Anyone else wobbling about voting Labour?

[MaryMaryVeryContrary]

I desperately want to GTTO but the last few years have taught me that ‘any change’ isn’t always good and things can get worse, even if you think they can’t.

I’ve watched all the debates now and Starmer is so… wet. I don’t like him. The first thing he did when women’s rights were mentioned his first thought was men who ‘identify as women’ and how ‘marginalised’ they are. When asked about immigration he squirmed and squirmed before muttering about his role as DPP (who cares? We want to know what you plan to do NOW). When asked about his support for Corbyn he said ‘but I didn’t think we would actually win..’

There’s something about him which is making me very uncomfortable and I just have a bad feeling now about what would happen if he was leader.

Anyone else? If you’re not voting Tory or Labour, who are you voting for and why? I assumed I would vote Labour this time but my gut is suddenly screaming at me not to!

You do realise that by voting for your constituency MP, you are also voting for which party gets to form a government by virtue of having the most MPs, and the leader of that party will be Prime Minister? Such a silly and disingenuous comment.

@Greenismyfav - ignorant or purposeful? You already had it pointed out to you where it was “insccurate”.

Bur say you stick by your post, what is your source?

YESSSSSSSS! That's it. Thank you! 😆

And yes, what I meant was not that he’d written the legislation but as a legal person he’d know which words were important and why, and which words he’d choose to use. He didn’t just miss out the key word ‘biological’ by accident, did he? If he’d said ‘biological’ JK Rowling would have voted for him and endorsed his party. But he didn’t so she voted for an independent candidate and urged others to do likewise, which I am.

Same.

I really hate to say this...but I agree with you. I don't like Streeting. There is something about him that is not quite right.

Ffs, what has Starmer done so wrong that you think enabling another Tory government is worth the risk!
Do you want an NHS, properly funded schools and public services, etc etc or are you happy with more of these corrupt bunch? If you don’t vote Labour please don’t moan if this lot get back in.
The polls were wrong in 1992, 2010 and 2015.
Brexit happened because everyone thought everyone else was voting remain!
people need to get their heads a wobble!

As I explained above, I'd be happy with SKS as PM and our local LibDem candidate, but that isn't an option. I'd prefer a strong Tory opposition, preferably with Sunak still leader, to the libdems who, collectively, are a collective of fruit cakes. But I don't want our current Tory MP re-elected. Nor do I want a 26 year old rewilding expert elected as my representative, given that our business is largely based on 1950s tech and basic physics.

Glad we have found common ground!

This! What a joke. Why did I open this thread

Nope. I have no qualms at all in voting Labour. I’d be as happy voting Lib Dem, but don’t want to split the vote and risk the Tory slithering back in.

Interesting framing. It’s not about ‘trans people’ (what does that even mean - the infinitesimally rare people with gender dysphoria, autogynephiles? No one is actually born into a wrong body) being ‘put in their place’.

It’s about the most basic and fundamental rights for women and girls. The right to single sex rape and domestic violence shelters. The right for my friend’s severely disabled, non-verbal daughter to have same sex intimate care (by which I mean having tampons changed).

When did the world start to revolve around the wants of ‘trans’ people? Particularly the male ones?

Yeah cos voting for the twat who represents us - an entire REMAIN constituency- who is fervently behind the stupidity that is BREXIT works SO well.

they DONT represent us, they’re only interested in themselves and lining their mates pockets

and people are voting for the PM somehow, it doesn’t matter what they say at local level i they belong to the opposition. You’re voting for the manifesto, the person who works into the leader.

But isn’t Rayner to the far left? She also has a lot of support in the Labour Party which surely indicates that there are others who agree with her far left stance?

It’s certainly better than believing men can grow a cervix and women who disagree are ‘rights-hoarding dinosaurs’ (Lammy)

’Babies are born without a sex’ (Butler)

Male rapists pretending to be women should be in female prisons (Long-Bailey)

A virulent form of lunacy has taken over the Labour Party. If they were saying this mad shit about any other group of people no one would vote for them. But when it’s only women and girls - think of the NHS!

Labour have no chance in our area, the LibDem woman has run women’s shelters and is passionate about safety for women, postal vote has been cast already- it was a no brainer for me. Whether it’s enough, time will tell.

But will Labour sort out the NHS, schools, public services? Where is the money coming from? There’s only so much he can squeeze out of the high earners, then what? Already hearing excuses that it might take years to sort things out. I recall this was the excuse used by Labour a decade after the Thatcher years. Starmer is being given a chance to return things around, but people aren’t going to sit around for years waiting for his vision to become reality. It was only a couple of years ago when people were saying Labour were unelectable, and would never get in again. They have this chance now, not because people trust them, but because the Tories are in such a mess that Labour are the only real alternative we have unfortunately.

Has she been asked about how her passion re safety for women sits against her party's policy of allowing male-bodied trans women into female-only spaces?

This is the real kicker for me. No matter how great a local MP is, ultimately it's their party's policies that will matter. And Lib Dems are absolutely dogshit when it comes to women's safety and women's rights.

She’s to the left of Starmer, but not exactly a Corbynite (and has been pretty critical of Corbyn, refused to sign Momentum’s “loyalty pledge” and was scathing of Momentum’s efforts to purge centre-left Labour MPs).

She places herself as being on the “soft left”.

So who else do you think will be able to sort those things out any more quickly in our current financial situation, and how?

Frankly, I think they will have to put taxes up, but I understand why they can't say so outright. One thing is for certain, the party that added £13K to everyone's tax bill while in power is not the one that is going to achieve that.

You've cherry-picked three quotes from individuals whilst ignoring the fact that the party's leader has said repeatedly that they will not be allowing male-born people into women's safe spaces or to take part in women's sports; and that he has pledged to bring down radically the levels of violence against women and girls - and has a track record for achieving that in his previous career.

Meanwhile, you don't mention the fact that the Conservatives have done fuck all to protect women's interests, and have in fact damaged them significantly in numerous respects. Why?

I was 100% opposed to Brexit. This was partly because I do not believe in voting for things which take things away from people, pits people against others and makes no logical sense. I was proved right. Brexit has cost us more money than we would ever have saved from not being in the EU.

I also hate cute war shit and I equate Brexit with the beginning of American style culture wars.

Therefore although I despise the Tory’s for giving us Brexit, I am hesitant to vote for Labour due to VAT on private schools for the same reasons as above. It will end up costing more than its proposed to save, and feels culture war based on what I’ve seen on here. I want policies based on raising all boats. I was hoping divisive policies would end with the Tories but now I’m scared it will continue and I hate it. I want the country to start to feel positive.

I don’t want it to be like this anymore. I’m considering voting Lib Dem this time around. I just want an end to ‘football team’ politics.

You seriously believe the conservatives prioritise women and girls? Why then do they want to attack benefits, which more women are dependent on? Why have they allowed child poverty to reach such horrendous levels, bearing in mind again that this particularly impacts on single mothers? Why did they relax the gender recognition laws? Why is social care in such a mess, when the burden of providing care falls on women so disproportionately? Why has provision for SEN deteriorated so badly, when the consequence so often is that women have to give up work to care for disabled children? Why have they allowed maternity and gynaecological care to get so dire?

As you're so concerned about the economy, who do you imagine is responsible for its current dreadful state?

We're a Labour safe seat, I am a bit worried about the amount of absolute knuckle dragger Reform voters that are always pushing Reform in our local community group on FB lately and the replies to them.
(NOT saying that all Reform voters are like that, just a lot are!)

Nigel Farage is a very clever politician who knows how to appeal to people who know little about politics. Many people who will vote for him, would be surprised by their actual policies.