To think LTB is not as simple...

[JustAnotherHappyFatty]

as it is often made out to be on here?
Just reading yet another thread with a completely useless husband and predictably most of the comments are along the lines of 'just LTB' and 'he will have to pay maintenance and have the kids 50/50 so you will get a rest'.
Firstly, how does anyone on here know how much maintenance the OP would be entitled to? In my case, taking into account my husbands earnings I would receive about £10pw....I couldn't feed the dogs with that amount! Other predictable comments include things like 'don't worry, you are entitled to half the equity in the house and his pension '. Great, we have about 20K in the house if we are lucky and he has less than 10K in a pension, I couldn't buy another property on my own and would soon burn through the equity trying to keep up with the extortionate rent on the three bed properties I would require to house my kids.
Secondly, why do people assume 'he will have to have the kids'. Plenty of Ex husbands don't have their kids overnight, never mind genuinely 50/50! As far as I am aware there is no way to force them to parent their children in the event of a separation from their mother, a lot of posters assume these men want to parent their children but if they are not doing it in the relative comfort of the marital home they are certainly not going to suddenly step up and do it alone.
AIBU to think that whilst posters mean well that their opinions come from a place of huge privilege (large amounts of equity in their property, high earning husbands with traceable funds from which they can take CM and reasonable husbands that would actually want to see their children in the event of separation)?
I don't want to leave my DH but I am acutely aware that I would be fucked if I did!

I think it does no harm to advise a daughter not to have children unless she really really wants them. And that remaining child free is a viable life choice.

I would go further than that. I think if theres one lesson for mothers to teach their daughters above all other lessons it’s that if they plan to have children they must be prepared to finance their upbringing single handed or they must remain childless.

A woman expecting to be able to rely on a man’s money to support her children is putting her children in jeopardy.

Women have previously posted about how they were so desperate to have children that they considered driving their cars into oncoming lorries.

I really don't think it's realistic to just say 'don't have kids unless your career is successful enough to go it alone.'

Just because you've had a bad experience doesn't mean that the majority of women don't have good experiences.

I agree. It took me years because there was always something stopping me from splitting up, despite him treating me appallingly and saying horrible things to our child. I thought I didn't have any support (I live a long way from family and don't have any close friends).

I split up with him last year after he said the worst things to our child and I snapped. I filed for divorce soon after. I had enough money to support myself by then (money being the main barrier to leaving him). I manage, I'm not doing well, but I have enough.

There's all kinds of reasons why it's hard to leave. It took me about six years, but even before that I thought I could work on my shit marriage because it was what was expected of me. He had always been EA, and it's not my fault. It takes time to realise that.

I really don't think it's realistic to just say 'don't have kids unless your career is successful enough to go it alone.'

Sorry but no one has an automatic entitlement to have children. If you want them that much you need to be able to ensure that you can protect them from neglect and abuse and that means supporting them yourself if push comes to shove.

its the same when people post about issues with family and people jump in with comments to “go no contact”. I don’t understand what world these people live in where you can so easily remove entire family members from your life.

If leaving is not a practical option due to finances, then pushing back hard must be the strategy - unless that would be dangerous. If I was married to a bloke like some of these I would basically punish him. No washing his clothes, no food he likes bought, no effort made with regard to his side of the family.

I am aware that I could do this because I was brought up to not take crap from anyone - if you’ve had parents who haven’t instilled this in you it will be harder. But I have two friends who tried this approach when the pleading for ‘help’ had not worked. In both cases there was some improvement- basically, both were prepared to push the nuclear button. ‘Talk to me like that one more time and I am not doing anything about Christmas for your family…’ - and they held their line. One told me that she had to be careful to deliver the warnings/bollockings when the DC were not around, which isn’t always easy, but her H did respond more or less as she wanted. Basically she kicked his arse and he knew she meant it.

So if divorce/leaving is not feasible, then there needs to be another response, not just acceptance of his crap attitude

@Maray1967

If I I was married to a bloke like some of these I would basically punish him. No washing his clothes, no food he likes bought, no effort made with regard to his side of the family.

Great but that just makes it everyone else’s problem by creating an atmosphere of toxicity and passive aggression. The children pick up on this and feel confused and upset and the family gets roped in. And still you’re not really in control. You’re constantly reacting to someone else.

The only effective way to deal with this is to remove yourself once and for all. There are no half measures.

I suppose it depends on the bloke. In my friends’ cases, it pulled them up. There was an initial bollocking, delivered when the DC were not in the house, and then some unpleasant convos late at night, but no shouting. Basically they trained their H to realise that things needed to change or their life would be less easy.

I agree that it’s not ideal and leaving would be better in many respects, but money was a serious issue for them both and they addressed the behaviour this way instead. In one case I think she’s biding her time and will probably leave when the kids are adults.

@Maray1967

I agree that lots of people live like this and some probably muddle through.

I can’t imagine anything worse personally. I would feel so trapped.

So much better not to put yourself in this position in the first place.

I completely agree! When you've spent over half your life with someone, have kids and a mortgage, unfortunately it's not as easy as 'just leave him'.

@Okbyethen

But no one is saying it’s easy. It’s very hard but it’s usually the best course of action.

It may not always be external factors that lead people to stay in situations that are clearly wrong. Sometimes, even when it is so obvious to others that we should LTB and take the children away from the context, there can be very complex reasons why this does not happen.

It may be that the children love their father and would elect to stay with him (or that we believe this is so). It could be the fact that leaving the B would also mean we had to leave work because childcare, especially with SEN children is so difficult to find. This could lead to visions of poverty remembered from our own childhood. It could be that we are convinced we can find a compromise: a job closer to home, residential care for at least one of the children, a respite to the B's mental illness.

People come onto these boards and post, often knowing the answer, often wanting validation for their own feelings. Yet, there is usually a reason why the individual has not left the B before they post.

So, yes LTB is often much harder than we think, and I agree, if we do not have adequate resources to support our families independently, it is often very much harder than many people realise.

Of course it’s realistic.

I’m also not sure that the majority of women do have good experiences.

Yes, and I think that’s why a middle way - neither leaving nor just accepting the status quo - is an option that works for some. Probably a lot depends on the bloke - if he’s seriously unpleasant and never likely to change, then it probably won’t work. But if he’s a casual swearer and lazy arse and selfish, he might respond to ‘changing circumstances’. One of my friends used Christmas as a threat and carried it forward. He found out on Christmas Eve that there were no gifts for his parents as she’d told him there wouldn’t be. She made it clear that there would be no birthday or Mother’s Day gifts either if he didn’t change.

You're right OP. LTB carries risks, just as staying does. Each person has to weigh these up. I chose to LTB, but that meant zero financial support from ex, and DS had/has no relationship with his bio-dad (BD's decision).
Tax credits and practical support from my DM made all the difference, I was lucky to have those, not sure how I would have managed otherwise. On the other hand the relationship was abusive and becoming violent, so absolutely I did need to leave.

This is what a lot of women feel as the Ex H is so bloody useless!

And mother's of sons should teach them that if they choose to father a child with a woman then they should be prepared to take a half share in parenting and paying for that child into adulthood.

A lot of the issues on the MN boards are caused by men not stepping up and taking responsibility.
We need the next generation of men to do better.

Agreed as the mother of a son. If my DS ever ends up as a divorced father I'll be on his back to be doing 50/50.

I tell my daughter (who does want to get married and have kids one day) that the number one thing she can do for herself is to marry an equal who understands that. Not a richer man who says we'll economically you should stay home and mind the kids and ill sail forth, climbing the ladder.

It’s the costs
it’s very very expensive
lawyers exist to rip you off
don’t expect help from anyone or the government
easiest option is to never get involved with a man in the first place
this world exists for them and they have been told since birth that they are superior and entitled to everything. If you’re male and white you’ve won the life lottery.