clothing is so enormous that slim women are at risk of not being able to find clothes to wear.

I don't really care about what size is on the label, sizes are of course arbitrary on who first thought them up. What I do want is consistent sizing though between styles and stores and inches seem the simplest answer.

Oh c’mon. Surely people can see that vanity sizing sucks if you actually are a small framed woman. If a size 6 is just too big in most high street stores where are you meant to buy affordable clothes from?

I’m a 10-12!

@Sunsetcocktail well Id buy them from the teen range and save myself some VAT, Next jeans and vests etc are pretty much the same style but vastly different prices. Obviously work wear is about trickier and you are likely to look like you are off to school.