To feel angry at how few people make a plan for their own old age

[OptimismvsRealism]

We are all going to end up in a bad way unless we're lucky enough to drop down dead unexpectedly

Why do most people live in denial?

Shouldn’t we wait and see whether Labour will actually fill us in honestly about the shit show that will be the public finances ?

That's what you think! At any moment in time you could be incapacitated and people would be looking after you, whether you like it or not.

Have a plan for when you can't look after yourself. I don't accept "something will turn up" as a plan.

The problem is there isn't much to be done to 'have a plan for that, except to have several thousands of pounds in the bank to pay for care when you need it. What else is there?

Have a child? The OP seems to be a great example of why that's not a plan.
Make friends? What, younger, healthier friends so they can take care of you in old age? Who's going to want to be that friend?
Start a commune and hope you're one of the first to get infirm so the others can shoulder the work?

What is this magic plan the OP thinks can be made to provide care for yourself when you no longer can - if it's not money. Lots of money?

On the flip side, billions of people have got through old age before me. Some easier than others. Something always comes up - even if that something is death.

Agree. Best to plan ahead - doing things like downsizing, agreeing to outside help and de-cluttering are not just helpful for the elderly person, but an act of kindness to the middle aged daughter who will be obliged step in at some point. She has her own right to a life.

Why are you angry? Why do you care so much about other peopes business?
What effect will it have on you?
Will you be wiping their arses?

Downsizing is for middle class people. For those already in a terraced house, there is nowhere to downsize to. Decluttering is good for everyone to do from time to time.
The only real plan is have lots and lots of money. Everyone else will muddle through.

HFJ I think it can be a bit more complicated than that.

Euthanasia is no laughing matter. But before we get to worrying about bumping off our active elderlies before their time, maybe first we could discuss keeping people alive unnecessarily when they have no quality of life.

I mean people with dementia or other brain illnesses, who have no idea who they are or where they are. Fed by care staff tapping their mouths with a spoon to trigger the mouth opening reflex like a baby. Stuffed full of antibiotics for every infection. Keeping the body going long after the brain and soul checked out, like living ghosts. Who are they being kept alive for? Would you want to exist like that? I certainly wouldn’t. Mum used to say not either, so she has a DNAR in place and a sympathetic GP who didn’t disagree with me when I said I thought a good death is part of a good life. DB and I would rather she quietly faded away at home with palliative care for an infection than being kept going for as long as possible but not knowing who we are, dying with no dignity on a busy hospital ward. But for now she hangs on at home, still just about with us mentally, always one virus or fall away from a crisis.

But more and more people will be living longer and their care will need to be funded by the state.

Conversely, many people aren’t in a position to pay higher taxes to cover this as a lot are struggling to make ends meet already.

When people talk about their parents downsizing on MN, the places they are downsizing to, are what most of us would see as an upgrade. Sure if I had a large 6 bedroom victorian house I would downsize as I got older.

This whole thread is making me want to off myself.

Our In-laws downsized into an assisted living apartment after living in a large detached house in the middle of nowhere. The family thought they were vulnerable where they were. They have a bistro on site. Hospital, doctors and pharmacy within walking distance. They are now within easy access of all the family. Family members now come and visit them asking why they hadn't moved before now.

You are not wrong OP but its complicated. In 2010 (i think) the government tried to bring in auto enrolment because so few people were saving for their pension. Its always hard to see and get people interested in a complex and deferred benefit. Pensions do tend to be a really hard sell. They are also disorganised as people don't have one individual savings pot they can move around with them and manage they have separate workplace pensions to keep track of, which makes it harder for people. There is also some residual mistrust going on due to past scandals, which doesn't help. Pensions are necessary and safe financial products that can make your later years much easier and more enjoyable but they need to be made much much easier and better managed generally. Also some funds are crap and some pension providers charge too much in fees. I really hope it gets better for people because the state pension age will keep rising and its not going to be much so we all need to take personal responsibility for that top up. In 10 years plus i fully expect assisted dying to be the norm which will reduce the number of people claiming a state pension. I have no desire to live with pain and dementia. I have seen it and no thank you, not for me or DH.

@Tombero most people pay for carers to visit 4 times a day from a mixture of their pension and benefits. The other obvious thing to do is for governments to attach a charge to any house people own.

My advice - downsize, keep only the essentials and give your money away as soon as you can to those you love before it gets eaten up with care.

That isn’t necessarily great advice because you can get done for deprivation of assets.

@Tombero So my FIL paid for carers from his own money plus attendance allowance. That is normal these days. Not many people have to go into a home paid for the the state. The criteria is so high that it is mainly people with dementia in homes.

I have no desire to live with pain and dementia. I have seen it and no thank you, not for me or DH

trouble is, your brain changes to the point you don’t recognise the true nature of the situation. So while your relatives are worried about you coping, you think you’re fine and they’re fussing. Mum was quite happy wandering in the street in a stained nightie and couldn’t understand why neighbours would be worried at the change in this previously immaculate woman.

have a read of the Elderly Parents board, its full of similar tales.

My advice is have fun while you can. You have no idea what is around the corner.

I believe there should be a document completed to instruct medical teams and family etc to slowly withdraw from all medication except pain relief at a certain age or a certain stage of life. This would be like a DNR but done when a person has full mental capacity and is very clear, with legal status, like a will. I don't want to be a half life dependent on meds to keep me in that state. But family can't possibly do anything and medical staff will try to lengthen life at all costs. So something needs to be done to control end of life and it should come from the person themselves. Fwiw I think pharmaceutical companies are laughing all the way to the bank, the amount of meds the average 80 something is on is crazy.

Those places are really expensive though with massive service charges. Not everyone can afford that. My bog standard three bed semi wouldn't buy one, so not sure how I could downsize if and when the time comes?

Plus they are a nightmare for beneficiaries of wills as the charges still have to be paid when the occupants die and the property is waiting to sell.That can take a long time as people are beginning to realise they are a bit of a rip off.

This. Don't judge when you don't know people's circumstances, OP.

@Alalalalalongalalalalalonglonglilong medical staff do not try to lengthen life at all costs. They start by asking the person what they themselves want. My mother wanted no treatment, so they abided by her wishes.

Who are you to say your parents have lived longer than they should have?

Being single doesn't help.Some people can't afford to plan so stop judging and fight for a fairer family.

Fairer society I mean