To think there's going to be a Civil War in America

[LaurieFairyCake]

I mean, they're fucked aren't they

Now that Trump isn't getting prosecuted after today for the January 6th atrocities

And Biden 🤦‍♀️ - they might replace him

It's so awful - so terribly polarised

I think it's a real possibility

Of course I saw it on the news as it was unfolding. It was horrific.

You are just completely ignoring my question, though. Why did they open the doors and let anyone in? Why are you unwilling to think about that?

I’m still waiting to hear more about the Stalinist Purges. That sounds exciting…

Oh dear. I think another poster has missed that Putin invaded Ukraine in 2014.

Putin seems to have found Trump putty in his hands. Senior Republicans – including Lindsay Graham and Paul Ryan – had to remind Trump that Putin was not the US's best friend.

( I nearly typed, "was not Trump's best friend", but realised, actually Trump might think he is.)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-44852812

In fact, I wonder where Trump got the idea of abusing his office by trying to withhold military aid from Ukraine unless Ukraine helped him with his personal re-election attempt? Do you think he came up with it himself? Or was he "helped" to that idea?

Who do you think was President in 2014?

Appreciate this comment wasn't aimed at me but I honestly just think security at the Capitol was lax. And to be clear, as some of the tin foil hatted on this thread seem confused (I don't engage with them directly though, because it would be like talking with Joe Biden; one of them even seems to think that Putin's annexation of Crimea is a little known historical fact that only they know about) - Capitol security is the job of the Speaker.

Pelosi is on film acknowledging that she should have called in the National Guard immediately when Trump ordered her to, not leave it a few more hours because she thought they had 'sufficient resources'.

I live in the US and honestly, the hyperbole on this thread is laughable.

To respond to the original statement, no, I don’t think that there’s going to a Civil War in America. There may be protests and demonstrations after the election (regardless of who wins), but not a war.

They also seem to think Trump was President in 2014. And know nothing about the shenanigans Biden pulled with Ukraine on behalf of Hunter with respect to Burisma. Let’s not even talk about Hillary and Ukraine and the plutonium. Or Obama caught on hot mic telling Putin he’d have more leeway after his election to 2nd term.

Yes, the Sergeant at Arms reports to the speaker and gave his resignation to Pelosi.
In the shadow of the riots and occupations going on all over the US at that time, it was stunning that they were not prepared for what happened.

As I thought.

Just won't engage with the fact that Trump directed the insurrectionists to go to the Capitol and try to prevent the votes being counted.

I wonder why not?

By the way, since you have such fetish about entries, here's film at the time, showing insurrectionists outside the Capitol breaking windows to get into the Capitol. That's how those people got in.

https://edition.cnn.com/videos/politics/2021/01/06/jim-himes-inside-washington-dc-protest-congress-electoral-college-vpx.cnn

It also includes incredibly brave lines of officers outside, trying to prevent insurrectionists reaching the building in the first place.

GiveMeSpanakopita · Today 15:52

I have never thought it was a coincidence that Putin started fucking around in Ukraine once Biden was in power. He's been wanting and saying he's going to do it since the early 00s. He didn't just wake up and decide to do it - he was waiting for the right timing.

Would you like to adjust your statement, now you that you've noticed Putin invaded in 2014?

(Yes, thank you, I also know Trump wasn't president in 2014. Never said he was.)

Or would you just like to jump straight to talking about why Trump told his supporters to prevent the counting of the states' electoral votes?

I’m happy to address one issue at a time. You are the one avoiding my questions.

And with the word fetish and your entire attitude it’s clear that you have no interest in true engagement. You can just take this as a win and move on, ok? In your head you can think you’ve proved some point.

@GiveMeSpanakopita You have it right. One day I’ll learn.

Trump and his team planned to take the crowd to the Capitol in advance, as I'm sure you know.

From the Congressional report into the January 6 attack

The “Stop the Steal” coalition was aware of the President’s intent. On January 5th, Ali Alexander sent a text to a journalist saying: “Ellipse then US capitol [sic]. Trump is supposed to order us to the capitol [sic] at the end of his speech but we will see.” 428
6.14 “WELL, I SHOULD WALK WITH THE PEOPLE.”
President Trump wanted to personally accompany his supporters on the march from the Ellipse to the U.S. Capitol. During a January 4th meeting with staffers and event organizer Katrina Pierson, President Trump emphasized his desire to march with his supporters.429 “Well, I should walk with the people,” Pierson recalled President Trump saying.

https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/GPO-J6-REPORT/html-submitted/ch6.html

Really there's no point. You'd have a better and more intellectually stimulating debate with my elderly springer spaniel. He could probably knock Joe Biden into the middle of next week in debate, and he doesn't even speak human.

🤣 my pup would fit right in here. She’s quite smart but completely unreasonable.

🤣🤣🤣🤣

Let me help you @PerkingFaintly

They didn't "open the doors" this has been fact checked.

The doors were forced open by a mob and at some point some officers stood back and let them for their safety.

You aren't telling the truth.

There's something important to learn from the attack on the Capitol. (Well, many things, but I think this one is important right now.)

Trump team plan wasn't to stand in the chamber. hold a gun at Pence's head and say, "Declare this number of votes to be X, when we've just heard from the electors that it is Y."

It was much more subtle than that.

The plan was to bring fake electors with fraudulent certificates from the states, claiming that Trump had won in those states. They planned to hand Pence the fraudulent certificates and hoped he would certify these certificates, rather than the genuine ones.

It's all about adding a veneer of legality after the violence and threats – so that anyone who is not up in the details might think, oh well, bit disappointing, but nothing to see here.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump_fake_electors_plot

I have to say, though I'm sure he didn't come up with on his own, it's very Trump!

Very much in the same style as the things he's been found by courts to have done, eg inflating the value of property, falsifying business records re hush money paid to an adult film star, ripping off punters with Trump University.

There have been two congressional (under a Republican controlled congress) investigations into Biden and Ukraine ( and more) which have found nothing.

Maybe facts really do elude you.

So far though this thread has been totally entertaining. I needed this, this week 🙂

What qualifications do you believe Hunter Biden possesses that made him an attractive candidate for the position of board member of a Ukrainian Energy company?

This is a logic test.

People have been charged with the fake-elector plot.

Kenneth Chesebro, the architect of it, pleaded guilty to the conspiracy in Georgia, and (at 2023) was co-operating with the investigations in other states.

edition.cnn.com/2023/12/08/politics/kenneth-chesebro-cooperating-multiple-investigations/index.html

It is entertaining, isn’t it?

That doesn't mean anything illegal happened, and Hunter Biden was never in government.

Hunter Biden has also been a management consultant, lobbyist and other things for a long while.

You have to prove illegal behaviour went on. 2 investigations over 4 years, have brought up a tax issue and gun charge.

Wow.

While we're at it , why did Jared Kushner, Trump's son in law an middle east envoy get a 2bn investment from the Saudis just after he left office?

That's more worth investigation.

But you won't like the outcome.

The reason I mention all this, is because, as with all good scams, the trappings of legality and process were used for the fake elector scheme wherever possible. Insert a few falsehoods at key points, and it all looks peachy on the outside.

So they planned to having the fake electors meet in state Capitols on the correct date, and cast ballots (but false ones) and sign certificates (but fraudulent ones).

By the end it wasn't a small number of people involved in this conspiracy. That in itself is worrying. It's unlikely most people who knew about the conspiracy will end up jailed for it, so those folk haven't gone anywhere.

I expect to see more of this sort of behaviour in the future. Unfortunately.