Staying at home with kids IS a contribution and it is also WORK

[carshaker]

A lot of people don't respect a mum who's ' just at home '. Like she's not really contributing to the family.

The reality is though, that it's very much a big contribution, even if it's not financial.

If you took away the financial risk of staying home long term, what's the issue with it? Why is it considered by many ( especially women ), less than ?

If this is a woman's choice, what's the issue ?

Agree with you 100 percent. I feel the same

Lol. New here?

SAHM are constantly undermined on MN.

I never understand that viewpoint at all. Being in my own home, on my own schedule with my own children is hard at times but a privilege.. Working when you have to come home and make a start on tea/cleaning/shopping/homework and catch up with your children is hard.

I tried working once I couldn’t cope I found it hugely stressful and it made me unwell (I have multiple conditions including ASD and ADHD) so I gave up. Didn’t have much of a plan but at that point when you had a child it was IS and no need to work till child was 12. So I got by that way for a bit . I had more dc and I know a lot people who know me pity me now as my dc have SEN but quietly I feel relieved as the fact I get carers as they have extremely long dla/pip awards means I don’t have to worry and claim pip for myself and I can keep myself well by not working and being a SAHP to them.

There are so many situations in which being a SAHP is beneficial for a family. Equally so some families want or need both parents working . It’s wrong to force it either way, i think it’s unfair to force people to work when their dc are 3 - leave it till they are settled in reception, if that’s what the family want or have there childcare schemes available if they want to work. It seems acceptable to force people to use childcare under 5 but can you imagine if UC told women they HAD to stay home till dc age 5 !!! That wouldn’t be tolerated so both need to be an equal choice and equally supported still that time . Before 5 actually working is more of a burden on resources as childcare is extortionate ! Those who stay home are contributing in that way alone!

Also, by not working, some women really do enable their partner to have an extremely successful career.

Wow I can’t believe in this day and age people actually think this and think it’s a positive thing. I would feel like I had failed as a mother if my daughter grew up to feel her only contribution in life is to be an enabler for a man

Why do you assume these things? I have both financial independence and the exact same contributions to both my pension and savings accounts during my time as a SAHM. Wouldn’t have had it any other way.

And you didn’t do both - unless you are about to reveal that you worked from home while simultaneously caring for your pre-school children (and that can hardly be considered ideal).

It is a contribution, it is not work. I was fortunate enough to be able to do it for a couple of years, and no, it really isn’t work.

Maybe with more than two children or a child with SEN then it could be as demanding as most jobs but having one baby at home or being a SAHM to school age children is a luxury. It’s a luxury for the whole family and it’s a perfectly valid thing to do, but it’s not something that deserves respect above and beyond the respect any human being deserves.

I think it's a huge contribution and I don't think anyone should look down on stay at home mums. It's so much more than taking care of the kids - you basically do everything involved in running the house.
I did it for 7 years and it was hard work!

I was a sahm and I have learned very quickly that I can't say this now I'm back at work.
It's judged, it's triggering for other women,it's highly emotive and charged.

The moment I've said it when asked about my past what I've been doing or which nursery my dc went too it's been instantly met with "well I /this that and the other in a very defensive way".

The thing is the assumption is that women who work aren’t also doing the cleaning, cooking, laundry, dentists appointments, school runs etc.

There is nothing wrong with being a SAHM. Good for you if that’s what you choose. But if you want to view that as a full time job, you have to bear in mind that the majority of women who work are doing your “job” in addition to a paid job so may take umbrage at the implication that being a SAHM is as much work.

@TinyYellow that's not for you to judge 😂.
People have a billion difference in factors that mean they will find their experience gruelling or easier.

I have no judgement either way to be honest.
Whilst my husband was in the house, it didn't make sense for me to be out of the house.
Just shy of £3200 a month childcare.
Working 12-14 hour days, being disabled too would mean I wouldn't be able to come home, cook, clean, and get the kids sorted out. My Ex was no use. Couldn't cook, wouldn't clean, and wouldn't help the kids, and chose to be out most of the time.

Since we split, I've had to go back to work, because I don't want to be reliant on benefits, so the kids childcare is bulk of my take home wage.
Child maintenance pays my rent and there isn't much left for other stuff.
If I could I'd pay for a cleaner because I know I'll be burnt out quite quickly.
Middle DS is likely autistic- really having struggles at the moment. He doesn't go to sleep until gone 10pm and wakes twice in the night still.

I do take issue with the fact that I am paying most of my wages for someone to take care of my kids, which I'd prefer to be doing, but society would lambast me if I wasn't out and working.

I think what tends to happen is some people see implied criticism of their own choice just by someone else making a different choice so they get snippy.

Truth is there's really no need. Doing what you feel is best for your situation is not in itself a criticism of some other family doing what they feel is best for theirs.

There's absolutely no need for people to get defensive.

Apart from anything else - who actually gives a flying fuck what randoms think of how you choose to organise your family and the roles you agree to take?

For me, the domestic labour vs economic labour argument is not really the issue. The problem is not whether women or men are better at or better suited to one or the other, but that society in general respects economic work more because of the intersection of capitalism and patriarchy, as evidenced by some of these replies. There is nothing inherently unequal in a sex based division of labour, but there is huge inequality when society values one over the other.
As a young woman I definitely was of the opinion that women/I should never be SAHM. It's only as I've got older that I have realised that the feminism of the time (and my opinions) were actually chauvinistic. Disrespecting traditionally female roles precisely because women do them. Motherhood, being a SAHM and caring roles have all been undervalued for a long time. And as traditionally female roles, even when caring is economic labour - for either children, the elderly or disabled people - they’re amongst the lowest paid jobs available.
Conversely, when a male performs basic parenting, we’re all expected to bow down to the Prince among men.

I worked partime as a teacher when my kids were little and used to find my days at home harder than work 😂, but I did love every minute.
We have now got to an age when we are looking at pensions. My husband has 4x my pension (I worked part time for 11 years, while he was in a well paid job and got promotions); which is great if he lives a long life, but he is older than me and my pension is shocking, so I will be skint if he goes first.

I think for a lot of people attack is the first form of defence. See it on threads on here all the time, it’s a bit depressing really. Why can’t we just get on with our own lives without bashing everyone else that dares to do things differently?!

I think it's down to the individual & their circumstances with how things work best for their family. There is no right or wrong. I used to work full time in an office, then we had 2 children (3 year age gap), I reduced my hours & worked PT, - husband has always been the main earner & now has his own company so we decided financially it would make sense for me to reduce my hours, so i worked 22.5 hours a week over 5 days, but the cost of nursery fees was more than what I was earning, (& I was also bringing work home to do on an evening), so we decided it would be better & make more sense if I left my job & stayed at home with our children. I did that for 8 years, loved every second of it. I then got a PT office job & have been working 18 hours a week over three days for the last few years which works for us. Everyone's circumstances are different, & what works for one, doesn't work for another. I loved being at home & able to do school runs, assemblies etc, I joined the PTA & volunteered at school in the classrooms to keep myself busy- it also helped that I could add that to my CV when the time came!

Life is much easier for everyone if they have another adult doing all the behind the scenes things , like life admin, cooking, cleaning, being available for the children without having to juggle commitments.

If being a sahp is so easy, why did so many people ( especially the ones who were furloughed) struggle with being at home with their families 24/7 during lockdown?

I actually genuinely agree with you that ideally it's better for a pre-school child to be at home with a parent (even though I wasnt).

But it's more complicated than that and there is a bigger picture. If someone has 5 years out of the workplace they are generally going to find it harder to get back into the workplace at a level of decent pay. They may be left with a choice of a part time role (mostly poorly paid unless negotiated down from full time) or a full time role where the children then have to have after-school care (which they will be very aware of at school age...they won't remember anything before that although of course that doesn't mean it hasnt made an impact).

I am the opposite way around to you. I have worked full time until school age, got myself into a better paid and flexible role and have cut down hours to do school pickups. I would never have been able to do this the other way around. It's more important to me to be there after school when DS is old enough to appreciate it than to have been there when he doesn't remember. That still doesn't mean my way is the right way of course and I stand by my first para in an ideal world. I'm also aware that going part time has now impacted my DS's future financially so there would also be merit in remaining full time. And arguments for staying at home full time forever!...

...I just think this illustrates that the whole issue is complex.

@TheKoalaWhoCould I do both now I've been working for nearly 7 years and I can assure you it's easier than being with small dc, day in and day out.

But again each persons experience will be different because of different factors. Unfortunately unless you have been at that rock face day in and day out with no break, caring every moment it's hard to understand what it's like.
Many friends have considered going to work and being with adults a nice break. Not my friend whose a nurse of course. It's all variable.

Only if she couldn’t earn more than childcare costs. A lot of women earn more than that. Even during the nursery years. And once the children reach primary, childcare costs are very low.

I have been SAHW, SAHM, working 3 days a week and working full time. I loved being at home, but apart from the childcare aspect, you don’t have more housework/ life admin to do than women who work. So women claiming they are « a cook, a PA, a cleaner, etc » are a bit ridiculous IMO, everybody has to do it!

Honestly why does anyone care what others think? I don't get alot of the arguments either way.

What do you mean people don't respect sahp? Who needs respect for being a parent outside their own home?

I don't expect respect from other people because I work and am a single parent.

I do dislike the 'sahp enable the working parents career' because it's often incorrect. It's mad life easier while one climbs the ladder but hasn't enabled it.

But then there's plenty I disagree with said about the benefits of being a working parent.

My career took off as a single parent. I definitely didn't need a sahp to facilitate it.

And all decent parents are on duty 24 hours a day. If someone is a sahp and their partner never does early mornings or night feeds, even when off, that's a problem with that parent.

And plenty of sahp still use nursery especially when free hours kick in. If working parents aren't 'on duty' 24 hours, neither are sahp who send kids to nursery or school.

People should just do what suits them and their family and stop looking for validation from people who don't really matter.

I think working mother guilt is still very much a thing. Not saying it should be, I just think it is.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. In general:

Working mums get a raw deal compared to working dads.

SAHMs get a raw deal compared to SAHDs.

When women go back to work from maternity leave, there should be a law in place that men have to step up for a period of 2 months and do ALL the childcare and household stuff at home to give women a chance to adapt back into their roles. There are too many women who end up running around like headless chickens trying to square circles. Of course some then can't cope and end up stepping back for a bit.

And people should remember that having a SAHP is an incredibly cheap form of childcare/household help for working parents. 24/7 cover, PA services included and minimal costs compared to a nanny/nursery and a cleaner.

I really don't think working mothers should feel guilty ever. Neither should stay at home mums.